MMO-Champion - Patch 4.2 - Firelands Raid Loot List, Blue Posts


Road to Patch 4.2 - Firelands Raid Loot List
Today I have a nice compilation of all the items you can expect to find in the Firelands raid instance! All pages have been updated with screenshots and you should have a good idea of what to expect in the instance. For additional items check out the following articles:



If everything goes well, I'll have absolutely everything compiled very nicely before the end of the week!

Level Type Spec Slot Name Boss
391Misc.Crystallized FirestoneAll Bosses - Upgrade
404StaffSpell DPSTwo-HandDragonwrath, Tarecgosa's RestLegendary Staff Quest
397BowPhysical DPSRangedArathar- the Eye of FlameRagnaros (H)
397MaceMeleeTwo-HandSulfuras- The Extinguished HandRagnaros (H)
397MaceSpell SpiritMain HandKo'gun- Hammer of the FirelordRagnaros (H)
397StaffSpell DPSTwo-HandSho'ravon, Greatstaff of AnnihilationRagnaros (H)
391AxeMeleeOne-HandGatecrasherBaleroc, the Gatekeeper (H)
391AxeMeleeOne-HandBlackcleave ChopperRaid Trash - Upgrade
391AxeMeleeTwo-HandSkullstealer GreataxeShannox (H)
391AxeSpell SpiritMain HandEye of PurificationUnknown
391CrossbowPhysical DPSRangedArbalest of Erupting FuryLord Rhyolith (H)
391DaggerMeleeOne-HandAlysra's RazorAlysrazor (H)
391DaggerPhysical DPSOne-HandFeeding FrenzyShannox (H)
391DaggerPhysical DPSOne-HandAvool's Incendiary ShankerUnknown
391DaggerPhysical DPSOne-HandEntrail DisgorgerUnknown
391DaggerSpell DPSMain HandChelley's Sterilized ScalpelRaid Trash - Upgrade
391GunPhysical DPSRangedLava Bolt CrossbowRaid Trash - Upgrade
391MacePhysical DPSOne-HandShatterskull BonecrusherUnknown
391Off-HandSpell DPSOff-HandMolten ScreamBaleroc, the Gatekeeper (H)
391Off-HandSpell SpiritOff-HandGoblet of AngerShannox (H)
391PolearmPhysical DPSTwo-HandRanseur of HatredRaid Trash - Upgrade
391ShieldSpell SpiritOff HandWard of the Red WidowBeth'tilac (H)
391ShieldTankOff HandShard of TormentBaleroc, the Gatekeeper (H)
391StaffPhysical DPSTwo-HandFandral's Flamescythe (Video)Majordomo Staghelm (H)
391StaffSpell DPSTwo-HandFuneral PyreBeth'tilac (H)
391StaffSpell DPSTwo-HandRunestaff of NordrassilLegendary Staff Quest
391StaffSpell DPSTwo-HandSpire of Scarlet PainRaid Trash - Upgrade
391StaffSpell SpiritTwo-HandSmoldering Censer of PurityUnknown
391SwordMeleeTwo-HandZoid's Firelit GreatswordUnknown
391SwordSpell DPSMain HandVolcanospikeLord Rhyolith (H)
391SwordSpell DPSMain HandFirethorn MindslicerUnknown
391SwordTankOne-HandMandible of Beth'tilacBeth'tilac (H)
391WandSpell DPSRangedStinger of the Flaming ScorpionMajordomo Staghelm (H)
391PlateHandsFlickering HandguardsBaleroc, the Gatekeeper (H)
391PlateMeleeChestBreastplate of Shifting VisionsMajordomo Staghelm (H)
391PlateMeleeFeetArachnaflame TreadsBeth'tilac (H)
391PlateMeleeHandsFireskin GauntletsLord Rhyolith (H)
391PlateMeleeHeadGreathelm of the Voracious MawAlysrazor (H)
391PlateMeleeLegsLavaworm LegplatesAlysrazor (H)
391PlateMeleeWaistUncrushable Belt of FuryShannox (H)
391PlateMeleeWristEarthcrack BracersLord Rhyolith (H)
391PlateSpell SpiritChestClutch of the FiremotherAlysrazor (H)
391PlateSpell SpiritFeetTreads of the Penitent ManMajordomo Staghelm (H)
391PlateSpell SpiritHandsGrips of the Raging GiantLord Rhyolith (H)
391PlateSpell SpiritHeadCasque of FlameBaleroc, the Gatekeeper (H)
391PlateSpell SpiritLegsLegplates of Absolute ControlShannox (H)
391PlateSpell SpiritShoulderSpaulders of Manifold EyesBeth'tilac (H)
