MMO-Champion - Stars Heroic Shannox World First Kill, Blue Posts
Stars (TW - Crystalpine Stinger) already working on Firelands Heroic - Shannox World First Kill
A lot of guilds killed all the bosses of the Firelands raid in normal mode already but it seems that Stars (TW - Crystalpine Stinger) decided to take it one step further.

After clearing the encounters in normal mode, the entire raid changed faction to reset their raid ID and started working on heroic encounters shortly after, that kind of thing happened in the past and it's not really surprising to see it used again to grab first kills.

As I write these lines, Stars killed Shannox in Heroic Mode. It's not really my place to judge if something is against the rules or not and I will just keep tracking heroic first kills as they happen.



Blue Posts
Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
Eternal Embers and Seething Cinders Droprates
You’re assuming the drop chances for embers averages out to .5 per boss in 10’s and 2 per boss in 25’s, which it doesn’t. Whether you’re in 10’s or 25’s you’re going to see an equal drop average for Eternal Embers per player, and the same can be said for Seething Cinders. (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)

New Content - Differences between PvE and PvP Players
The answer to your question revolves around a common difference in how PvE players and PvP players approach the game. Generally speaking, PvE players want more quests, more dungeons and more raids to experience -- more and new content is king. On the other hand, while some PvP players do want new maps, many others would be happier if we perfected the Arena or BG maps that already exist - or even if we cut existing maps. After all, PvP players don’t graduate out of Arathi Basin or Dalaran sewers the same way PvE players graduate from dungeon to heroic, or raid tier to raid tier. We did make some improvements to the existing PvP maps, such as trying to return Ring of Valor to circulation and changing the way flags work in Eye of the Storm (for rated play).

We’d love to add a lot more maps than we currently do, but we need to do it in such a way that doesn’t make the PvP experience worse for players who are more interested in refining their PvP experience than in seeing new maps. (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)

Patch 4.2 Hairstyles
We had a bunch of hairstyles we threw in for testing on the PTR and the majority of them did not pass the test. (quality, art direction, bugs, etc.) (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)

Patch 4.0 Raids now puggable
We specifically intend for the 4.0 raids to be puggable now that Firelands is out. Grabbing some tier 11 by way of Justice, quest rewards, plus across the board difficulty nerfs should really be enough to get them going.

The patch has only been out a day or so though. I think it'll probably take a little bit before people really get it into their heads that they should be pugging the previous tier because it's not too hard to be successful. It's just getting people used to the various encounters and mechanics.

Maybe people are waiting for the holiday weekend? If nothing else, leading one yourself is always an option. I think we'd agree that we need some better ways to get pug raids together considering we intend to follow the "New Raid is Hard, old Tier is Puggable" format from here on.

Still unsure what that means regarding the final raid (i.e. Deathwing). Do pugs not get to see him until the next expansion is released? (Not saying whether that's a good thing or not, but personally I enjoyed getting to Arthas on some of my alts without spending near as much time as I did on my main.)
In ICC we had a stacking raid buff over time which gradually made the content easier. Not saying we’ll do that exact thing again but the philosophy was around even then that everyone who wants to can eventually see the content, but it’s going to take very organized groups (which typically means raiding guilds) to see the encounters first.

So casuals will constantly be a tier behind for the rest of the life of this game? If that is what is actually coming out of your mouth I'll save myself the time and unsub now. What a piss poor vision for your game. There are normal and heroic versions of raids for a reason. That heroic difficulty was implemented so that the two segments of the population (casual and hardcore) would both have something to do. You are now bifurcating the raiding population AGAIN, by telling casuals that they have to run around in the left overs.
Trying to label all of our players as “casual puggers” vs.” hardcore raiders” is ridiculously simplistic. Among raiders there is an enormous diversity of players. There are those who will raid virtually every night when new content is out, to guilds that raid once a week (and even then will cancel raid nights fairly commonly). If you must try to label raiders, you’d be closer to the Blizzard model if you said normal mode is for organized raids, heroic mode is for more hardcore organized raids, and the previous tier of content (and Baradin Hold) is targeted for pick-up groups. Also consider that even within a raid zone we try to design easier bosses (usually near the front) and more challenging ones (usually at the end) which can help blur those lines and offer smoother transitions for each category.

