MMO-Champion - Patch 4.1 Preview -- Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms
Patch 4.1 Preview -- Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms
Originally Posted by Blizzard (Blue Tracker)
In patch 4.1 we'll be introducing Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms, a new system intended to lower queue times. Call to Arms will automatically detect which class role is currently the least represented in the queue, and offer them additional rewards for entering the Dungeon Finder queue and completing a random level-85 Heroic dungeon.

Any time the Dungeon Finder queue is longer than a few minutes for level-85 Heroics, the Call to Arms system kicks in and determines which role is the least represented. In the case of tanking being the least represented role, the "Call to Arms: Tanks" icon will display in the Dungeon Finder UI menu where class roles are selected, and will also display on the UI when the queue pops and you are selected to enter a dungeon. Regardless of your role, you'll always be able to see which role currently has been Called to Arms, if any.

Call to Arms is meant to lower wait times by offering additional rewards for queuing as the currently least represented role. To be eligible for the additional rewards you must solo queue for a random level-85 Heroic in the role that is currently being Called to Arms, and complete the dungeon by killing the final boss. Every time you hit these requirements (there is no daily limit) you'll receive a goodie bag that will contain some gold, a chance at a rare gem, a chance at a flask/elixir (determined by spec), a good chance of receiving a non-combat pet (including cross faction pets), and a very rare chance at receiving a mount. The pets offered come from a wide variety of sources, and include companions like the Razzashi Hatchling, Cockatiel, and Tiny Sporebat, but the mounts are those specifically only available through dungeons (not raids), like the Reins of the Raven Lord from Sethekk Halls, Swift White Hawkstrider from Magister's Terrace, and Deathcharger's Reins from Stratholme.

This system is meant to address the unacceptable queue times currently being experienced by those that queue for the DPS role at max level. The long queue times are, of course, caused by a very simple lack of representation in the Dungeon Finder by tanks, and to some extent healers. We don't feel the tanking and healing roles have any inherent issues that are causing the representation disparity, except that fulfilling them carries more responsibility. Understandably, players prefer to take on that responsibility in more organized situations than what the Dungeon Finder offers, but perhaps we can bribe them a little. While this system gives tanks and healers something extra, the incentive is being provided so that we can help players in the DPS role get into more dungeons, get better gear, and continue progressing.

While the gold, gems, flasks, and elixirs are OK incentives, we knew we needed something more substantial. We had briefly considered Valor Points and epics, but decided that wouldn't be working toward the goal of helping DPS players progress, and ultimately wouldn't keep tanks and healers in the Dungeon Finder system for very long. We settled on pets and dungeon-found mounts as they’re cosmetic/achievement items that players tend to try to get on their own, so why not change that up and offer them a chance to get some of those elusive pets and mounts in a way that also helps other players? Even if they don't get a pet or mount, or get one they already have, the gold and other goodies still feel rewarding enough that it won't feel like a waste of effort.

We think it's a pretty solid incentive to get tanks and healers queuing, give max-level players another way to collect the pets and mounts they so desire, and above all, to improve wait times for DPS players sitting in queues. In the case of lower level dungeons, it's actually not uncommon for DPS to be the least represented role, and so if this new system works out and we're pleased with the results, we may consider applying this same mechanic to lower level dungeons as well.
This article was originally published in forum thread: Patch 4.1 Preview -- Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms started by Boubouille View original post
Comments 1871 Comments
  1. Rokmarr's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky Mclachlan View Post
    I did not misread what you said. You don't get it. The tank is never JUST sitting there. EVER. The tank is in control of the fight and always trying to maintain that control. He is positioning things for you to be able to dps them without dying. He is taking damage for the group. Never just sitting there. EVER. Got it?
    Again, heroics man. How hard is it for your feeble brain to comprehend? How often as a gear tank do you do anything at all but hit things to keep them on you and soak hits? Most fights last less than two minutes and you're saying you need to be more aware than a dps in that? Face it, you are no better than a dps or healer. So what you have to drag something a few yards? Amazing I have to worship your greatness now. Maybe you should think about the point I'm making before you say anything. It's not you and your tanking awesomeness that makes or breaks a group, I've carried hella bad tanks on dps strength and misdirect/tricks.
  1. Safrienaer's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by patcherke View Post
    Sure, as if those DPS even have time to go solo those instances. We cannot do those while we are queuing in the LFD for half an hour.
    Actually we can. I do it all the time - pop over to say hi to Skadi while waiting for my random Heroic.
  1. stevorino's Avatar
    good stuff. i only hope that it doesnt drive too many "6k-dps-with-345ish-gear-idiots" into the tank role. thats my only concern.
  1. Erto's Avatar
    Woah... I don't know what to think of this. I really wouldn't of been surprised if this was announced a few days ago (April 1st)...
    I agree that it will shorten DPS queue's a lot, there's no doubting that, because high geared Tanks who like mount farming will start queueing for Random Heroics again, so not only will the queue's be shorter, but you've got more chance of getting a decent Tank. Not only this, but it will encourage more players (who like mount farming) to start Tanking. I just don't know if I think that going about it this way is a good idea, unless they made the rewards BoA. I collect all my mounts, titles and achievements on my Priest, I'd love to get any of those mount rewards for him, but unless there becomes a Healer shortage (enough to activate Call to Arms: Healer) it doesn't look like I'll be getting Deathcharger's Reins for a while.
  1. jffmarcelo's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Rokmarr View Post
    So for example, if we just randomly attack things and don't say, kill the healing mob, everything goes according to plan right? Because all dps do is shoot stuff and never bring anything to help right? We don't buff you like crazy or have any knowledge on priority targets at all. Come on man, we don't all have our heads up our *ss.
    Because the majority of the DPS do this right ?
  1. Skippert's Avatar
    Why do we even discuss responsibility of tank/healers?

