Patch 4.1 Preview -- Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms
Originally Posted by Blizzard (Blue Tracker)
In patch 4.1 we'll be introducing Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms, a new system intended to lower queue times. Call to Arms will automatically detect which class role is currently the least represented in the queue, and offer them additional rewards for entering the Dungeon Finder queue and completing a random level-85 Heroic dungeon.

Any time the Dungeon Finder queue is longer than a few minutes for level-85 Heroics, the Call to Arms system kicks in and determines which role is the least represented. In the case of tanking being the least represented role, the "Call to Arms: Tanks" icon will display in the Dungeon Finder UI menu where class roles are selected, and will also display on the UI when the queue pops and you are selected to enter a dungeon. Regardless of your role, you'll always be able to see which role currently has been Called to Arms, if any.

Call to Arms is meant to lower wait times by offering additional rewards for queuing as the currently least represented role. To be eligible for the additional rewards you must solo queue for a random level-85 Heroic in the role that is currently being Called to Arms, and complete the dungeon by killing the final boss. Every time you hit these requirements (there is no daily limit) you'll receive a goodie bag that will contain some gold, a chance at a rare gem, a chance at a flask/elixir (determined by spec), a good chance of receiving a non-combat pet (including cross faction pets), and a very rare chance at receiving a mount. The pets offered come from a wide variety of sources, and include companions like the Razzashi Hatchling, Cockatiel, and Tiny Sporebat, but the mounts are those specifically only available through dungeons (not raids), like the Reins of the Raven Lord from Sethekk Halls, Swift White Hawkstrider from Magister's Terrace, and Deathcharger's Reins from Stratholme.

This system is meant to address the unacceptable queue times currently being experienced by those that queue for the DPS role at max level. The long queue times are, of course, caused by a very simple lack of representation in the Dungeon Finder by tanks, and to some extent healers. We don't feel the tanking and healing roles have any inherent issues that are causing the representation disparity, except that fulfilling them carries more responsibility. Understandably, players prefer to take on that responsibility in more organized situations than what the Dungeon Finder offers, but perhaps we can bribe them a little. While this system gives tanks and healers something extra, the incentive is being provided so that we can help players in the DPS role get into more dungeons, get better gear, and continue progressing.

While the gold, gems, flasks, and elixirs are OK incentives, we knew we needed something more substantial. We had briefly considered Valor Points and epics, but decided that wouldn't be working toward the goal of helping DPS players progress, and ultimately wouldn't keep tanks and healers in the Dungeon Finder system for very long. We settled on pets and dungeon-found mounts as they’re cosmetic/achievement items that players tend to try to get on their own, so why not change that up and offer them a chance to get some of those elusive pets and mounts in a way that also helps other players? Even if they don't get a pet or mount, or get one they already have, the gold and other goodies still feel rewarding enough that it won't feel like a waste of effort.

We think it's a pretty solid incentive to get tanks and healers queuing, give max-level players another way to collect the pets and mounts they so desire, and above all, to improve wait times for DPS players sitting in queues. In the case of lower level dungeons, it's actually not uncommon for DPS to be the least represented role, and so if this new system works out and we're pleased with the results, we may consider applying this same mechanic to lower level dungeons as well.
This article was originally published in forum thread: Patch 4.1 Preview -- Dungeon Finder: Call to Arms started by Boubouille View original post
Comments 1855 Comments
  1. mmoc904672c393's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Darthballz View Post
    And then comes raids where DPS matters a whole bunch with enrage timers. You are so wrong with what you said. How about next time you are on a boss all the DPS just kill themselves from the start and let the tank and healer down the boss. We'll see how that goes.
    Oh stop it. Your comparison is laughable. If you have managed to get yourself into a raiding environment, than those concerns he brought up does not apply to you because you would - in the majority of cases - run the daily dungeon with your guildies.
  1. MugenNoKaze's Avatar
    I completely agree with you guys...
    Im a pally/DK tank
    and at first I thought I read that DPS were getting a bit more points to compensate for insane queue times...
    Yes this is cool for me but.... wtf we already have instant queues DPS should be having this
    Because of this now there will be even MORE crappy stupid tanks out just to get this shit

    not good blizzard :S
  1. Buu's Avatar
    Just tought about something. Now DPS can actually dismiss Tanks and Healers, and demand they do the entire run, because:
    a) Tanks will be immediately added to the group, after a role check, so their bargain chip to not be kicked is gone;
    b) No goodies for you until you kill the final boss, so if you're stubborn you're risking to have to enter another whole dungeon from the start, after being kicked;
    c) Forget the plan of bringing friends to protect yourself from vote kick, goodie bags are for those SOLO-QUEUEING.
  1. quras's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by lotj View Post
    See: Ozruk

    Probably about a quarter of the heroic stonecore runs I've done ended with all of the dps dead after the first shatter. Melee dps would try to eat it, and ranged dps wouldn't have a dot on them and would die from the paralyze. The fight takes five minutes, but still...