Overall, we think you’ll have a better experience playing World of Warcraft if you play with friends, either existing or those you meet in game. WoW, while much more solo friendly than most older MMO games, is still intended as a multiplayer game. We provide features like Dungeon Finder for when playing with friends isn’t possible, and as we said above, we’d like to offer more features like that. (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)

Tabards Tab
Are there any considerations for a tab for your tabards?
Yes!

[...] To clarify: he asked if we were considering it, and yes we are considering it. :) (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)

Keyring Removal
On a serious point though some people are upset about the removal of the key ring. While that seems like we're just taking it out to be bullies, it specifically frees up storage space we can then make into useful features. Not that it will specifically be used for 'tabard storage', but we are going to be using the space the removal of the key ring freed up. (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)

Thrall and Aggra's "wedding"
Correct. Their pledging of their lives to one another was essentially their 'wedding', although I'm sure Orcs don't use such nomenclature to refer to these things. Maybe 'life bond' fits better. (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)

Does Blizzard plan on adding the rest of the dungeons and raids to the Dungeon Journal?
Absolutely. With the time it takes to present a single boss in the Dungeon Journal we were only confident supplying Cataclysm content with the release of the feature in 4.2, but we are on a path to filling it out with all dungeons and raids in the entire game. (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)

Steam Summer Sales
In a very, very, very unrelated sidenote, Steam Summer Sales are up. I don't usually news non-WoW stuff but ... well, I like Valve and I'm pretty sure a lot of people will be happy to hear the news. Also, don't forget that we have a Video Games Forum!
This article was originally published in forum thread: Stars Heroic Shannox World First Kill, Blue Posts started by Boubouille View original post
Comments 625 Comments
  1. Halpas's Avatar
    Haha get em' stars! I really couldn't give a flying monkey that they get to start early.. Other guilds should've done it! :P
  1. Swiftstryder's Avatar
    I think it's awesome what they did.

    Good on them. Smart and a godo way to get ahead.

    Since you guys(Majority) are WoW uber nerds and your life depends on who gets world firsts, look at it this way.

    Blizz will probably buff the bossess now if they did indeed get 3/7. This'll make for a more interesting and slightly longer race for them..(omg i said race. it's a game...lol)
  1. Tymefor's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Boubouille View Post
    Stars (TW - Crystalpine Stinger) already working on Firelands Heroic - Shannox World First Kill
    A lot of guilds killed all the bosses of the Firelands raid in normal mode already but it seems that Stars (TW - Crystalpine Stinger) decided to take it one step further.

    After clearing the encounters in normal mode, the entire raid changed faction to reset their raid ID and started working on heroic encounters shortly after, that kind of thing happened in the past and it's not really surprising to see it used again to grab first kills.

    As I write these lines, Stars killed Shannox in Heroic Mode. It's not really my place to judge if something is against the rules or not and I will just keep tracking heroic first kills as they happen.
    I dont use or care about and other sites for my information other than MMOchamp. I've trusted Boubouille's opinion for years and im not going to stop now. So, as he says, its not his our our place to judge if something is against the rules or not. But, as he says, this IS A HEROIC FIRST KILL and he has reported it as such. It annoys me that people are posting on his own site basically calling him a liar. Ty to Boubouille for keeping track of all the heroic first kills I'll always trust your opinion first and post whatever you say without doing my own research or waiting for official statements from blizzard.
  1. Silmarieni's Avatar
    This is really the kind of tricks Blizzard should have made impossible years ago.
    It didn't because it is a greedy company and clearly this isn't fair for less fortunate players who may not afford the ransom-like prices for faction changes but I guess congrats to Stars and boo to Blizzard.
  1. freelapdance's Avatar
    Anyone got a link to their current progress? People saying 3/7 already?