    WoW has a much bigger problem: tanking and healing is not very exiting (DPS isn't either imo, but it's more 'tasty' to many)

    Healing can require extreme focus, but in the end it's still for the most part: a THANKLESS job. When someone dies, you get the shit. When people stay alive, they keep silent. When someone's DPS is crap, most people don't even bother saying anything about it, or don't have a dmg meter. Besides that, healing still is mostly, watching some bars and filling them up. Nothing's really changed that much since Vanilla in terms of pure actual COMBAT mechanics.

    With tanking/healing, you can either: do your job, or: fail (you lose threat, you place the boss the wrong way, people die). With DPS, you can do more than your job and that's to do more dps than others. You can't keep the boss "harder on yourself" when the other tank can keep agro as well. With DPS, there's more of a competition element.

    How to solve this? A totally new game.
  1. Maliander's Avatar
    The advantage of (marginally?) lower queue times and happier tanks does not seem to outweigh the disadvantages:
    * Will discourage tanks to queue with guildies. This is a pretty big one, every time one or more guildies que with a tank, he's being screwed out of a nice rewardbag.
    * Will make pures feel even more disadvantaged. My main is a mage and already has a hard enough time getting into groups. I could run heroics on my tank alts, but that still doesn't get me the really interesting mount/pet rewards on the character I care about, my main.

    Potential solutions would be to allow tanks to retain the reward bag when queueing with guildies and to make the rewarded mounts/pets BoA (but consumed upon use). The former solution may have a small impact on queue time reduction for non-guilded DPS, the latter may be hard to technically implement.
  1. Raur0s's Avatar
    I can't believe the stupidity of the WoW community. It really is beyond anything in terms of retardness...

    First everyone QQs about how the long times, even thou the issue is easy to solve like a wooden plow.

    Now Blizzard got fed up with the enormous whine so they bribe the people to resolve the issue, and now it's the greatest shitstorm I've seen in like 3 years...

    Some facts for you whiners:
    - You got what you've been asking for like 2 years, your queue will be shorter -> You have a pretty fucking big reward
    - As a result of the above, you will gear up faster
    - The rare mount are retardedly easy to come by, not to mention that most of them are in the game for 4 or more years, if you really wanted it, you would get it already.
    - If someone joins just for the mount, chances are, he/she will be a tank, thus he/she is HELPING you. Now it is kinda dumb to help strangers just for free, isn't it.
  1. konflick's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by stevorino View Post
    good stuff. i only hope that it doesnt drive too many "6k-dps-with-345ish-gear-idiots" into the tank role. thats my only concern.
    as long as you got a good healer i dont see this as a problem as it is the healer who carries the group most of the time anyway no matter how bad a tank is
  1. Riavan's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by roflwaffle View Post
    so anyone who only dps's or heals wont ever be able to get this benefit since tanks are ALWAYS guna be the Call To Arms : /
    I do not get how you guys are seeing it this way, you benefit by having more tanks, hence, getting into instances quicker. It's not like the items from this bonus arn't available to everyone elsewhere in different ways.
  1. Rokmarr's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky Mclachlan View Post
    You playing right has nothing to do with the fact that tanks and healers do have much more responsibility on an encounter. You just don't get it. Play a healer or tank and you'll figure it out.
    I have an 85 priest, and I find it rather fun to heal. The only thing that makes it any more difficult is fights that people can't move out of things or the tank isn't well geared. Possibly both. It's no more stressful or focus requiring than any boss that requires high mobile dps. It's not a fact at all. The fact is you can't handle the thought of not being catered to because you picked a class that can tank.
  1. EreWH's Avatar
    To be honest. I like this change, but, I see one major issue here.

