Guild Transfer & Guild Rename Services Coming
Originally Posted by Nethaera (Blue Tracker)
We want to give everyone an early heads-up regarding our plan to implement a guild relocation service for World of Warcraft. The idea is for a guild leader to be able to transfer a guild to another realm. The guild structure remains intact, including the guild leader, guild bank, ranks, and guild name (depending on availability).

Guild members who decide to relocate with their guild may initiate their own paid character transfer. Upon a successful transfer they will automatically be part of the guild when they first log into the new realm. Their guild rank and guild reputation will be intact.

Guild leaders who do not want a change of scenery may also choose to pick a new guild name using another new service. These services are in development and we will be providing additional details at a future point in time.

As with all of the features and services we offer, we intend to incorporate the guild relocation service in a way that will not disrupt the game play experience. Please note that this feature will require extensive internal testing, so you may see bits and pieces of the service appear on the public test realms. We'll announce further details at .

Dev Watercooler: The View From 10,000 Feet
Originally Posted by Blizzard (Blue Tracker)
So how is the view from way up here? It’s great actually -- we’re really happy with how Cataclysm is going so far, and we have big surprises on the horizon. On the other hand, there are details you can see at ground level that you can’t make out from 10,000 feet.

When we started these blogs, the idea was to foster developer communication to the players without some of the inherent problems of posting in forums. Some players have pointed out recently, and we totally agree, that the blogs up until now have been from a very high vantage point. We looked for topics with universal interest that would feel important and newsworthy. That has worked overall, but we also feel like we’ve lost something from when I used to be down in the metaphorical trenches talking to players in the forums.

So we’re going to try something a little different. We’re going to unleash some blogs that are much more conversational and less proclamational (that's a word now). If we deliver on this, it will hopefully feel like you’re eavesdropping on our design meetings. You won’t always learn a lot about exciting new features coming to the game, but you will (ideally) learn something about the design process itself. (When we have big, exciting news to share, or ‘State of the Game’ style blogs, we’ll still do those as well.)

But to pull off this more casual blog style, let’s establish a few ground rules:

1) No promises. I’m going to be talking about a lot of things we might do or things we could do. You shouldn’t interpret this brainstorming as patch notes. Our creative process is insanely iterative. We might pitch dozens of ideas before we find one we like. That can be really exhausting if you’re not used to it. If you’re more interested in final decisions and not idea churn, then this style of blog won’t be for you.

2) Don’t read too much between the lines. I’m going to point out a lot of design flaws in our game. “Oh no! Goatcaller admitted WoW was deeply flawed! It’s shark-jumping time!” Look, Blizzard is very critical about our own designs. There is virtually nothing in World of Warcraft that could not be improved. That has always been the case and will continue to be the case. Just because I’m going to be sharing that more frankly with you doesn’t mean that the game now has more cracks in its foundation than it ever did. There is an old saying (misattributed, from what I understand, to Otto Bismarck) that laws are like sausages; it is best not seeing them being made. My old friend and mentor Bruce Shelley used to apply the same maxim to game design.

3) No complaints about the topic. If we didn’t have an interesting discussion about a topic recently, e.g. shaman mechanics, I’m not going to invent one. That doesn’t mean that the class is perfect, or that we don’t love shaman players, or that the shaman class has no direction, or that the class design is frozen in carbonite. I’m not going to keep hash marks next to every class and spec to make sure I’ve covered their "Very Important Issues" lately in a blog. World of Warcraft design being what it is, we’ll probably eventually get around to talking about everyone on here, but it may take weeks or months or years. My team is responsible for areas of the game including classes, items, encounters, trade skills, achievements, combat, and UI, so my blogs will probably stick to those topics.

Okay, all that preamble is out of the way now. I’ll probably refer back to it sometimes, if we have some players stomping all over the ground rules.

One topic we’ve been discussing lately is the role of Hit and Expertise on tank gear (or more precisely, plate tanking gear). The conventional wisdom is that Hit and Expertise are threat stats, and you may need to swap them out with some of your mitigation stats depending on the situation. Realistically, unless you severely overgear the content, we don’t think that is actually true. Tanks almost always worry about survival first and foremost, which totally makes sense, and are willing to trade off threat stats for better mitigation in almost all situations. It’s much harder to progress if the tank explodes than it is if the cat occasionally pulls aggro. (It’s not quite that simple, but I’m going to gloss over details and exceptions since I spent so much text on the preamble up above).

Once upon a time, taunts could miss, and so Hit was marginally more interesting than it is today. Once upon a time, having a boss parry your attacks could speed up its swing timer, which turned Expertise into a (often weak) survival stat. Boss parries felt very random though, both in the sense that sometimes the tank would suddenly take much more damage than anticipated and there was no easy way to know which bosses had parry speed up. (Today, you can assume none of them do.) Until recently, interrupts could miss, but asking a tank to stack a bunch of Hit just for those few opportunities when they were probably going to hit anyway but disaster would occur if they did not felt crummy too.