391PlateSpell SpiritWristBracers of the Dread HunterShannox (H)
391PlateTankChestCarapace of Imbibed FlameBeth'tilac (H)
391PlateTankFeetCracked Obsidian StompersLord Rhyolith (H)
391PlateTankHeadHelm of Blazing GloryBaleroc, the Gatekeeper (H)
391PlateTankLegsLegplates of Frenzied DevotionShannox (H)
391PlateTankShoulderSpaulders of Recurring FlameAlysrazor (H)
397PlateTankShoulderPauldrons of Roaring FlameRagnaros (H)
391PlateTankWristBracers of the Fiery PathMajordomo Staghelm (H)
391MailShoulderFlickering ShouldersBeth'tilac (H)
391MailPhysical DPSChestFlaming Core ChestguardLord Rhyolith (H)
391MailPhysical DPSFeetDecimation TreadsBaleroc, the Gatekeeper (H)
391MailPhysical DPSHandsGrips of Unerring PrecisionMajordomo Staghelm (H)
391MailPhysical DPSHeadScalp of the Bandit PrinceShannox (H)
391MailPhysical DPSLegsMoltenfeather LeggingsAlysrazor (H)
391MailPhysical DPSWristHide-Bound ChainsRaid Trash - Upgrade
391MailSpell DPSShoulderCraterflame SpauldersAlysrazor (H)
391MailSpell SpiritChestGatekeeper's EmbraceBaleroc, the Gatekeeper (H)
391MailSpell SpiritFeetTreads of Implicit ObedienceShannox (H)
391MailSpell SpiritHandsClawshaper GauntletsAlysrazor (H)
397MailSpell SpiritHeadCrown of FlameRagnaros (H)
391MailSpell SpiritLegsThoracic Flame KiltBeth'tilac (H)
391MailSpell SpiritWristLava Line WristbandsLord Rhyolith (H)
391LeatherShoulderFlickering ShoulderpadsShannox (H)
391LeatherWristFlickering WristbandsAlysrazor (H)
391LeatherMeleeHeadHood of Rampant DisdainLord Rhyolith (H)
391LeatherMeleeWaistRiplimb's Lost CollarRaid Trash - Upgrade
391LeatherPhysical DPSChestBreastplate of the Incendiary SoulBaleroc, the Gatekeeper (H)
391LeatherPhysical DPSFeetSandals of Leaping CoalsMajordomo Staghelm (H)
391LeatherPhysical DPSHandsGloves of Dissolving SmokeShannox (H)
391LeatherPhysical DPSLegsCinderweb LeggingsBeth'tilac (H)
391LeatherPhysical DPSShoulderShoulderpads of the Forgotten GateBaleroc, the Gatekeeper (H)
391LeatherSpell SpiritChestIncendic ChestguardLord Rhyolith (H)
391LeatherSpell SpiritFeetPhoenix-Down TreadsAlysrazor (H)
391LeatherSpell SpiritHandsCindersilk GlovesBeth'tilac (H)
391LeatherSpell SpiritHeadCowl of the Clicking MenaceBeth'tilac (H)
391LeatherSpell SpiritLegsFirecat LeggingsMajordomo Staghelm (H)
391LeatherSpell SpiritWristGlowing Wing BracersBaleroc, the Gatekeeper (H)
391ClothHeadFlickering CowlLord Rhyolith (H)
391ClothSpell DPSChestRobes of Smoldering DevastationBeth'tilac (H)
391ClothSpell DPSFeetCoalwalker SandalsShannox (H)
397ClothSpell DPSHandsFingers of IncinerationRagnaros (H)
391ClothSpell DPSLegsLeggings of Billowing FireAlysrazor (H)
391ClothSpell DPSShoulderMantle of Closed DoorsBaleroc, the Gatekeeper (H)
397ClothSpell DPSWaistMajordomo's Chain of OfficeRagnaros (H)
391ClothSpell DPSWristWristwraps of Arrogant DoomMajordomo Staghelm (H)
391BackPhysical DPSBackDreadfire DrapeLord Rhyolith (H)
391BackSpell DPSBackWings of FlameAlysrazor (H)
391FingerMeleeFingerAlysrazor's BandAlysrazor (H)
391FingerPhysical DPSFingerWidow's KissBeth'tilac (H)
391FingerSpell DPSFingerCrystal Prison BandShannox (H)
391FingerTankFingerStalwart Ember SealRaid Trash - Upgrade
391NeckMeleeNeckNecklace of FetishesShannox (H)
391NeckMeleeNeckFirebound GorgetRaid Trash - Upgrade
397NeckPhysical DPSNeckChoker of the Vanquished LordRagnaros (H)
391NeckSpell DPSNeckFlowform ChokerMajordomo Staghelm (H)
391NeckSpell SpiritNeckHeartstone of RhyolithLord Rhyolith (H)
391TrinketTrinketSpidersilk SpindleBeth'tilac (H)
