MMO-Champion - Ask the Devs #6 - Guild Advancement - Answers
Ask the Devs #6 - Guild Advancement - Answers
Originally Posted by Draztal (Blue Tracker)
The answers are in from our last installment of Ask the Devs. Please keep in mind that each edition of Ask the Devs is focused on a specific topic, as noted in the thread title

The guild perks system makes it unnaturally hard to start a new guild, since a guild without all perks is at an obvious disadvantage in recruitment. In addition, it rewards just recruiting random people (who might only care about the perks) to get guild XP. What are your thoughts on this? Will it be addressed? – Lolisa [Europe, English], Mith [North America]

We knew when we decided to add guild features for Cataclysm that this was one of the risks. If the guild perks and rewards aren't interesting, then there is no motivation to join a guild or work to improve your guild. On the other hand if they are too powerful, then you feel shackled to your old guild, even if it's not a healthy relationship for you. We were careful to only choose perks that didn't contribute to player power, and we let you keep any rewards you earn if you ever have to leave your guild. The perks are nice, no doubt, but you're going to have less fun in an established guild of jerks than you would starting your own guild with fewer perks.

We don't think recruiting random people is healthy for a guild. Rewards are never going to be a substitute for strong social ties. We really encourage as many people as possible to seek out guilds (and we hope the new Guild Finder will help with that), but joining a guild at random will likely end in tears.

On the other hand, there may be some benefit to having less churn on starting guilds. Before Cataclysm, some guilds would get started halfheartedly and then crumble again after a few weeks or months. Maintaining an active guild asks a lot of the guild master and leading officers. If you join an established guild in Cataclysm, hopefully it will continue to be around for awhile. But because of reputation, even brand new guilds may seem like a more serious option than they were before Cataclysm, since the founders of the guild know that anyone interested is likely looking for a long-term home and are not just hopping from guild to guild.


Leveling guild speed varies depending on the amount of players. Have you considered tweaking the system so that guilds with fewer members get more experience per player and bigger guilds get less to even it out? Are there plans to allow smaller guilds to level their guild faster? – 信蜂 火星小喵喵 [Taiwan], Sergan [Latin America], Jardar [Europe, German], Паладиа [Europe, Russian], Amasisa [Europe, Spanish], Shory, 부너맨/노대현혹, Meltdown, 치킨아고마워/유진님 [Korea]

Guild Challenges coming in patch 4.1 are designed to help address this issue. Obviously we already enforce a cap on the amount of XP that can be gained per day to keep the disparity from being too large, but it’s clear that smaller guilds still need some help. We'll monitor the impact of Guild Challenges and see if any further changes need to be made.


Are you planning to address the issue of Guild Leaders mass kicking members, once the guild reaches level 25? – Bloodbliss [North America], Юхани [Europe, Russian]

We don't really have any interest in controlling who a guild leader chooses to kick, or when. Guilds are fairly transparent and simple player-run groups, and we have to be extremely careful about what systems we implement that impact how people can operate their guilds. We could absolutely make it more difficult for guild leaders to kick their members, and that might help very slightly with these situations, but the result would actually be that guild leaders would just be much less likely to invite new members. We want people to be in guilds, as opposed to making guild masters afraid that if they invite someone they may never be able to kick them if they don't work out.

Allowing players to keep some level of guild reputation is an option we can look into to help with this situation, though.


Is there any way to recover a guild which is deliberately disbanded by evil account hacker or lunatic guild leader? – 哇靠不是吧 [Taiwan]

The best way to deal with this situation is to immediately contact a World of Warcraft Game Master.


Are we going to see guild houses someday so we could finally get a special gather place for the guild, to meet and interact easily? – Ellidryl[Europe, French], Греланд[Europe, Russian], Ledieri [Europe, Spanish], Bodywreckér [North America]

Guild housing is something we have discussed many times. It would be neat to have a place for people to hang out, but every time it has come up as a possibility we don't think that is worth the amount of time and resources it would take to implement (and do it right). This is one of those features where if we ever decided to do it, the benefit would have to outweigh other content we could be working on. Also, we don't feel that we need any new ways for players to hide themselves away. If possible we at least like people to be hanging around in the cities, if not out in the world. We know that many guilds, despite lack of official guild housing, have designated meeting locations throughout the world, which we think is really cool. If you don't have one yet it might be something to explore.


Why is guild experience capped daily instead of weekly? – Omegal [North America], Nuckels [Europe, English]

We implemented a daily cap so that more players get a chance to contribute every day. A weekly cap would make this more difficult since a guild might hit the cap the first day, leaving no experience for the other members to gain over the remaining 6 days of the week. If you could only login on Thursday, and the cap was always already hit before you could log in, you might not be as interested in this whole guild progression thing.