The problem is that there aren’t a lot of stats that are interesting to tanks. Stamina and Armor are great, but their stat budget is often in lockstep with item level. (It would be interesting to consider if we could make that not the case once again, but that’s the topic for another blog.) We got rid of Defense as a stat that tanks needed to worry about. We have managed to make Mastery pretty good to excellent for tanks, so that’s at least one stat they like to see. Dodge and (if you’re a plate-wearer) Parry are good, and slightly interesting because of talents like Hold the Line. But beyond that, it starts to go downhill. Sure Haste and Crit can sometimes be fun, but really they often aren’t worth the trade off. That leaves us with Hit and Expertise. We’d like to make them more interesting to tanks. But how?

One way is by turning them into defensive stats. They are defensive stats for Blood death knights, because the DK self-healing is tied into Death Strike, which can miss. It might be possible to do something similar for the other classes. Imagine if Shield Block had to actually hit the target. Presumably you raise your shield, but not high enough to intercept the incoming blow. Now hit becomes a mitigation stat for warriors as well. We might have to adjust the mitigation amount on Shield Block or give warriors a small Hit bonus so Hit capping wasn’t totally unreasonable, but you get the basic idea. You could do the same with paladins (make Holy Shield more interesting?) and druids as well (Savage Defense could proc on a hit).

Is this a good idea? We’re not sure yet. You won’t see this change in the 4.1 patch for certain. There are trade-offs to making Hit and Expertise more valuable. Gearing as a tank might be more fun for experienced players, but it also might be more challenging for less experienced players. The number of struggling tanks in your Dungeon Finder groups might go up. Some less knowledgeable players (and to be fair, this stuff doesn’t exactly explain itself on the character sheet) might stack Hit way too high at the expense of a more valuable mitigation stat, such as mastery.

It is the kind of thing we’re talking about though, and if you want to make a contribution to the tanking forums but aren’t quite sure on a topic, here is one potential possibility.

-Greg “Ghostcrawler” Street is the lead systems designer of World of Warcraft. He still has Buru’s Skull Fragment.
This article was originally published in forum thread: Guild Transfer & Guild Rename Services Coming, The View From 10,000 Feet started by Boubouille View original post
Comments 131 Comments
  1. Tastyfish's Avatar
    Guild Server Xfers? are we that close to April 1st?
  1. Cornstarched's Avatar
    great idea for another payed service. Now when you decide that 25$ is the cost for moving 1 line of code from one document to another that takes the automated computer system less than 5seconds to do if there is no que. Don't you feel great? And we wonder why gold is able to be sold, and why paying to lvl a toon on a differnt server is so popular. i payed my buddy 20ucks to get a priuest to 85 for me in a week. saved me 5$ and gave it to someone in need. Do that guys. dont pay blizzard for garbage services. They arnt using your money to better the game. (Their budget is fixed)

  1. DaveyMcDave's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by skylla05 View Post
    Because backend coding is totally done by the same people doing encounter design and 3D modeling.


    That's what happens when you compare apples to oranges while using ridiculous assumptions with a "hot topic" like gold selling to try and make a point.

    Blizzard is a business. Their first priority is making money. Believe it or not, appeasing the playerbase comes second. The only people that paid transfers will affect to the point of losing a subscription, are naive/ignorant kids that think making money is a bad thing. Stop trying to fight the man, because in an environment like this, the man will always win.
    Well, making money is one thing, but remember Blizzard have to give something in return: a fun and fair game. I think providing this kind of service makes sense considering that guilds now have to be levelled up. Obviously, Blizzard doesn't want every guild to just start randomly doing it - that would ruin the experience for a lot of people. So, to make the experience best, they have to give some sort of disincentive to make sure you REALLY want it. The most obvious thing to do is simply charge for it, and make a little money out of it, but I'm sure the amount of actual money they get from it is pretty minimal compared to their other revenue.

    If you don't like paying for it, don't pay for it. It's not like 10 dollars/euros/etc is really all that expensive, and I'd say it's worth it if you've put that much effort into your guild. And it's not like you're any worse off if you decide not to use it. It's just nice to have the option, y'know?
  1. Isolyphic's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by LilSin View Post
    I can see the guild transfer going so horribly wrong.... Help!! Been hacked, my guild is gone! Along with out 500K golds, crafting mats gears..

    -Cough- Authenticator.
  1. Sativaspirit's Avatar
    But to pull off this more casual blog style, let’s establish a few ground rules:

    1) No promises. I’m going to be talking about a lot of things we might do or things we could do. You shouldn’t interpret this brainstorming as patch notes.
    2) Don’t read too much between the lines.
    Yeah... Good luck with that one... Might as well not go there, becaue it WILL be interpreted as promises and there WILL be a lot of reading between the lines.
  1. Fojos's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Alisyn View Post
    Will be interesting to see how many GM asshats gkick everyone and transfer with the gbank. I wonder if the transfers are tracked for members at all. Or if you're out, you have no idea where it went.
    Guildmasters can already do that (by just transferring their own character, obviously). They don't need to transfer guildbank to take everything out of it.
  1. F-Minus's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Shockzilla View Post
    And you guys wonder why developers don’t want to post on the forum. Blizz is a company and companies want to (need to if they want to stay around) make money, this is evil. If you don’t want the service then don’t use it, others of us would like the option to do so.