391TrinketMeleeTrinketApparatus of Khaz'gorothRaid Trash - Upgrade
391TrinketPhysical DPSTrinketThe HungererMajordomo Staghelm (H)
391TrinketSpell DPSTrinketJaws of DefeatMajordomo Staghelm (H)
391TrinketSpell DPSTrinketNecromantic FocusBaleroc, the Gatekeeper (H)
391TrinketSpell DPSTrinketEye of Blazing PowerAlysrazor (H)
391TrinketTankTrinketScales of LifeRaid Trash - Upgrade
397TrinketMeleeTrinketVessel of AccelerationRagnaros (H)
397TrinketPhysical DPSTrinketMatrix RestabilizerRagnaros (H)
397TrinketSpell DPSTrinketVariable Pulse Lightning CapacitorRagnaros (H)
Level Type Spec Slot Name Boss
384BowPhysical DPSRangedArathar- the Eye of FlameRagnaros
384MaceMeleeTwo-HandSulfuras- The Extinguished HandRagnaros
384MaceSpell SpiritMain HandKo'gun- Hammer of the FirelordRagnaros
384StaffSpell DPSTwo-HandSho'ravon, Greatstaff of AnnihilationRagnaros
378AxeMeleeOne-HandGatecrasherBaleroc, the Gatekeeper
378AxeMeleeOne-HandBlackcleave ChopperRaid Trash
378AxeMeleeTwo-HandSkullstealer GreataxeShannox
378AxeSpell SpiritMain HandEye of PurificationUnknown
378CrossbowPhysical DPSRangedArbalest of Erupting FuryLord Rhyolith
378DaggerMeleeOne-HandAlysra's RazorAlysrazor
378DaggerPhysical DPSOne-HandFeeding FrenzyShannox
378DaggerPhysical DPSOne-HandAvool's Incendiary ShankerUnknown
378DaggerPhysical DPSOne-HandEntrail DisgorgerUnknown
378DaggerSpell DPSMain HandChelley's Sterilized ScalpelRaid Trash
378FingerMeleeFingerAlysrazor's BandAlysrazor
378FingerPhysical DPSFingerWidow's KissBeth'tilac
378FingerSpell DPSFingerCrystal Prison BandShannox
378FingerTankFingerStalwart Ember SealRaid Trash
378GunPhysical DPSRangedLava Bolt CrossbowRaid Trash
378MacePhysical DPSOne-HandShatterskull BonecrusherUnknown
378Off-HandSpell DPSOff-HandMolten ScreamBaleroc, the Gatekeeper
378Off-HandSpell SpiritOff-HandGoblet of AngerShannox
378PolearmPhysical DPSTwo-HandRanseur of HatredRaid Trash
378ShieldSpell SpiritOff HandWard of the Red WidowBeth'tilac
378ShieldTankOff HandShard of TormentBaleroc, the Gatekeeper
378StaffPhysical DPSTwo-HandFandral's FlamescytheMajordomo Staghelm
378StaffSpell DPSTwo-HandFuneral PyreBeth'tilac
378StaffSpell DPSTwo-HandBranch of NordrassilLegendary Staff Quest
378StaffSpell DPSTwo-HandSpire of Scarlet PainRaid Trash
378StaffSpell SpiritTwo-HandSmoldering Censer of PurityUnknown
378SwordMeleeTwo-HandZoid's Firelit GreatswordUnknown
378SwordSpell DPSMain HandVolcanospikeLord Rhyolith
378SwordSpell DPSMain HandFirethorn MindslicerUnknown
378SwordTankOne-HandMandible of Beth'tilacBeth'tilac
378WandSpell DPSRangedStinger of the Flaming ScorpionMajordomo Staghelm
378PlateHandsFlickering HandguardsBaleroc, the Gatekeeper
378PlateMeleeChestBreastplate of Shifting VisionsMajordomo Staghelm
378PlateMeleeFeetArachnaflame TreadsBeth'tilac
378PlateMeleeHandsFireskin GauntletsLord Rhyolith
378PlateMeleeHeadGreathelm of the Voracious MawAlysrazor
378PlateMeleeLegsLavaworm LegplatesAlysrazor
378PlateMeleeWaistUncrushable Belt of FuryShannox
378PlateMeleeWristEarthcrack BracersLord Rhyolith
378PlateSpell SpiritChestClutch of the FiremotherAlysrazor
378PlateSpell SpiritFeetTreads of the Penitent ManMajordomo Staghelm
378PlateSpell SpiritHandsGrips of the Raging GiantLord Rhyolith
378PlateSpell SpiritHeadCasque of FlameBaleroc, the Gatekeeper
378PlateSpell SpiritLegsLegplates of Absolute ControlShannox
378PlateSpell SpiritShoulderSpaulders of Manifold EyesBeth'tilac
378PlateSpell SpiritWristBracers of the Dread HunterShannox
378PlateTankChestCarapace of Imbibed FlameBeth'tilac