    A tank/healer duoing a heroic boss (or even a tank soloing the boss from ~30% down) wasn't exactly uncommon for me. People like to stand in the fire.
    So what your saying is since the boss was at 30% you were able to get him down the rest of the way.

    Good thing those DPS were there to help and get him to that 30% or else you would have never made it.

    Damn those DPS for even being there. Someone should reward those tanks and healers for just showing up. I mean, they don't even need DPS right?

    This expansion is getting worse and worse. Lets just bribe some class roles into showing up. It didn't really work in WoTLK but maybe it will work now.
  1. mmocef71e99c15's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by KonkeroaR View Post
    Simple solution to all the QQ about this fantastic system.

    Make the mounts and pets that drop out of the loot bags BoA.
    This is indeed an awesome idea. Means that people who are pure dps as main could roll a tank on the side and still get the benefits for their main. A win-win solution.
  1. MagusUnion's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Singen View Post
    I'm liking this change quite a bit. Also whats up with the QQ? This is going to let DPS (the people complaining) into random dungeons faster...
    With shit tanks and healers who don't know the job, and want something free just because they 'signed up'...

    Blizzard should leave this issue alone, and the player base needs to realize that THEY MUST LEARN THE CLASS AND THE FIGHT MECHANICS!

    Failure to do so limits the level of progression for not only guilds, but entire servers of people trying to complete content. All this solution will do is give people more of an excuse to 'suck' at their class, and hurt the PvE experience overall.

    With that said, I think Crabby needs to be introduced as an actual class/mechanic teacher to help recognized how fights work, and how they can adapt to them. Because lets face it, people don't think when it comes to video games...
  1. powerstuck's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Zaflis View Post
    Too bad people are not going to give up their PvP spec for tanking. Blizz should have just implemented triplespec that would solve this problem aswell.
    I honestly would prefer a tank with pvp spec rather than a triplespec and dps/pvp geared player acting like he knows how to tank.
  1. lotj's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by quras View Post
    So what your saying is since the boss was at 30% you were able to get him down the rest of the way.
    The first shatter on Orzuk? No, it happens within the first 10%.

    Your arguments are silly. Your lumping all of the DPS in a group together as one giant ball and then arguing their combined responsibility is equal to or greater than a tank, and then using that to infer their individual responsibility is equal to or greater than a tank. However, there's one tank and three dps in a 5-man group (plus the tank is probably putting out as much damage as a low-tier dps), so that alone refutes your argument of individual equivalency based on equivalency of role.

    Raids it becomes even more ridiculous -- 1-2 tanks, 5-7 dps. You lose one tank and it's a wipe. You lose one dps and you roll your eyes, but continue on.

    EDIT: Also, my 30% example was one-on-one with the boss. Me (tank) up, 4 other players dead due to failing at the mechanics.
  1. Killua1001's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by lotj View Post
    See: Ozruk

    Probably about a quarter of the heroic stonecore runs I've done ended with all of the dps dead after the first shatter. Melee dps would try to eat it, and ranged dps wouldn't have a dot on them and would die from the paralyze. The fight takes five minutes, but still...

    A tank/healer duoing a heroic boss (or even a tank soloing the boss from ~30% down) wasn't exactly uncommon for me. People like to stand in the fire.
    Every healer nowadays can dispell the paralyze, so don't blame the ranged dps for not dotting the boss. As I'm playing a hunter I can't put up a DoT on him. And if a warlock or mage fails, then dispell them. If they die it's your fault as a healer.
  1. Kiro's Avatar
    This will make very little to no impact, and will give a false sense of effectiveness when released as it'll be the new dungeons that make people queue up for an incredibly short time. Being off-spec'd raid geared tank, this gives me no motivation to go farm old-outdated mounts in which I have 1 out of the 3. It's still too painful to run these dungeons, and the Cata ones are beat and I plan to never step foot into them again regardless. I geared my alts through horrible arenas, bgs, and craftables as I will never go back into the experiences I received while doing heroics with pugs, as well as I ran them so often for my main when I initially hit 85 that I don't want to even look at those places. That's just my own, the 8 other guildies who can tank/heal, and a lot of random forum posters opinion. They just are not properly addressing the MAIN issue here, instead, putting a bandaid on a mortal wound.
  1. Idria's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Drekmar View Post
    Oh, this is just ridiculous.

    Everyone is complainig whats harder. But most of you compare it from the rotations view point, thats wrong.

    Its not about that people dont like to tank, its about that people WONT TANK FOR IDIOTs.

    Look at this :

    A, You are a Tank, you screw. None can make up for you (maybe healer) . You die, healer dies, all DPS die. Everyone blames you for failing.

    B, You are a Healer, you screw. None can make up for you. Tank dies, You die, DPS as well. Everyone blames you for failing.

    C, You are a DPS, you screw. Healer/Tank/2 remaining DPS can make up for you. You die, no one else. You blame tank for not holding aggro or healer not healing you when you stood in flames.

    Everybody is trollin what role is harder. Its not about role, but about the player behind the class.

