Are You Insane in the Membrane?

QQ more.

This achievement has been there unchanged for 2 years now.

If you care that much about being a special snowflake, link your achievement and it'll show your "impressively" early completion date (not to mention the FoS for the other faction).

So what happens if I, someone who already holds the insane title, reps up to exalted with bloodsail, fix my goblin rep, and obtain the "new insane title" do i get a second fos? or does it make it look like i just earned the insane title under the new lazier insane requirements?

and they better make the shendralar come with an awesome title like "Badass" or "the Repwhore"

Originally Posted by Anandor

and you're missing the fact that this is an FoS they're not obligated to keep it in either, but because of all the QQ they had to. look how many FoS are unobtainable now, and we will never see them again. it just like a kid in a supermarket screaming and crying for their mum to buy them a toy or some chocolate bar, and Blizzard caved in

Again, Pot. Kettle. Black. All you're doing is bitching like a baby about this, and if Blizzard caved in and made it so that it WAS gone, you'd be all like "Yay, I'm awesome and have achieved something in my life that makes me different and cool!" and it would all be because you cried like a kid in a supermarket screaming and crying for their mom to buy them a toy or some chocolate bar. So again, get over it.

Again, if you got the titles a long time ago, of COURSE it's going to get easier. It ALWAYS has. And as people have posted before, Blizzard said that it would REMAIN in during Cataclysm...everyone just did a chicken little "The sky is falling!" when some Q&A got messed up. Gee, that's never happened before.

Seriously, the amount of "I deserve this!" is insane...it's a video game that could be turned off at any moment. I can't imagine how you guys would all react if they shut down WoW. "But...but...can I take my title with me into the real world!? I worked SO hard for them!" Either enjoy what you got from the grind you did, and who cares what others get...or STOP PLAYING THE GAME! It's a game that's constantly changing, and always making older things easier to get. They were never taking this FoS out of the game, so get over it. The FoS was NOT hard to get...it was a time sink. That's all. You chose to spend your time doing it, and you did. You got what they said you'd get...the end. Not hard.

Everybody in here whining because you're no longer special can rest easy knowing that anyone who spends that much time in a game and then complains about it is indeed very "special".

The absolute best part of this...everyone saying they hate Blizz because they constantly do things like this will CONTINUE to pay them every month. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice... /golf clap to whiners

Originally Posted by sinrepus

So what happens if I, someone who already holds the insane title, reps up to exalted with bloodsail, fix my goblin rep, and obtain the "new insane title" do i get a second fos? or does it make it look like i just earned the insane title under the new lazier insane requirements?

and they better make the shendralar come with an awesome title like "Badass" or "the Repwhore"

A FoS for Shen'dralar would be nice. About title, mount or smthing else I cant care less, its been such inflation in those type of items.

That said, for all that cares about rep, I hope that United nations guildachivent will be avaialbe as a single player achivement as well.

Originally Posted by Asema

Blizzard has made the insane like the kingslayer title.. wait long enough everyone has it.

I hope your joking here. The Shen'dralar component of the achievement was not the only insane thing about it. Like I said, if you can do the Ravenholdt and Darkmoon Faire grinds then you would've been committed enough to do Shen'dralar when it was available.

Originally Posted by DtsM

I hope your joking here. The Shen'dralar component of the achievement was not the only insane thing about it. Like I said, if you can do the Ravenholdt and Darkmoon Faire grinds then you would've been committed enough to do Shen'dralar when it was available.

Bullshit. Scanning AH for DMF cards and pickpocketing mobs for a few hours is nothing comparing to the grind in DM, Stratholme, Scholomance and searching for BoH. If you throw enough gold at it, you don't ever need to leave your city to get those two.

Thanks for ruining the achievement. Just make it a quest... talk to Thrall and give it to everyone.

I vote we get some kind of Ancient mount (Like a Saber or something) or some title.