378PlateTankFeetCracked Obsidian StompersLord Rhyolith
378PlateTankHeadHelm of Blazing GloryBaleroc, the Gatekeeper
378PlateTankLegsLegplates of Frenzied DevotionShannox
384PlateTankShoulderPauldrons of Roaring FlameRagnaros
378PlateTankShoulderSpaulders of Recurring FlameAlysrazor
378PlateTankWristBracers of the Fiery PathMajordomo Staghelm
378MailShoulderFlickering ShouldersBeth'tilac
378MailPhysical DPSChestFlaming Core ChestguardLord Rhyolith
378MailPhysical DPSFeetDecimation TreadsBaleroc, the Gatekeeper
378MailPhysical DPSHandsGrips of Unerring PrecisionMajordomo Staghelm
378MailPhysical DPSHeadScalp of the Bandit PrinceShannox
378MailPhysical DPSLegsMoltenfeather LeggingsAlysrazor
378MailPhysical DPSWristHide-Bound ChainsRaid Trash
378MailSpell DPSShoulderCraterflame SpauldersAlysrazor
378MailSpell SpiritChestGatekeeper's EmbraceBaleroc, the Gatekeeper
378MailSpell SpiritFeetTreads of Implicit ObedienceShannox
378MailSpell SpiritHandsClawshaper GauntletsAlysrazor
384MailSpell SpiritHeadCrown of FlameRagnaros
378MailSpell SpiritLegsThoracic Flame KiltBeth'tilac
378MailSpell SpiritWristLava Line WristbandsLord Rhyolith
378LeatherShoulderFlickering ShoulderpadsShannox
378LeatherWristFlickering WristbandsAlysrazor
378LeatherMeleeHeadHood of Rampant DisdainLord Rhyolith
378LeatherMeleeWaistRiplimb's Lost CollarRaid Trash
378LeatherPhysical DPSChestBreastplate of the Incendiary SoulBaleroc, the Gatekeeper
378LeatherPhysical DPSFeetSandals of Leaping CoalsMajordomo Staghelm
378LeatherPhysical DPSHandsGloves of Dissolving SmokeShannox
378LeatherPhysical DPSLegsCinderweb LeggingsBeth'tilac
378LeatherPhysical DPSShoulderShoulderpads of the Forgotten GateBaleroc, the Gatekeeper
378LeatherSpell SpiritChestIncendic ChestguardLord Rhyolith
378LeatherSpell SpiritFeetPhoenix-Down TreadsAlysrazor
378LeatherSpell SpiritHandsCindersilk GlovesBeth'tilac
378LeatherSpell SpiritHeadCowl of the Clicking MenaceBeth'tilac
378LeatherSpell SpiritLegsFirecat LeggingsMajordomo Staghelm
378LeatherSpell SpiritWristGlowing Wing BracersBaleroc, the Gatekeeper
378ClothHeadFlickering CowlLord Rhyolith
378ClothSpell DPSChestRobes of Smoldering DevastationBeth'tilac
378ClothSpell DPSFeetCoalwalker SandalsShannox
384ClothSpell DPSHandsFingers of IncinerationRagnaros
378ClothSpell DPSLegsLeggings of Billowing FireAlysrazor
378ClothSpell DPSShoulderMantle of Closed DoorsBaleroc, the Gatekeeper
384ClothSpell DPSWaistMajordomo's Chain of OfficeRagnaros
378ClothSpell DPSWristWristwraps of Arrogant DoomMajordomo Staghelm
378BackPhysical DPSBackDreadfire DrapeLord Rhyolith
378BackSpell DPSBackWings of FlameAlysrazor
378NeckMeleeNeckNecklace of FetishesShannox
378NeckMeleeNeckFirebound GorgetRaid Trash
384NeckPhysical DPSNeckChoker of the Vanquished LordRagnaros
378NeckSpell DPSNeckFlowform ChokerMajordomo Staghelm
378NeckSpell SpiritNeckHeartstone of RhyolithLord Rhyolith
378TrinketTrinketSpidersilk SpindleBeth'tilac
378TrinketMeleeTrinketApparatus of Khaz'gorothRaid Trash
378TrinketPhysical DPSTrinketThe HungererMajordomo Staghelm
378TrinketSpell DPSTrinketJaws of DefeatMajordomo Staghelm
378TrinketSpell DPSTrinketNecromantic FocusBaleroc, the Gatekeeper
378TrinketSpell DPSTrinketEye of Blazing PowerAlysrazor
378TrinketTankTrinketScales of LifeRaid Trash
384TrinketMeleeTrinketVessel of AccelerationRagnaros
384TrinketPhysical DPSTrinketMatrix RestabilizerRagnaros
384TrinketSpell DPSTrinketVariable Pulse Lightning CapacitorRagnaros