    People who have no clue how to tank, or don't even like it, will get tanking just for the rewards. I see many wipes on the horizon.
    I could just be pessimistic, but... Man.
  1. Erto's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Validity View Post
    I am now rather upset with Blizzard. : /. It's a lazy solution and a simple bandage to a simple problem: It's not that there aren't enough tanks, it's that there aren't enough classes that CAN tank. Like the aesthetics of being a Shaman, but want to tank? Too bad. "Hybridizing" all the pure classes, though it would admittedly be a bitch to balance, would help to solve this problem a lot.
    It's nothing to do with class choice. There are very few people who don't Tank because they'd want to Tank as another class. If someone wants to Tank, they'll roll a Tank class. It's not as if people don't Heal because they want to Heal as a Rogue. The reason behind the lack of Tanks is the responsibility you have and also because you know that if you make a mistake, you're probably going to get flamed HARD by the rest of your group.
  1. Rokmarr's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by jffmarcelo View Post
    Because the majority of the DPS do this right ?
    The majority of the DPS I know yes. I'm sure there is a vast majority of every class that has no idea how to play correctly.
  1. kharma's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by stevorino View Post
    good stuff. i only hope that it doesnt drive too many "6k-dps-with-345ish-gear-idiots" into the tank role. thats my only concern.
    or 352 blue pvp plate gear for tanking.

    I can tank i have an ilvl 352 !
    But that's pvp.
    Don't care, LFD tool says 329 i have 352 a i can.
  1. FeralDruid's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Frozenbeef View Post
    I find this a bit mean to dps. Once the tanks and healers get all the pets and mounts they won't bother doing instances anymore so dps wil be even more left out than before....
    Not much different than it is now; tanks do 1 daily heroic for VP then stop doing them once they no longer require VP rewards.

    At least now they have incentive to tank multiple heroics per day and, assuming the drop rate on the mounts is low, quite possibly past the point when they no longer need the VP.

    From a DPS perspective, any change that gets more people tanking is a good change imo.
  1. Skippert's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Riavan View Post
    I do not get how you guys are seeing it this way, you benefit by having more tanks, hence, getting into instances quicker. It's not like the items from this bonus arn't available to everyone elsewhere in different ways.
    The problem imo is that the tanks will almost always get this, while the healing job might actually be harder than the tanking role.
    It would be, maybe less effective, but more fair to rotate call to arms between healers and tank. We all know it's gonna be tank only, currently.
  1. Rokmarr's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Erto View Post
    It's nothing to do with class choice. There are very few people who don't Tank because they'd want to Tank as another class. If someone wants to Tank, they'll roll a Tank class. It's not as if people don't Heal because they want to Heal as a Rogue. The reason behind the lack of Tanks is the responsibility you have and also because you know that if you make a mistake, you're probably going to get flamed HARD by the rest of your group.
    It has less to do with responsibility and more to do with gear in my opinion.
  1. Luminar's Avatar
    There are two main problems that seem to be cropping up:

    1. DPS (Who have a terrible queue time) seem to find this is just a reward to tanks and healers for their low queue times. They seem to neglect the fact that this will cause some DPS to change to Tank/Healer in order to get these bonuses. However, this is not possible for pure DPS classes and the whole system has yet to be proven to actually work. It's one thing to add a bonus at the end of a particular instance for all, it's a completely different thing to add a bonus onto the end of every instance for specific roles. The simple fact is that we have no idea how much the queues will be affected.

    2. Those who have already collected these rewards through their previous methods feel that getting these items as a bonus for doing things that you would normally be doing anyway isn't a particularly smart or fair method. Plain and simple, they don't want items that they worked for to be given out as "pointless" welfare.

    Some are hoping this is a joke. Others hope this is a temporary fix while they work on a real one. More want this to be permanent. I don't think this will do much to help, but that's just my opinion.
  1. Serenah's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by tremulant View Post
    they need to make the mounts BOA with a 1 time use/charge...
    it would encourage even more tank alts that don't collect mounts/achievements to run dungeons to collect mounts for their non-tank main.
    100% Agree


    I have most of the mounts, so I don't really care, but I can see how pure DPS classes have the disadvantage over hybrids.

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