Originally Posted by BrendanBauer

Again, Pot. Kettle. Black. All you're doing is bitching like a baby about this, and if Blizzard caved in and made it so that it WAS gone, you'd be all like "Yay, I'm awesome and have achieved something in my life that makes me different and cool!" and it would all be because you cried like a kid in a supermarket screaming and crying for their mom to buy them a toy or some chocolate bar. So again, get over it.

except i'm not bitching to blizzard, starting petitions, writing letters for them to keep shen'dralar as a req for this FoS. i'm just agreeing with most other people here that they're taking a piss on this thing, half of the work that went into this title was that one rep but whatever, i'm still just gonna suck it up. so yeah im pissed off but not exactly a QQ sorry about that

What people and myself are so irritated about, is that you had so long to do this FoS if you wanted to get it. You had 2 years to merely know about it, and you had previous expansions to even build up these reps. The fact that its now being removed oh, now people want it. Which is great for them, they can work their butt off to get something done in a few months if they so chose. This achievement was meant to be hard, it was meant to be insane. It was meant for those who only really were actively seeking it out.

Blizzard got rid of the bear mount, why? Because if would be too easy to farm up come wrath, well the case with this title should stand. If you have to nerf it to where its initial value, prize, and overall 'insane-ness' is no longer there, why is it still there? There have been many things that have been removed in the past because they are simply just too easy to get anymore. Shendralar rep was the one thing stopping this achievement from being a huge cake walk, and the place where most of your money was dumped.

No one is looking for an extra FoS. People ground out that rep FOR this title, for THIS FoS, and THIS FoS only, why would we want another, Why would we want to see people running around with the same title as ours that literally took them 1/2 the work, money, time & dedication.

Leaving it the way it was: 'get this done before cata, or too bad' was a good compromise. You let people know, and people who actually cared would have finished it off, and have and are doing so. But you should have just left it as that... not change it into some casual crap.

I am now seeking for a new rare title to wear in cata.

Originally Posted by DcanD

Bullshit. Scanning AH for DMF cards and pickpocketing mobs for a few hours is nothing comparing to the grind in DM, Stratholme, Scholomance and searching for BoH. If you throw enough gold at it, you don't ever need to leave your city to get those two.

Thanks for ruining the achievement. Just make it a quest... talk to Thrall and give it to everyone.

Don't exaggerate here, some people claim the DMF component has taken them longer then Shen'dralar. And NO ONE farms DM ONLY until they hit exalted. They would actually spend most of their money, upwards to around 35 - 100k gold to complete it, just like DMF. It's almost as if your saying this achievement will be a cakewalk now. Why don't you actually try and do the achievement after the changes are made and when you finally complete it, you go tell me it was easy... Otherwise you're just trollin.

I agree that removing Shen'dralar from the achievement requirements was not what anyone wanted. But rather than screw over their storyline and levelling progression yet again for the sake of an FoS, they've patched it out.

YES, it's bad handling by Blizz, YES, it's a very patched over job. But they're keeping it in there, for everyone who still wants it, and who was told they would not have to rush like mad. I have not had the luxury of playing for 5 years to grind this title, and good lord, I am happy it's staying, however it's staying. And I am still grinding Shen'dralar, because I want that extra FoS as well.

Originally Posted by DcanD

Bullshit. Scanning AH for DMF cards and pickpocketing mobs for a few hours is nothing comparing to the grind in DM, Stratholme, Scholomance and searching for BoH. If you throw enough gold at it, you don't ever need to leave your city to get those two.

As someone who has done enough of the grinds to know exactly how "difficult" this is, I refute this.

Whether you grind for PBD's, Shards, Librams, Inscription mats and Heavy Junkboxes or simply grind enough gold to buy these things, the effort required is pretty similar. WoW has a free market economy, driven by supply and demand. If it was easier to farm these things than buy them, then more people needing them would farm them, reducing demand, others would farm them to sell, increasing supply, and therefore price would come down, until the effort was equal. Conversely, if it was easier to make money than to farm these things, the people selling them would switch to doing something more productive with their time, reducing supply, while people wanting them would farm less, increasing demand, thus upping the price.