Blue Posts
Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
Justifying Class Changes
The blog seemed to be popular, and even players who disagreed with their being nerfed seemed to appreciate the fact that we tried to give some insight into what we were thinking. GC and the his crew are going to try to keep making similar blogs for every patch. I think it was one of the more positively received blogs in long while.

Offering a lot of justification for changes early on a patch though is challenging for a number of reasons. First is that patch builds are often just snapshots of the data at any given time. We wait until everything is near perfect for actual releases (as far as you can ever do with as complex a game as this), but when we are in PTR mode the devs are trying to get builds out quickly. That means you'll often see a change that was half-implemented or something that a designer was messing around with. There often isn't justification for those type of changes -- it could just be trying to fix a bug or seeing how something feels with a slight redesign. Second, it takes a lot of time to justify those changes and designers are often really busy implementing the actual changes at that stage in the beta. When the changes are not even necessarily 'real' changes, justifying what might not stick probably isn't a great use of time.

Finally, we greatly appreciate feedback from the community and it can have a big influence on our game design, but at the same time we want to avoid the perception that the players are collaborating on with us on designing the game. It's tricky to manage expectations in that way, but if we lead players to believe they have more influence on design decisions than they actually do, then there's a lot of undue frustrated and dismay when we don't make a change that some may really wants us to make. Being able to take player feedback while making sure they don't expect that feedback to be implemented as-is can be a tough balancing act, but is still a necessary one. (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)