However, we will be reducing the impact of the cap as we move though the Cataclysm patches. We will most likely start by increasing the daily cap, and removing it from more of the higher levels.


Why isn't guild XP from quests a factor of character level, quest difficulty, and intended quest level, instead of being derived directly from XP gained? Why is guild reputation so hard to gain before level 70? It feels as though it's harder to gain reputation with your guild at the beginning and easier as you gain levels; shouldn't it be the other way around? – Atun [North America], Threshold [Europe, English], Helíana [Latin America]

The experience gained from a quest is directly related to all of these factors, which is why we use it as a basis to reward guild experience. Clearly this value is much smaller at lower levels and we know that this does not feel great with the current tuning. We're going to tune the XP multiplier for doing lower level quests so it doesn't feel like such a waste. Guild reputation suffers from this same multiplier issue too, and when we tune the experience the rep gain will be improved as well. Rep gain will also be much improved though in patch 4.1 with the introduction of the new guild tabards, and increased values on clearing dungeons, raids and winning arenas and battlegrounds.


It seems that the new guild system is killing off the Pick Up Group culture in KR. In KR, raids were generally done through PUG and players did not care what kind of guilds they joined for raids. Can we expect more localized guild features to support the unique raid culture of the Korean region? –밥상의달인, Jeran, 블러드베인 [Korea]

We will continue to pay close attention to and work to protect the various in-game cultures in each region. However, we don't have plans to change the structure of the system at this time.


Are there any plans to allow for easier alt access to the same guild rewards as someone's main character? Perhaps some kind of +rep item that is BoA and can only be bought by an exalted character? – Serule [North America], Xheevas [Europe, French]

This is one of the main reasons 4.1 has new guild tabards with 50/100% bonus to rep. We made sure to place these at friendly and honored so they would be easy to obtain by alts. We are considering adding an even larger bonus to an exalted, BOA version as well. Great minds think alike!


Will there be additional levels of rewards for those guilds that have reached the cap in future patches? Are you going to add levels beyond 25? – Sergan [Latin America], Carnesîr [Europe, German], Zippi [Europe, English], Gabän [Europe, Spanish]

Yes, we will continue to add rewards to the system as necessary. A great example is the guild reward we intend to add in patch 4.2 for guilds that obtain the new legendary staff. Guilds at level 25 also get the benefit of large gold deposits for completing Guild Challenges. Capping the guild system at level 25 felt right for the amount of content we wanted to provide in Cataclysm. We designed the system with expansions in mind, so raising the cap is something players will most likely see down the road.
This article was originally published in forum thread: Ask the Devs #6 - Guild Advancement - Answers started by Boubouille View original post
Comments 28 Comments
  1. lewis10123's Avatar
    firstlolololo
  1. Asur's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by lewis10123 View Post
    firstlolololo
    banned lololol

    OT: Seems like they are just saying screw it to new and upstarting guilds, I think they need to removed the daily cap or expand it eventually because it takes months to get up there in levels.
  1. lakhesis's Avatar
    Was it just me, or did week 6's dev Q&A have a bit of a "uh.. guys.. we're running out of topics to ask them about..." feel to it?
  1. rmViper's Avatar
    It seems that the new guild system is killing off the Pick Up Group culture in KR. In KR, raids were generally done through PUG and players did not care what kind of guilds they joined for raids. Can we expect more localized guild features to support the unique raid culture of the Korean region?
    What the hell?
    Unique raid culture of the Korean region? Are you effin kidding me?
    These people are asshats...
  1. blackangel209's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Asur View Post
    banned lololol

    OT: Seems like they are just saying screw it to new and upstarting guilds, I think they need to removed the daily cap or expand it eventually because it takes months to get up there in levels.
    If they removed the daily cap, it would screw most new and upstarting guilds even harder than it does now.
  1. tenzing21's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by lakhesis View Post
    Was it just me, or did week 6's dev Q&A have a bit of a "uh.. guys.. we're running out of topics to ask them about..." feel to it?
    Blizz is such fail. The OBVIOUS answer to guild rep/size is to have a bigger rep cut-off for level 1 guilds than level 24. Really there should be no daily limit for guilds level 1-5, then institute a sliding scale that caps the cap at 24. Not too farging difficult to figure out...
  1. Vasz's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by lewis10123 View Post
    firstlolololo
    And banned!

