Cataclysm Beta - Build 12479 (Updated x3)

The talent trees... I love them so much! T___T

Let's see, if I were a developer, how would I tackle the new design idea just announced last week?

I think I'd start by seeing which talents weren't taken and deleting them
Then I'd see which talents were passive and mandatory and see how they could be baked into the specialization itself in a way that's equivalent across all classes and specs.

After that, I'd patch it into the game and see how it worked.... maybe call it a "Testing Phase" or something...

You know, just to get a feel for how the new system worked at its most bare bones level. Gotta make sure it works stripped down before you start making tweaks and additions and building it back up.

That way I could get a good idea of how old abilities should be adjusted to best accommodate the new model and fit the streamlined toolkit as well as what holes there were so that I'd a basis to work off of to design new abilities for the class.

I love the new changes cant w8 to try them. Especially the shaman ones.
Most of the comments here are showing that 80% of the ppl here have limited thinking








...If you want to make enemies. try changing something.

Originally Posted by Sonoka

You must be kidding. In todays trees there is more options, but no1 is even using them.
So why keep them? I like this, and there is alot new stuff for some classes, and more to come.
Maybe not active talents, but new "semi-passive", like.. extra attack, or do that and you also do that kinda thing.
"Less to no choice".. and, also.. first BETA-build. Why complaing?
It's BETTER than the previous trees.

Also, people that likes it say what is better. But all people that dislikes it say is "less choice", end of story.
Please EXPLAIN why they are bad instead, and try to not fit it into 1 sentance like you have now.

EDIT: @DrJones

1. there lots of people using slightly alternate versions of builds. I could easily do 4 or 5 pve elemental builds that are doing same damage but have different kinds of utility/survivability

2. Why complaining? Because if people dont complain, they cant expect Bizzard to change anything. I dont think rants make any difference, but actual complaining with feedback is absolutely needed if you want to have something changed.

3. They are bad, because
A; there are tons of passive +% talents, even tho those were supposed to be gone
B; you have to spend points on useless talents just to get to next tier or the tree
C; you are locked to 31 points to the tree, basically killing ANY sort of hybrid build, not even 30/11
D; final talent of the tree is total lackluster
E; the tree doesnt change your rotation/priority system (from not having spent single point in the tree and having 31+ in a tree) at all
F; doesnt change your gamestyle from LK at all
G; more than one of the above.

Im sure I could come up with more, but I think 6 reasons is good enough?

Sonoka how old are you and why is that your posts don't make any sense ? Are you trolling ?

In todays trees there is more options, but no1 is even using them.

really ? I think you are terribly wrong. Having choices is soooooo 2009. Now just turn that brain off and pick your tree already.

Hmm, Maybe this is already known, but for the mage arcane talent: Improved point the first point increases your speed to 70% then the second point reduces the speed to 35%.. Thinking things got alittle switched around there.

I read on the cataclysm beta forums that there are new party frames, pics please!

I read on the cataclysm beta forums that there are changes to the party interface, pics please!

I thought the tol'vir were going to be cat people

also, http://db.mmo-champion.com/s/84340/v...ium-blastpack/ HELL YEAH, new seaforium charge

Originally Posted by Sarevokcz

1. there lots of people using slightly alternate versions of builds. I could easily do 4 or 5 pve elemental builds that are doing same damage but have different kinds of utility/survivability

2. Why complaining? Because if people dont complain, they cant expect Bizzard to change anything. I dont think rants make any difference, but actual complaining with feedback is absolutely needed if you want to have something changed.

3. They are bad, because
A; there are tons of passive +% talents, even tho those were supposed to be gone
B; you have to spend points on useless talents just to get to next tier or the tree
C; you are locked to 31 points to the tree, basically killing ANY sort of hybrid build, not even 30/11
D; final talent of the tree is total lackluster
E; the tree doesnt change your rotation/priority system (from not having spent single point in the tree and having 31+ in a tree) at all
F; doesnt change your gamestyle from LK at all
G; more than one of the above.

Im sure I could come up with more, but I think 6 reasons is good enough?

That is really just one reason written in diffrent ways. Except the x% passive thing. Which they even said will NOT be completley removed, just remove as much as possible. What should they fill it out with if you remove ALL passive % talents?
And, there is lots of new abilitys.
Ehm, when you say "5-6 diffrent elemental PvE" builds, you are probably just moving around the points that grant you iether manarege, increase dmg of your fire nova totem and reduce all dmg you take by x%.
Doesn't change your gamestyle.. so, I assume you are in the BETA then, if not.. just shut it.
And the thing about feedback, constructive criticism.. really? Do you think they give a damn about what is said here? They want feedback on the official forums. And also.. 80% of people just saying "New talent trees are useless!", "WTF BLIZZARD", "brb, warhammer", "new talent trees are shit", "new talents suck".. THAT IS NOT FEEDBACK.

@wildi, I am old enough to realize people here are not above 14 years old. And no, I'm not trolling.. what about my post seems like trolling? Dipwat.

---------- Post added 2010-07-14 at 02:46 PM ----------

Originally Posted by Kalx

I thought the tol'vir were going to be cat people

also, http://db.mmo-champion.com/s/84340/v...ium-blastpack/ HELL YEAH, new seaforium charge

Sphinx-like creatures.. which is almost cat-people. :>

I do not like the new talent tree just looking at going affliction. I had to spec into improved fear and howl just to go down the tree, last time I checked that was never used in a pve situation. So the "filler" talents I used to go with, which actually did me some good, have been replaced with shit I would've NEVER considered spec'ing into previously. Good job blizzard, do you even know the current talent builds for each class or do you just want people to spec into shit that no one uses right now....