Death Knight (Forums / Talent Calculator / Skills/Talents)
Trading higher risk for higher return
In general we like designs like this a lot. The challenge is that WoW is a game where you are tanking for a group, so there is a substantial social dynamic at play. We don't want things to play out is like this: "Oh, look, our DK tank has the easy mode Death Strike talent. Ergo, he's a bad tank. Let's kick him and get a good one."

Never mind that the DK in question probably tanks better with the "automatic" Death Strike rather than fumbling through the "manual" one. Never mind that the difference between the two is probably not going to make the difference between success or failure unless you are on Heroic raids (in which case why on earth do you have a pug tank?)

Obviously we shouldn't design around misinformation. But at the same time, social pressure is really powerful. If the active / harder-to-use / more pro mode of Death Strike becomes the only acceptable standard, then we haven't accomplished anything but complicate the game.

It's something to think about at least. ;) (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)

Paladin (Forums / Talent Calculator / Skills/Talents)
Holy Paladins
Here are developer thoughts on a few Holy paladin-related issues from this and related threads:

Mana -- we still think the 4.2 changes are necessary. Many of you disagree. We're not sure we can resolve the disagreement without all of us (players and developers) sitting around a table going over a lot of raid parses, which obviously isn't very realistic. We don't want to shut down the conversation completely, but at the same time, this is a topic we have spent a lot of time on internally, and we still like the 4.2 changes. If you're right and we overcompensated, then we'll admit we were wrong and make changes. We don't think that will happen though. We think Holy paladins will remain awesome healers.

Beacon of Light -- Ideally the way we want it to play out is that you are healing non-Beacon targets (i.e. using the transfer) most of the time. However, sometimes that 50% healing transfer isn't sufficient and you have to actually heal the Beacon target directly. Yes that is less efficient, but there is no point worrying about efficiency when your tank is dead. (If you can't sometimes heal your Beacon target directly without having severe mana problems, then you probably need to gear up more for the content you're attempting.) Tower of Radiance was designed as consolation for healing the Beacon target. It was a better talent when it affected Holy Light, but unfortunately it was so good that the default behavior became only healing the Beacon target. That's not what we want either.

Light of Dawn -- like many AE spells, Light of Dawn doesn't scale well from 5-player dungeons (or even 3-player Arena teams) up to 25-player raids. Maybe the solution in the future is to somehow have the spells themselves scale with group size, but in the mean time we made 4.2 changes to get players in larger raids to use Word of Glory a little more often. Light of Dawn will still gets tons of use in big raids, and we're fine with that.

Holy Radiance -- this spells hasn't played out as we hoped. The initial design was that the paladin would heal targets around him, perhaps relying on the Speed of Light sprint to get to clumped, wounded targets, or even try healing in melee on occasion. We solved initial usability problems by just buffing the heal over and over, especially the range, such that the position of the paladin in the group is almost irrelevant now. Yet because it maintains an instant cast, there isn't a lot of interesting gameplay around Holy Radiance. It would probably work better as a cast time heal with no cooldown, so that you had the choice of using it or a single-target heal in the same way a shaman chooses Chain Heal when appropriate. Ultimately this might allow paladins to feel like they could be assigned to AE healing. That's a big redesign, but something we're considering. (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)

Holy Shield Redesign / Protection Paladins
On the topic of who wanted this change, we’re just in a better position than players to get a sense for what a wide variety of paladins are asking for across the world. Players are most familiar with what their friends on their own realm are thinking, or what they read on the forums they frequent. Those are typically fairly small sample sizes. And I don't mean that as a slight against anyone in this thread who disagrees with our decisions. It's just the nature of the way in which data can be collected.