There are some elements of this achievement that cannot be bought:

• Farming Blood of Heroes, Skins of Shadow, Frayed Abomination Stitchings ~ 15-20 Hours
• Steamwheedle Rep ~ 20-30 hours
• Bloodsail Rep ~ 5-7 hours
• Painful Turnins (Ravendholdt, Shen'dralar) ~ depends on whether you have a mobile mailbox, but with an Argent gruntling expect to waste a few hours on each of these.

Also, some parts of the rep grind just make more sense to grind for rather than buy:

• Farming Syndicate Mobs ~ 5 hours

Lastly, scanning the AH for darkmoon cards every day for 6 months, even at 5 minutes a day, adds up to 15 hours and that is a very conservative estimate (you can easily spend twice that per day if you include time spent logging to your alt, running between the AH and mailbox, and then managing your vast card collection).

Ultimately though it is pretty much irrelevant though because even if you save time by spending gold, it takes time to make gold. The cards you need to get DMF to exalted could cost you over 60K gold. That is not a trivial amount of cash to obtain, and because of the way inflation works in the game, the easier it gets to earn gold, the more expensive the cards become, so the time requirement for farming the gold stays constant. The same applies to Junkboxes, Librams and PBD's.

Yes, Shen'dralar was a big chunk (about 3/8) of the Insane, but in the end its constituent parts are no more difficult than any of the other grinds.

lol

Well, I enjoyed the Shendralar-Grind. I hated the DMF-Grind, because on my server Cards go for 100-400 gold a piece. This means simply buying cards would 90k-380k Gold. That's not the kind of money I have, so imagine farming the tree mobs in Skettis for weeks nearly nonstop: Kill 4 Mobs, wait 5 Minutes, kill 4 Mobs, wait 5 Minutes. I truly and deeply hated it.

I got the insane in the membrane achievement long before the announcement that they were going to remove it was announced. I still knew that Blizzard always tries to be sneaky about these sort of stuff so I put in extra effort in the last two factions I had to grind, Ravenholdt manor and the Darkmoon faire when they announced that flying over the oldworld and dungeon changes would be top priority. I got the title just a few months ago.So this change doesn't affect me in any way whatsoever.

What does bother me is the way they handled it, it is sloppy and underhanded and in complete disregard for the playerbase that is usually quiet and reserved about gameplay changes. Stuff happens and we know and accept it.
What I for myself do not accept is that they remove content that was barely accessable for anyone ( 100% droprates on mimirons head and invincible ) and limit content that had always been accessible , the insane achievement and the class quests for example. Or to add further insult to injury, make said feature easier to get like the removal of the Shendralar and justicar/conqueror achievements for the battlemaster title.
The whole point of the insane title is that you bothered to spent time, game currency and dedication to maximize friendship with a faction that has no benefit at all. Hence INSANE.... It never was meant to show 'time well spend' it is an ironic statement to the player himself, the playerbase and the company Blizzard.

Blizzard doesn't tell us whom they are aiming to please with this change but I am sure of it that it isn't for the more intelligent type.

Originally Posted by DtsM

Don't exaggerate here, some people claim the DMF component has taken them longer then Shen'dralar. And NO ONE farms DM ONLY until they hit exalted. They would actually spend most of their money, upwards to around 35 - 100k gold to complete it, just like DMF. It's almost as if your saying this achievement will be a cakewalk now. Why don't you actually try and do the achievement after the changes are made and when you finally complete it, you go tell me it was easy... Otherwise you're just trollin.

Not planning to do it again just to prove a point. Done it without spending more than 1k gold to pick up a couple of odd PBDs I was missing towards the end.

I won't disagree - DMF takes a long time regardless of the method you choose to complete it, be it buying the cards from AH as they are not always there or the prices are just ridiculous, or if you decide to farm the Skettis trees like I did. And I'm not trying to trivialize the other parts of the achievement. Each and every one of those grinds was a pain in some way. But in my opinion Shen'dralar was the most complex of them all, and having it removed from the requirements is a slap in the face for the people who truly committed to obtaining the title.

