MMO-Champion - Raid Finder Loot Rules Update
Raid Finder Loot Rules Update
Short version: When using Raid Finder for the Dragon Soul raid instance, players whose currently assigned class role (Tank, Healer, or Damage) matches the class role that a piece of armor or a weapon is flagged for will receive +100 to their Need roll.
Originally Posted by Blizzard (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)
In response to concerns regarding how loot will be distributed in the Raid Finder system, we are making some changes to how loot rolls will work when using the Need Before Greed system in the Raid Finder. When using Raid Finder for the Dragon Soul raid instance, players whose currently assigned class role (Tank, Healer, or Damage) matches the class role that a piece of armor or a weapon is flagged for will receive +100 to their Need roll. For purposes of this check, your currently assigned role is defined as the class role you have assigned when a boss is defeated. Sound confusing? I hope not, but here's how it'll work:

A boss dies and drops EPIC TANKING ITEM.


  • A mage in the group yawns and clicks the "Greed" button, getting a 98.

  • A Fury warrior in the group wants to take up tanking, so he rolls "Need" and gets a solid 64.

  • Both tanks want the item. Tank 1 rolls a 12, and Tank 2 rolls a 7.

So what happens?

Because the mage rolled greed, she's right out from the start. The Fury warrior's Need roll was higher than the tanks', but he was in the Damage Dealer role when the boss died, and the item is flagged for tanking, so his 64 is still just a 64 out of a possible 100. In contrast, Tank 1 and Tank 2 each get a 100 point bonus to their rolls because they were in the Tanking role when the boss died and they’re rolling on an item that has been flagged for the tanking role. That means that Tank 1 rolled a 112 out of 200, and tank 2 rolled a 107 out of 200. Tank 1 wins the item! If a roll got a bonus, that bonus will be clearly displayed in the chat log.

Please keep in mind that, at least for now, this system will only look at class role, and not player spec. This bonus isn't only for tanking items either – it applies to Tanking, Damage Dealing, and Healing items, and some items are flagged for more than one class role too. Starting out, only Dragon Soul raid items will be flagged for class roles in this way (though all of the items in the raid will be flagged for one or more roles). As you might expect, all the normal Need Before Greed rules are still in place, so that means that these roll bonuses won't overrule normal class and usability restrictions. Item tooltips in the raid won't reflect which class roles will get rolling bonuses, but it should be fairly obvious based on stat allocations and item type.

We are considering expanding this system to apply to the new 4.3 dungeons as well, though it is unlikely that we'll see the system apply to older dungeons or raids for now. Also, please keep in mind that this system is newly minted, and it may see further changes before it's released with the Raid Finder in patch 4.3.
This article was originally published in forum thread: Raid Finder Loot Rules Update started by Boubouille View original post
Comments 460 Comments
  1. Ineras's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Vook View Post
    I don't see why not. They're 100% viable for those DPS.
    Sadly as it was pointed out to me they are just checking the role and not the spec at the moment so I doubt they would allow, say, all cloth dps to roll on a +spi cloth item. Hopefully they are working on the system to check spec as well for this purpose.
  1. Bahska's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Galm View Post
    Blizzard could've done this better, i.e. making need roll only available for the specific role, and greed roll for "offspec rolls" only available for players that wear the same armor type (obviously banning DKs and Warriors from rolling greed on healing plate etc.). Blizzard has gone too far with expanding the rolling from 1-100!
    I don't think you have understood the post, cause that's exactly what there doing. "Locking specific roles"

    Holy pally's will still get priority over the DK cause healing is the pally's MS, The DK can only roll as OS.
    Meaning the holy pally would win every time, this mechanic just makes sure the DK cant ninja it.
  1. Howlrunner's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by frag971 View Post
    So what prevents having all fury, cats, retris and frostDKs to select tanking role just before the pull and have +100 on that last item they want from that specific boss?
    Because they are in the instance as DPS as that is what they queued for? You can't change your role in 5man and won't be able to in a raid. Haven't really thought the comment through have you?
  1. Scyo's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Ashaela View Post
    The only thing that is bad about this system is something that Blizzard sadly can't do much about. For example, I have all the tanking gear I want, but my Fury warrior friend still wants items but he can't roll on them since there are other tanks who need the items. So, I join the raid finder with him as a tank, and when the tanking item he wants drops, I roll and get the +100 roll and perhaps winning over the others. Then I just trade the item to him and go about as if nothing has happened. Not that I'd ever do this personally, it's just a scenario that could happen at a few occassions.
    Easy solution: While in LFR, items you won by rolling need aren't tradeable. Hope they implement it in such a way.
  1. wow's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by 4KhazModan View Post
    So what about dps items that are also good for tanking I wonder?
    Also, feral items, do they give prio to a bear or a kitty/rogue?
    Theres no way to give priority to a bear there is no tanking leather. If they did give it to a bear they would just be autolooted all agi leather that be pretty broken.
  1. Rodpad's Avatar
    Indeed as long as they lock spirit drops to healing classes AND Moonkins, Shadow Priests and Elemental Shamans, then this is a perfect solution.
  1. Howlrunner's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Shamgar View Post
    Not all items are as obvious as plate with parry on. What if there drops EPIC SPELLPOWER RING with int, haste and mastery. This particular ring might be good for both healers and dps. Will dps get prio always because it does not have spirit? On the other hand, elemental shamans use spirit mail, so does restoration shamans. Same goes for moonkins and shadow priests with leather and cloth respectivly. Will this work only for some items, while other are ready for the plucking by everyone and their grandma's offspecs? They better make a more waterproof system then this, or the QQ will be immense Another point is bows. If it simply is flagged as dps, does that means rogues and warriors can roll need on it, or do hunters get prio? What about agility staffs, and a druid in tank spec.