The more salient point though is that this isn’t a decision-making process that is heavily influenced by polling. The change made was a suggestion we saw several times, considered, and decided we agreed with. We know there are players who disagree with the decision, which to be fair, is the outcome of every single design decision we make. We think the most fair point is that some tanks already have enough going on, and as we suggested in the recent Blood DK discussion, we’re considering options to let players opt out of complexity at their discretion.

As far as Protection paladin mastery goes, one solution we like, as we alluded to before, is to split Protection’s mastery into multiple components so that hitting the “hard cap” is less of a hard cap. There are two problems with this design. First, it would feel a lot like the warrior mastery, and we know some of you want to be less like warriors, not more. Secondly, it would be a huge nerf to Protection survival overall. We could compensate for it elsewhere, but you will see a lot of players upset about the nerf -- players who liked stacking mastery to the cap and then being able to focus on other stats. We looked a lot at the paladin gear for Firelands and concluded that while it will be easier to max out mastery, there won’t be so much of it that paladins get frustrated when mastery gear drops. It might let them swap out a few other pieces or use fewer gems. We could have the problem again in the next raiding tier, but we have ample time to consider our options before that time.

This sort of leaves me with one question. Are you guys okay with Paladins block capping? You guys tend to bounce between the two ideas of "we are okay with it" and "we don't want it."
At the 10,000 foot view, it's not ideal. But it doesn't cause so many problems, balance or otherwise, that it was worth the potential fallout from a change. Even if we make a change that we think is for the better, it's still a change that requires some amount of relearning on the part of the player base, so we try and pick our battles. (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)

Rogue (Forums / Talent Calculator / Skills/Talents)
Rogues popularity
This is a topic we discuss a lot. We don't believe it has anything to do with game balance though. Rogues were also less popular than other classes at times when they consistently topped damage meters and dominated PvP. This isn't a trend that seems to rise and fall with current game balance. Overall, we've never seen a strong correlation between which class is considered overpowered and what players are playing. (Note: This is true overall, but if you move to smaller and smaller sample sizes, perhaps Arena teams above or below a certain rating threshold or raids above or below a certain level of progress, then you can see some correlations between power--real or perceived--and popularity.)

We do know that a lot of rogues appeared to reroll DK, at least when the class was first introduced. We also think rogues were more popular back in the day before flying mounts and instance-teleportation, where ganking someone out in the wilderness was more common. We saw a surge in the popularity of hybrid classes, especially druids and paladins, as running heroic dungeons became something nearly every player did instead of a more dedicated minority.

It's possible that some rogue mechanics aren't as fun as they could be. This is a really subjective issue though, and it's trivial to find members of every class and spec declaring that their character is clunky and ill-conceived while some other class or spec appears sleek and shiny. We made some changes (i.e. stealth movement speed) to try and make some of the rogue mechanics more fun and this is the kind of thing we'll continue to keep an eye on.

Plenty of players love rogues though. We don't want to give the perception that the class is dying or anything like that. It's just less commonly played than say paladin, which is probably why you see so many paladin-related threads on all three forums.
(Blue Tracker / Official Forums)
This article was originally published in forum thread: Patch 4.2 - Firelands Raid Loot List, Blue Posts started by Boubouille View original post
Comments 99 Comments
  1. ot4ku-mh's Avatar
    grml i still don't like the holy shield change
  1. najini's Avatar
    nice loot list! thx guise
  1. Gnowo's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by najini View Post
    nice loot list! thx guise
    Anything for a first post, eh?
  1. meroko's Avatar
    Still no 391 waists. Wonder if we are just going to be stuck with 378 rep waists. What a shame
  1. Kaldriss's Avatar
    loot of rag looks different...wierd