    Also you cant compare the Ensidia LK thing with this. There is a difference between "exploiting" an encounter to getting to attempt an encounter with an "exploit". The whole faction transfere thing happened back in TOC. From what I have heard you can do that on US/EU realms currently. Didnt one of the Method rogues say that them Paragon and some others had an agreement NOT to do it.

    This is simply a case of just how much do you want a world first. Be it faction changing or stacking a class, really what is the difference? You do what you can. Any of the top guilds can faction change if they wanted to, but it just is stupid overall.
  1. Minto44's Avatar
    World firsts should just be counted based on how long it took for the kill to happen after the guild's regions servers opened.

    Say the US servers open on tuesday at 11 AM. Enigma kills Shannox at 13:00 PM.
    Say the EU servers open on wednesday at 11 AM. Paragon kills Shannox at 12:30 PM.

    Paragon would get the world first even if Enigma killed it "earlier" because they spent less time since server start.

    The same thing should apply to Stars here. How long did it take Stars to kill the boss after their transfer went through? If the other guilds can beat this time then it wouldn't be a world first for Stars.

    If people actually counted world firsts like this, where it is fair for all regions, then there would be nothing wrong with what Stars did.
  1. freelapdance's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Minto44 View Post
    Say the US servers open on tuesday at 11 AM. Enigma kills Shannox at 13:00 PM.
    Say the EU servers open on wednesday at 11 AM. Paragon kills Shannox at 12:30 PM.

    Paragon would get the world first even if Enigma killed it "earlier" because they spent less time since server start.

    The same thing should apply to Stars here. How long did it take Stars to kill the boss after their transfer went through? If the other guilds can beat this time then it wouldn't be a world first for Stars.

    If people actually counted world firsts like this, where it is fair for all regions, then there would be nothing wrong with what Stars did.
    +1 /10 char
  1. Swiftstryder's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Minto44 View Post
    World firsts should just be counted based on how long it took for the kill to happen after the guild's regions servers opened.

    Say the US servers open on tuesday at 11 AM. Enigma kills Shannox at 13:00 PM.
    Say the EU servers open on wednesday at 11 AM. Paragon kills Shannox at 12:30 PM.

    Paragon would get the world first even if Enigma killed it "earlier" because they spent less time since server start.

    The same thing should apply to Stars here. How long did it take Stars to kill the boss after their transfer went through? If the other guilds can beat this time then it wouldn't be a world first for Stars.

    If people actually counted world firsts like this, where it is fair for all regions, then there would be nothing wrong with what Stars did.
    lol this sounds retarded.

    "You killed it in the world first, however, due to you killing it in 3 hours after you had access to it, and these cats over here killed it in 2, you aint world first, even though you got world first. You smell me son?"
  1. Tarfu's Avatar
    Well I didnt read all the comments... But I see nothing wrong with this.... If you look on wowprogress about the guild they basically say they have to wait 1 week for patches and such, so they moved to TW, so if you want everything fair why not release all patches EU US TW at the same time (not same day)
  1. Crazia's Avatar
    It was like an unwritten rule, and Stars broke it.It ruins the progress race, and even if i as a players is not effected by i do like to follow the progress so in that matter...yes.. it does effect me.
  1. osatox's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Minto44 View Post
    World firsts should just be counted based on how long it took for the kill to happen after the guild's regions servers opened.

    Say the US servers open on tuesday at 11 AM. Enigma kills Shannox at 13:00 PM.
    Say the EU servers open on wednesday at 11 AM. Paragon kills Shannox at 12:30 PM.

    Paragon would get the world first even if Enigma killed it "earlier" because they spent less time since server start.

    The same thing should apply to Stars here. How long did it take Stars to kill the boss after their transfer went through? If the other guilds can beat this time then it wouldn't be a world first for Stars.