    If boomkins or shamans are using cloth etc, then they suck monkey balls as they are losing the 5% stat bonus they gain from having same armour type. Sheesh its posts like this that depress me about wow. Blizz tries to rectify an issue that ppl are concerned about, and the legions of monkey brained peons whine like hell about stuff...*sigh*
  1. jerkface's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Ashaela View Post
    The only thing that is bad about this system is something that Blizzard sadly can't do much about. For example, I have all the tanking gear I want, but my Fury warrior friend still wants items but he can't roll on them since there are other tanks who need the items. So, I join the raid finder with him as a tank, and when the tanking item he wants drops, I roll and get the +100 roll and perhaps winning over the others. Then I just trade the item to him and go about as if nothing has happened. Not that I'd ever do this personally, it's just a scenario that could happen at a few occassions.
    I believe the main reason they mentioned for adding the 2 hour trade timer to BoP raid drops was specifically because of GMs constantly being petitioned to transfer items that MLs mistakenly gave to the wrong person. If so, they could simply make LFR drops a regular BoP.
    Do the LFD BoP drops have a trade timer on them? I can't recall and can't check for a while.
  1. MysticalOS's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by frag971 View Post
    So what prevents having all fury, cats, retris and frostDKs to select tanking role just before the pull and have +100 on that last item they want from that specific boss?
    it's not using THAT role, it's using the role they queued as. this isnt a system that's in place for a trade chat pick up group for baradin hold. it's for the dungeon/raid finder where you queued as a specific role only.
  1. Bahska's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Ineras View Post
    Sadly as it was pointed out to me they are just checking the role and not the spec at the moment so I doubt they would allow, say, all cloth dps to roll on a +spi cloth item. Hopefully they are working on the system to check spec as well for this purpose.
    "some items are flagged for more than one class role too"
  1. Nestle's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by frag971 View Post
    So what prevents having all fury, cats, retris and frostDKs to select tanking role just before the pull and have +100 on that last item they want from that specific boss?
    The fact that your slapped with your role before you even enter the Raid instance and that you cannot change it once you have entered. This is for the raid finder and once you are put in a certain role, you cannot change that role unless you requeue for the instance.

    OT: I am interested as to what they do for the spirit to hit conversion factors. I'm pretty sure it will be safe to assume that they will have it that both healers and dps of that specific class can roll on the item and will get the +100 to their roll.

    Another good question would be how to differentiate between a piece of plate gear that has say +hit and +mastery. Will it be seen as a tank item or dps item? I know the differences in STR and STA will come into play but I am just intrigued. And the whole bear/kitty argument is solved with the fact that there is no tanking leather or tanking polearms. I'm curious to see if they allow bears to roll on the STR rings/cloaks/necks that have dodge/mastery to use as a tank piece.

    All-in-all, this is definitely a fantastic idea and basically only applies to tank gear/holy pally/healing trinkets, but is definitely a fantastic thing to see and is making me consider doing the raid finder to gear up my alts!
  1. Martzart's Avatar
    Way past time for something like this to be implemented... good loot rule is good
  1. Calene's Avatar
    Not all items are as obvious as plate with parry on. What if there drops EPIC SPELLPOWER RING with int, haste and mastery. This particular ring might be good for both healers and dps.
    Have you even read the blue post?
    and some items are flagged for more than one class role too
    ......

    ---------- Post added 2011-10-07 at 06:29 PM ----------

    So what prevents having all fury, cats, retris and frostDKs to select tanking role just before the pull and have +100 on that last item they want from that specific boss?
    The fact that it's not possible even in 5-man random dungeons? Uhm, why you even listing this as a problem? It's not and won't ever be.
  1. Lared0n's Avatar
    Im interested in how will they handle Dk tank weapons, i have a feeling, they will forget that.
  1. Ineras's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Bahska View Post
    "some items are flagged for more than one class role too"
    And? As I said, I doubt they would let +spi items be able to get the bonus for healers AND dps simply because I doubt they want mages and warlocks to roll on +spi items. So the item would be flagged as healer + hybrid dps if it was possible, which it isn't at the moment considering specs aren't put into play, only roles.
  1. Arkbird's Avatar
    The new loot rule pleases me.
  1. Calene's Avatar
    Another good question would be how to differentiate between a piece of plate gear that has say +hit and +mastery. Will it be seen as a tank item or dps item? I know the differences in STR and STA will come into play but I am just intrigued.
    Read the blue post..

    and some items are flagged for more than one class role too

    I don't understand why people think each item can only be available for need for just one role? Even in the blue post it says one single item can be for multiple roles....
  1. obscurede's Avatar
    in a way, even agi items come up for dps dks as eligible items in the loot page of the dungeon journal. this seems to be an extension of that. atleast now i m glad that no dps would take my tanking item
  1. mische's Avatar
    Who says Blizzard can't actually learn to do things right? bit too late though.

    This is probably the #1 reason I quit WoW. By the time I logged on, most of my guildies had already done their dailies. Taking the effort to heal/tank heroics on various alts and having loot taken by a dps. It really got on my nerves. LFG was a damn good idea, but without solid rules, a lot of people I met in LFG were just crummy. Can't tell you how many times things were just taken and some guy needed when he had better. Too bad. It's a bit late. I've been playing Rift, and everytime I think about coming back to WoW, a few minutes of those horrid graphics and general lack of things to do outside raiding make me just log right back off, and load up Rift again. Pretty sure Rift will have this feature soon, as they take all the best from WoW and make it better. Ironically, the community in the LFG in Rift seem to be better. Go Figure.
  1. Sinfullysweet's Avatar
    The new loot rule may just work! Looking forward to see how it goes.

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