    No matter WHAT they will give us, most of tanks wont tank LFG PuG HCs.
    And the reason? It is not because something is hard, its because most of the playerbase sucks/is lazy/etc.


    AS LONG AS THERE ARE PLAYERS THAT MAKE RANDOM HCs TO WORST NIGHTMARE THERE WILL BE THE SHORTAGE OF TANKS.
    A dps can kite/cc trash quite good if they know how to do it
  1. mmocef71e99c15's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Diurdi View Post
    Talk about fixing the symptom and ignoring the disease.

    The real problem is much deeper with tanks/healers being much harder to play than DPS.
    No, a lot of the people who actually tanks and heal because they enjoy it BECAUSE it is hard, a challenge and not a faceroll. So dumbing tanking/healing down doesn't really solve anything because while this may attract some current dps'ers to switch to it, it will make current tanks/healers bored.

    They tried the dumb-it-down approach in WotLK and it didn't solve anything.

    The problem is not hard/easy, it is about RESPONSIBILITY, I think, something that will never go away as long as there is only one tank and only one healer, but three dps to share the burden of their group. Then again, some people like responsibility, some don't. Those who do are probably the ones playing tank (and to some extent healer).


    gold/gem inflation
    It's called deflation actually when prices go down. Inflation is when prices go up.
  1. Octopus's Avatar
    Bribe bag needs to be BoA or this wont work.
  1. mmoc6f961e454e's Avatar
    Incase you didn't notice, this is a way off Blizz trying to get more people queueing on tanks with alts/offspeccs...it's a nice attempt, but the endresult won't be enough so dps will still be punished more.

    Good idea, but make it different...dps just never will get a goodie bag like this.
  1. Deathsenemy's Avatar
    I just hve to add this.

    DPS cries about Que times.
    DPS cries when they wipe and blame tank when DPS stood in bad shit. Thus making tanks hate pugging, in turn making longer que times.
    DPS cries when a tank wants to skip a boss
    DPS is NOW crying because tanks get extra shit for dealing with all the DPS crying, all to make the DPS stop crying about Que times.

    So, DPS, how do we make you happy? Give you a sword and shield? hrmm?
  1. Rotesbart's Avatar
    But I have all the mounts mentioned, I hope they aren't the only ones. I wouldn't mind some of the lame random dragon dropped ones from the new heroics, since at least I don't have those already.
  1. Krullthor's Avatar
    Blizzard makes dedicated LFG channel to solve lfg trade chat spam, people don't use it
    Blizzard makes LFD tool, people complain about the wait time
    Blizzard tries to solve the wait time, people complain about benefits they aren't getting.

    If Blizzard would hand out free ponies (to use a blizz metaphore) to everyone, I'm betting you'd complain about the cost of feeding it.

    I'm still hoping they one day invent a tool that tracks if a user ever cried on a forum and if so makes the first boss they encounter crit the player for 110% hp, takes their gear and does a /spit emote.
  1. quras's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by lotj View Post
    The first shatter on Orzuk? No, it happens within the first 10%.

    Your arguments are silly. Your lumping all of the DPS in a group together as one giant ball and then arguing their combined responsibility is equal to or greater than a tank, and then using that to infer their individual responsibility is equal to or greater than a tank. However, there's one tank and three dps in a 5-man group (plus the tank is probably putting out as much damage as a low-tier dps), so that alone refutes your argument of individual equivalency based on equivalency of role.

    Raids it becomes even more ridiculous -- 1-2 tanks, 5-7 dps. You lose one tank and it's a wipe. You lose one dps and you roll your eyes, but continue on.

    EDIT: Also, my 30% example was one-on-one with the boss. Me (tank) up, 4 other players dead due to failing at the mechanics.
    And yet I'll guarantee you wont even get to him without DPS. Be that 1 or 3.

    Don't sit back and say you have such a harder time or your class is so much more responsible for the life and death of a run, you deserve some special bag of goodies. Knowing you wouldn't even be there without healers and DPS.

    It takes all 3 roles to get the job done. Not just one and there shouldn't be some special reward just cause a tank or healer or DPS arrived on the scene.

    Hell, I roll exclusively tank and healer toons and I'm not stupid enough to think I deserve anything when it can't be done without the other 2 roles.
  1. captin hero's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by quras View Post
    So what your saying is since the boss was at 30% you were able to get him down the rest of the way.

    Good thing those DPS were there to help and get him to that 30% or else you would have never made it.

    Damn those DPS for even being there. Someone should reward those tanks and healers for just showing up. I mean, they don't even need DPS right?

    This expansion is getting worse and worse. Lets just bribe some class roles into showing up. It didn't really work in WoTLK but maybe it will work now.
    what was the wotlk bribe? other than dps paying for tank queues
    that money was well earned though 8k+ dps prot warrior with dps gear (pre 4.0)
  1. Begrudge's Avatar
    the first day this comes out dps will have a call to arms becoz of all the rerolls to tanks and healers so no need to QQ just be on that day and run the shit outta some randoms

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