Originally Posted by scelero

I do not like the new talent tree just looking at going affliction. I had to spec into improved fear and howl just to go down the tree, last time I checked that was never used in a pve situation. So the "filler" talents I used to go with, which actually did me some good, have been replaced with shit I would've NEVER considered spec'ing into previously. Good job blizzard, do you even know the current talent builds for each class or do you just want people to spec into shit that no one uses right now....

Okey.. you are kinda wrong. The things you 'used to take' you get passivly, which was mostly shit anyway. Except maybe the reduced GCD on curses which I don't know where it is.
And yeah, the warlocks tree are probably the least worked on imo.. so I can agree a bit with your rage.
But still, it's good changes.. don't be such a crybaby, it's the first BETA-build.

I knew it was a bad thing when I heard they were introducing 31 point talent trees.
This only confirms my fears.

I haven't played WoW for quite some time now because all the things I enjoyed from are/were being removed.

First it was the world PvP which was killed by blizzard's "balancing" mechanics.
Second was epics being made mass produced "welfare epics".
Third was "fixing" the glitches like picnics up in the roof of Orgrimmar.
Fourth was removal of social skill requirement in making instance runs (LFG tool).
And now fifth is killing the talent trees so that no matter where you put your points you are all equal.

An illiterate monkey can now spam those points and be a succesfull killing machine.
Talents were used to determine skilled players and possess situational builds to meet certain needs.


If Blizzard is reading this, know that the current 5 point per row requirement really does not work with the new tree layout, it should be something like 3 points to get to the next row and so that each row of talents have at least 3 different choices with majority of being 1 point wonders so that you don't need to build up them needlessly for semi-weak results.

I did quit WoW 8 months ago due to the fact that it was a "game over" situation for me.
What I mean with this is that since I did only casual raid, had all the welfare epics and arena/chess is just not my thing.
I had no purpose to play the game anymore since all the fun things had been removed and all classes were level 80.

I will come back to check out Cataclysm but I will not stay longer than 1 month and it is what comes with the expansion as I buy it and possibly with a scroll of resurrection if it is possible to merge both months.

I'm not a fan of patchrolling which is to wait Blizzard to give us an ending we deserved when we bought the expansion and not after 1 year later after some sweet monthly subscriptions.
Unlike rest of you, I'm not that stupid though I'm not very bright either because I'm coming back.

these talent trees need work imo worse than the current ones. a class like spriest currently over half of the talents you take are +percentage.

Originally Posted by bigjenk

these talent trees need work imo worse than the current ones. a class like spriest currently over half of the talents you take are +percentage.

I see only one that is pure +% dmg. Else is single spell increased by x%.. that they said NOTHING about.
All they said was, 'we want to reduce as much passive +% hit / haste / dmg / crit as possible.'.
Troll moar.

Originally Posted by Powershard

I knew it was a bad thing when I heard they were introducing 31 point talent trees.
This only confirms my fears.

I'd like to point out 1 obvious thing:
The reason you level up in WoW is because you want to grow in power, is to have new abilities and have more talent points!
By increasing level cap and cutting the number of talent points in half really cancels each other out.
When I heard cataclysm was coming out I was excited for the new talent tree combinations I could make, such as having 51 point and 21 point talents at the same time and was imagining exciting situations where those could lead me in.

Except that now Blizzard decided to kill those dreams.

For christ's sake just leave level cap at 80 and give players who buy the expansion 5 new abilities and it is the same if you were leveling or not.

/Hug

Originally Posted by Sonoka

That is really just one reason written in diffrent ways. Except the x% passive thing. Which they even said will NOT be completley removed, just remove as much as possible. What should they fill it out with if you remove ALL passive % talents?

not all, but most of them. For example my current ele spec is with 9 talents out of 19 with flat +% stuff to that or this, thats not, so far, what they promised

And, there is lots of new abilitys.

really? like where? again, based on Ele for example, it has in the tree 2 new talents. One of them is extremely situational spell, second one is sometimes slightly altering rotation, but doesnt really change anything from "cast LvB on CD"

Ehm, when you say "5-6 diffrent elemental PvE" builds, you are probably just moving around the points that grant you iether manarege, increase dmg of your fire nova totem and reduce all dmg you take by x%.

dont forget insta GW! point is, with cata talents, I can take all talents I want and not miss any interesting one or even remotely useful one, unless of course you like junk for ele like reverbation and elemental devastation.

Doesn't change your gamestyle.. so, I assume you are in the BETA then, if not.. just shut it.

I dont need to be rocket genius, when I see talent tree and new skills, that the only difference between now and cata would be macroed unleash weapon to LvB cast

And the thing about feedback, constructive criticism.. really? Do you think they give a damn about what is said here? They want feedback on the official forums. And also.. 80% of people just saying "New talent trees are useless!", "WTF BLIZZARD", "brb, warhammer", "new talent trees are shit", "new talents suck".. THAT IS NOT FEEDBACK.

As I pointed out, rants definitely wont help and I never said, that constructive feedback HERE is read by developers, I was talking in general.

Originally Posted by Boubouille

I need a giant hug

/hug
It's far from giant, but it's all I can give

Blizzard said they wanted to people to be able to chose their own talents and have fun with them, but most of the current ret talents are a must making us expend 37 talent points in 1 tree :S to maximize dps