    and theres no plate dps shoulders....wtf.
  1. daylanhammer's Avatar
    with the rogue comment something close to 35% of the total player base is a pally or druid. rogues and locks get no love from the player base lol.
  1. Kittahsmash's Avatar
    Is there any word yet on where the new Leatherworking patterns come from? Treads of the Craft being the main one I'm interested in..
  1. Velossa's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by daylanhammer View Post
    with the rogue comment something close to 35% of the total player base is a pally or druid. rogues and locks get no love from the player base lol.
    Funny, as I truly do love my Rogue right now. Then again, I use her in PvP.
  1. Clockwork Pinkie's Avatar
    Good list, definitely going to make a list of what to do/choose on the three toons I'll be spamming dailies with, as well as easy upgrades to get for my alts, I'll be busy for awhile
  1. khatsoo's Avatar
    Rogue pride!
  1. Coldkil's Avatar
    We all know that rogues are not boring. In PvP they are really fun, even if we do little damage but lots of control; I love my rogue in PvE too.

    Anyway this is a personal opinion; the fact is that we became the underdogs of PvE and PvP just because our mechanics didn't change much during the times. Ok, you can say warriors and mages haven't changed much, but the fact is that your "numbers" (yes, i man the yellow ones that pop on the screen) have raised constantly through the expansions. As a rogue, this feeling disappears. We are just used to a continuos flow of small numbers we don't even read (my MSBT is set to not dispaly anything below 5k dmg, and i don't see much) so it seems that rogues don't grow as other classes.

    Another thing is the way we do damage: mostly from autoattacks and poisons, which are powerful but not controlled by the player. We can be balanced, but the sensation is that you are looking at some bot doing the work, while other melee and all the casters actively do damage (they do damage with their spell/abilities for the biggest part). It's not a balance issue (as the blue said). It's a class mechanic issue, and a very complicated one.

    Rogues need a huge rework (similar to focus for hunters in terms of importance), but it's a thing you can do between expansions and not in the middle of one. Even if i hope they will do it asap. And don't ask me for solutions, as i don't have none atm (nothing balanced).

    edit: WTF why it has become a wall of text? corrected.
  1. Stompalomp's Avatar
    Umm, no Cloth Spell Spirit gear at all? Is this something there is no information on? or has it just not been included here by mistake?
  1. crowpala's Avatar
    Hmmm....just did a quick check of the drops from fireland now. I have to say I wish that Blizzard would give us tanks more to choose from. Right now we have 2 different shoulder drops but rest is just 1 drop. Give us different tanking weapons, shields and trinkets so we have something to choose from rather then items that we will not use (T12 gear would be preffered in most cases over raid loot).
  1. Raptoos's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Stompalomp View Post
    Umm, no Cloth Spell Spirit gear at all? Is this something there is no information on? or has it just not been included here by mistake?
    I see it too, and I am little worry about it.

    Why does every cloth is "dps"?
  1. lb's Avatar
    ... We don't believe it has anything to do with game balance though. Rogues were also less popular than other classes at times when they consistently topped damage meters and dominated PvP. This isn't a trend that seems to rise and fall with current game balance. ... (Note: This is true overall, but if you move to smaller and smaller sample sizes, perhaps Arena teams above or below a certain rating threshold or raids above or below a certain level of progress, then you can see some correlations between power--real or perceived--and popularity.)
    Politicians ... some of the blizzard guys could run for a political career.
  1. Coldkil's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by lb View Post
    Politicians ... some of the blizzard guys could run for a political career.
    Insightful post and full of good inputs for reasoning :/

    If you don't have nothing to say, don't post please.
  1. Simca's Avatar
    I REALLY hope they keep that Spirit/Mastery Axe in the game. It'll be the one of the first of its kind.The boss drop being "unknown" (i.e. missing from the journal) gives me pause though.
  1. A Day to Remember's Avatar
    Can the Dwarf Hunters stop complaining that there isnt a gun now?But really, its lookin good sofar, thx for the list Bibi.
  1. Marcis's Avatar
    I wonder what it takes to get that legendary staff...
  1. Arkane's Avatar
    Some trinkets have "equip" bonus that look like "on use" ones, odd. Agree with your point of view about rogues, Colkil. I have a lvl 58 rogue alt, and sometimes I just have to wait there waiting for the energy to go up, while with my main, hunter, I can use focused shot. Well, maybe it's my fault not knowing how to play a rogue, but still...

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