    Nobody up till now charged for such things as guild name change. Every MMO I was in, the game master changed the guild name propmt if you asked nicely. Whenever I asked a GM to change my guilds name I got a reply that this is not possible and is against the rules. Sometimes some people got lucky and the name change was done, assuming the original guild name was offensive or had something else that would suggest a rename.

    However now I will be able to change the guilds name at a price - which is laughable to say the least. If GMs can do it within a second or two (if they see fit), why would they demand money for that. Don't give me Blizzard is a company and want to make money answer, since there's tons of developers/publishers/companies that don't charge for such basic thing except for Blizzard ofc. I was quite quiet up till now with their grossly overpriced services for everything, but I just can't be quiet anymore - this has gone too far in my book.

    And since they are a company, doesn't mean I or we have to swallow everything they present us with smiles on our face, especially if it's so obviously greedy stuff.
  1. Yourcatdead's Avatar
    Okay this is to much.

    First the winged lion. I don't get it. Companies aren't suppose to want money.

  1. Ares42's Avatar
    Wouldn't buffing tank damage and making it an important part of dps requirements for enrage/add timers etc quickly make hit and expertise valuable, while not forcing the need for maxing out (which has been the problem with silences and parrygibs) ? Considering they are by far the 2 most effective dps stats.
  1. screwlewse's Avatar
    Wow.. never thought of it like that. This just means you need to be more careful who you guild with. Overall, I think this is a good idea, especially for small guilds. With that addition of Guild leveling, it just seems natural that you would want this.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vasz View Post
    So a GM can up-and-run to another server, change the guild name, his name, he race and faction?

    I guess this means that if your GM wants to move, he will move and take the guild bank with him. Maybe you are not making good enough progress and he wants to try another realm. While giving a GM this power, the small guys like us ..... lose all our guild perks.

    VERY bad idea IMO.
  1. Steelyorc's Avatar
    Novel idea...wait until you see all the details about the service.

    But no...all you wanna do is bitch..basically about everything
  1. Vasz's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by DaveyMcDave View Post
    Obviously, Blizzard doesn't want every guild to just start randomly doing it - that would ruin the experience for a lot of people.
    Thats the point, what is stopping everyone doing it? If my guild decided to get up and leave, there would be no way on earth I would pay to change realms too.

    Think about it from a business move though. 15 quid * 25 players = 375 quid. Im sure people wouldnt batter an eye lid at 15 pounds, but I refuse to pay them any more money.

    This is the generation of free to play mmorpgs, not pay pay pay pay to play.
  1. Rolly's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Shockzilla View Post
    And you guys wonder why developers don’t want to post on the forum. Blizz is a company and companies want to (need to if they want to stay around) make money, this is evil. If you don’t want the service then don’t use it, others of us would like the option to do so.
    Stop trying to defend the indefensible. There is a difference between making a profit and being outright greedy. Blizzard has become greedy.
    All you people blathering about "a company has to make a profit" need a lesson in morality.
    Blizzard is already making hundreds of millions if not billions in profit, when is enough enough?
    And don't give me that crap about "the law says they have to make a profit" that fucking law was passed to stop companies from deliberately having losses to get tax write offs not as a tacit go ahead to abandon all morality for profit.
  1. Matchu's Avatar
    The best bit is possibly how in Europe, they changed the idea from "watercooler" to "Coffee with..."; that's localisation for you.
  1. Findus707's Avatar
    ¨Blizzard are getting more and more ideas on how to get all our money
    Damn how much i hate them.
  1. Yourcatdead's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Findus707 View Post
    ¨Blizzard are getting more and more ideas on how to get all our money
    Damn how much i hate them.
    This. I don't understand why a company wants money.
  1. TobiasX's Avatar
    Interesting uses of this new system:

    1. Several friends all want to switch realms so they can join the same 'better' guild. They all make a guild on their current server and pool money for a guild transfer instead of paying for individual transfers.

    2. A player has 10 85s on the same server, including a guild bank for their personal use. This will let me move my team of characters around much more freely.

    Can't wait to see more details on this.
  1. Pshaw's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Rolly View Post
    I knew Blizzard had turned into a stinking pile of shit when they started profiting off the backs of charities with pet sales.
    Seriously where do they get off donating money to people in need!? What a bunch of assholes, it would be way better if they just kept all the money from pet sales for themselves! That would totally make them not a stinking pile of shit right?
  1. Fool's Avatar
    more paid services, brilliant.
  1. Bane-Thunder-God's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Rolly View Post
    Paid guild name change and server transfer. bwahahahahahahahahahaha So now the real reason for guild perk implementation comes out.
    I knew Blizzard had turned into a stinking pile of shit when they started profiting off the backs of charities with pet sales.

    Since when is Name changing or Server changing ever been free? Your only an idiot if you think that it was going to be free. There's no conspiracies or evil plot behind this. It's common sense. Please remember you don't have to pay for any of these things it's just an Option for those That do.

    And if Blizzard are so bad Quit the game and don't return. I promise you won't be missed sir

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