Here's an idea... keep the FoS with the limited requirements, but don't let it grant the title anymore. Like Hand of A'dal or Scarab Lord... sure you can complete the quest line but you don't get the title, because that party is over.

The unfortunate reality is, when it was announced that the Insane title would be removed, Blizzard got a ton of responses from people who would have never actually gone for the Title anyway, but jumped on the bandwagon just in case they ever get a wild hair. The people who are hurt by this most recent development are much fewer in numbers than the players out there that are lazy, but love to find a reason to whine.

Even though the latest announcement is a much crueler decision than it would have been to remove the Title, we probably don't have the numbers to compete with the whiners for action from Blizzard. Blizzard, you are taking care of the wrong players in this case. We may be a smaller group, but by completing the achievement in the past, we have already shown that we are more dedicated to this issue than those who haven't bothered.

Two things, regarding this Feat, that were stated by Blizzard.

1.Just for clarity, Insane in the Membrane will not be removed in Cataclysm. We can only confirm this one for you, but since it's undoubtedly one of the most brain-melting achievements, we thought it nice to let you know that you don't have to rush to have this done before the expansion.
2. Insane in the Membrane is a feat of strength, not an achievement. Feats are things that you can't be guaranteed to complete, which is why they're feats and not achievements. Most of them are actually now impossible to complete, and this feat will join a long list of "you had to be there" moments in WoW time.

The feat isn't being removed of course, those who have it will retain it, however; some of the requirements are, so it will no longer be able to be completed by anyone who has not already done so.

It's possible that in some very specific situations where someone has completed the reputations which are being removed, but not others that will still be in the game, that it can still be completed. But it's something we're waiting for clarity on, and will let you know as soon as we do.


Those things being said...
As one of the few who got this, I find it aggrivating that Blizzard decided to simply remove a reputation from the requirement, thus making it less time consuming/costly to complete. The Feat has been around since *at least* the begining of Wrath, which was 2 years ago today. People have had ample time to get it done, but with the threat of it becoming unobtainable, there has been a huge outcry. Granted, Blizzard did in fact state the Feat wasn't being changed/removed so no one needed to feel rushed. For whatever reason, they changed their mind, which is rather common, and the Feat was to be put in a glass display case along with the rest of the Feats that are done and gone, ie. Amani War Bear, Brewfest Steins, WoW Anniversaries, Collector's Edition pets, etc. Rightfully so - it's a very special and rare thing that should not be around forever.

For those who have already obtained their title or at least finished the Shen'dralar part of it are basically getting a kick in the teeth with this change. To try and compensate, Blizzard wants to give us a 'consolation' prize of another Feat specifically for getting Exhalted with those odd elves... maybe. Oh goody. Regarding those who had the 'rug pulled out from under them', so to speak, again... you had more than enough time to get it done. Personally, I'm an avid pet and mount collector, so when I learned that the ZG mounts are going away, I simply started to farm more. If they drop for me, awesome. If not, oh well.

At this point, it's about the principle and maybe some bragging rights. I mean, I got the Loremaster title before it was nerfed - less quests are required now. When I see someone else rockin' Loremaster that they just got, kudos to them... but a small part of me thinks, "I got it when it harder." Pardon the elitism - part of the WOOHOO! factor comes from doing things before they're softened up, when they really mean something - that goes for anything really, out in the real world or otherwise. Yay for pride and competition in a game! As I said, principle.

im happy that i'll probably be able to do it now being a lazy git as i am , but it would really be cool and even more fun if they would also add another title for the hardworkin players that has done it including the shen'dralar rep.

Originally Posted by Scathach

it would really be cool and even more fun if they would also add another title for the hardworkin players that has done it including the shen'dralar rep.

Agreed. To me, a title like "of the Shen'dralar" would be quite pointless. Even nerfed, the new Insane in the Membrane is still more of an accomplishment than Shen'dralar alone, so I would never display my Shen'dralar title. Having 2 insane titles seems the right way to go:

• The Insane: For getting it without Shen'dralar
• The Clinically Insane: For those with both the Insane and Shen'dralar