    I'm not sure that guild rewards was a bad idea, although some guilds will naturally level faster than others. As soon as super guilds start farming HC content, it becomes pretty un-balanced though. All new guilds need are 10 members to get from 1-85 and that's enough to get you most of the good guild perks.
  1. Valanna's Avatar
    "Yes, we will continue to add rewards to the system as necessary. A great example is the guild reward we intend to add in patch 4.2 for guilds that obtain the new legendary staff"

    So that's confirmed then. Thanks.
  1. wildemu's Avatar
    bullshit company answers again. Might as well have robo answer these questions.
  1. Serpentsatellite's Avatar
    Was it just me, or was the comment about not wanting people to join random guilds followed immediately by "that's why we added the guild finder system!" severely painful to the brain.
  1. dahawk's Avatar
    Yes, we will continue to add rewards to the system as necessary. A great example is the guild reward we intend to add in patch 4.2 for guilds that obtain the new legendary staff.


    hmmm interesting
  1. Pumps's Avatar
    Yeah, how about allowing us to buy a tabard for real money (say 1000$) which will increase guild rep by 1000% ? (For those of us in one man guilds)
  1. zrankfappa's Avatar
    It seems that the new guild system is killing off the Pick Up Group culture in KR. In KR, raids were generally done through PUG and players did not care what kind of guilds they joined for raids. Can we expect more localized guild features to support the unique raid culture of the Korean region?
    It seems that the new guid system has no perks which benefit the transgender raiding culture. Can we expect guild features to be added which support the transgendered raiding culture?

    um, ya well that would be awesome for sure, but we don't have anything in mind right now ...
  1. Charsi's Avatar
    I liked the part where they answered the disband question with "contact a GM". Even though GM's have said they won't restore guild levels. Awesome.

    *hugs authenticator*
  1. Azrile's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Pumps View Post
    Yeah, how about allowing us to buy a tabard for real money (say 1000$) which will increase guild rep by 1000% ? (For those of us in one man guilds)
    There is no such thing as a one man guild.

    I am actually happy they took the hard stance about not punishing guilds who kick people at 25. Some part of wow should remain the MMO aspect where you don´t join something randomly just to get a reward.
  1. subanark's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by rmViper View Post
    What the hell?
    Unique raid culture of the Korean region? Are you effin kidding me?
    These people are asshats...
    Nope, in Korea guilds have typically been a social group you are with, not at all related to who you raid with. The server firsts in korea (at least before cata) look more like a PUG if you look at the screenshot. Also note that raids are serious business, if you screw up expect to get fined. If you want an item, expect to pay for it (the proceeds are divided between the raid members).

    Also, legendary staff being linked to the guild system... hrm, I wonder what that would mean. Most probably a limit on how quickly a guild can gain a legendary, meaning that smaller guilds can get more legendary per player, while massive multi 25 man guilds will suffer in this regard.
  1. zrankfappa's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Azrile View Post
    I am actually happy they took the hard stance about not punishing guilds who kick people at 25. Some part of wow should remain the MMO aspect where you don´t join something randomly just to get a reward.
    i agree ... a guild should be able to spam and invite everyone who will accept in to the guild, then as soon as the guild dings 25 boot all the randoms because like you shouldn't be joining a random guild for the perks cause it is supposed to be like real relationships and stuff.
  1. blackangel209's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by subanark View Post
    Also, legendary staff being linked to the guild system... hrm, I wonder what that would mean. Most probably a limit on how quickly a guild can gain a legendary, meaning that smaller guilds can get more legendary per player, while massive multi 25 man guilds will suffer in this regard.
    Um, you completely misread that. The only link between the guild system and the legendary is that you'll unlock a reward for having one.
  1. sethers656's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by zrankfappa View Post
    i agree ... a guild should be able to spam and invite everyone who will accept in to the guild, then as soon as the guild dings 25 boot all the randoms because like you shouldn't be joining a random guild for the perks cause it is supposed to be like real relationships and stuff.
    I am a GM of a guild where we did this. I mass recruited anyone in the 70-84 range just so we could get Guild Level 25 fast. Now this might sound horrible at first, but it really worked out for all of us.

    Now in my guild, I put a rank for these "questers" where they didnt have acess to anything expensive in the guild bank but could still get cheap low level stuff in the first tab. By joining or guild, they got +10% experience, +10% rep, and all the other perks we had at the time. Also, they got a social place to talk to people and learn more about the game, because for a lot of them, it was their first toon.

    Now that we have obtained Guild Level 25, I am slowly kicking all the ones that never talk and/or seem like complete idiots.... I think it worked out for a lot of the pople I mass recruited and our guild as a whole....

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