    If people actually counted world firsts like this, where it is fair for all regions, then there would be nothing wrong with what Stars did.
    While this "in fairness" is a good idea, it would not be fair to classify that as a world first.
    Your example of "duration from when the servers opened" would more-so be REGION FIRST, as well as REALM FIRST, however 'World First' would imply 1st anywhere.

    Region Firsts are just as respectable/cool as world firsts.
  1. PedjaLHS's Avatar
    Blizz should make harded heroic content, the speed that top guilds are clearing is just retarded, whenever i see some guild has already cleared everything i loose the willpower to raid anymore... And gratz to Stars and i hope they clear everything in a week to show blizzard how much they fail at making challenging raids.
  1. Omirr's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by osatox View Post
    While this "in fairness" is a good idea, it would not be fair to classify that as a world first.
    Your example of "duration from when the servers opened" would more-so be REGION FIRST, as well as REALM FIRST, however 'World First' would imply 1st anywhere.

    Region Firsts are just as respectable/cool as world firsts.
    Why is it not fair ?
    "Sorry dude, you live in another part of the world, and even tho you killed it in 3 hours instead of the 4 hours the other guild took, you don't get the World First".
    Starting the timer when the server goes up or the raid id resets is the ONLY fair way to judge a World First.
  1. Holo's Avatar
    They should rename World First to World Fastest.. and then this whole bs wouldn't have arisen :/
  1. freelapdance's Avatar
    Still dont get why Blizzard just dont patch everything on the same day. Sure it would be more work but there would be a lot less drama overall.
  1. fulkin's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Crazia View Post
    It was like an unwritten rule, and Stars broke it.It ruins the progress race, and even if i as a players is not effected by i do like to follow the progress so in that matter...yes.. it does effect me.

    Unwritten rules aren't rules. I lol'd so hard over on manaflask and it's the same here, guilds have used everything in their power to get world firsts before even to the point of only recruiting people who can skip work and other RL commitments to play for weeks at a time. One ensidia member posted on their forums that Stars was never a real competitor in the race for first even though he happily didnt state they have always started a week later than everyone else. They used their brains to get ahead and people are just up in arms that they didnt think of it or dont have people willing to pay to do it. Guilds have their players change race to get better percentage gains all the time all Stars did was have everyone do it.
  1. kvitrafn's Avatar
    imo it's funny that stars appealed to all the other competing guilds SENSE OF COMPETITION when bugging atramedes was a topic.

    seriously this is just a bitch move - i mean they get the patch later...ok - who the fck cares ? first lockout everyone cleared nonheroic content, where the firstkills mean nothing and then the second lockout everyone competing gets a clean start......
  1. belgicanofl's Avatar
    If blizzard bans them, they lose their current worlds first kill. If someone in the olympics takes doping and say it's the first time and he's winning the first title, he found tested positive after the win, meaning he exploited the way onto his title, he loses the worlds first title... Same thing here. Should be banned and will be banned.
  1. Nobleshield's Avatar
    The real issue I saw with that "So casuals are a tier behind??" nonsense is that it's propagating the wrong idea: That everyone who isn't on the current tier is a bad player. This seems to be a Wrath mentality (and I started in Wrath), because nobody I have talked to who played Classic and TBC felt that way; everyone worked at their own pace. If you were in a guild still working on T4 content, nobody looked down on you as a "casual scrub" because Black Temple was out and you weren't clearing it - sure the guys who WERE clearing BT were looked upon favorably (as they should be) but the reverse didn't happen. Ever since Wrath though, anyone who was working through a prior tier was basically laughed at and called bad. That's the wrong thing to do - Blizzard should encourage multi-tier raiding. Let guilds work at their own pace - if I'm in a fairly laid back guild only starting to raid, let us work on T11 content and dip our fingers into Firelands with rep runs and making attempts at Shannox and the others. There shouldn't be anything wrong with that, but its the playerbase that keeps pushing the idea that there IS something wrong with that.
  1. purefury's Avatar
    blizz might still hotfix encounters, so stars are kind of doing PTR kills. It is pre-release kill.

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