Raid Finder Loot Exploit Suspensions, Paragon Apology

Originally Posted by Goliad

Does their cheating affect you? Why can't people play this game for their own amusement? Who cares how many guilds exploited, they will get their punishment and it will affect you exactly 0%. All these people saying glad they got suspended or glad they got their comeuppance are just being silly. 99% of the people who play wow do not care, will not care, heck most do not even know who paragon is, nor do they care. It's a game, have fun playing your game. If your game is made better by other people's misery, then you need a new game.

It does when you miss out a legitimate World First by milliseconds to a guild that resorted to such exploits.

Not surprising at all. Almost every time (if not every time?) there's a major exploit when new content launches, Paragon exploits it, and then apologizes afterwards. Talk about learning from your mistakes? I think not.

I am disapointed in myself that i found out about this so late, i totally would have used this to gear my toons quicker dumb blizz needs better testers.

Paragon, very disappointed in you. *shakes head*

Originally Posted by pzijderv

we accept the concequences... as if they had any choice in the matter

why does an apology from paragon deserve to be a main topic on mmo champion? what do we care, they messed up and they kept doing it ok we got it. but does this "apology" really deserve to be on the main page of mmo-champion?? i mean seriously theres other threads for this, why not post it in each of them instead of posting it on the front page.. this isnt news about any game, just the players behind it... Why isnt my rogue ever on the main page huh?

Originally Posted by Dela2k10

This pretty much sums it all up:

And it would be a well-earned world first. IMO, I think Blizzard should -- if they can -- go look at all the other progression kills that these guilds have been doing and check over the exploits....

Oh that's right. They have. This is just the first time Blizzard actually banned these guilds for it (Magmaw bug, Freya trash buff, AQ40 hijinks, ect.)

I think that after all this time, a lot of those top guilds have enough members that have ranked up enough "whoops was that a bug ho ho" moments that they should be sporting permabans.

Cheat-loving failures can sit there and laugh at Blood Leigon / Vodka getting world firsts, but the vast majority of us will cheer them on, because they got to where they are legitimately, by playing the game with skill and not scrounging for exploits like bads.

Maybe people will stop worshiping these so called top guilds. You're good at a video game that's nice but hardly worthy of serious praise. I think the bans should have been harsher but that's just my opinion.

Originally Posted by Emanuel095

So many dumb people here bashing Paragon, and paragon only. When in fact pretty much every top 10 guild DID THE SAME.

You're wrong. Ensidia Envy Paragon and Method were the only ones from the top 10 who did. Its not even close to "every"

And the reason people bash paragon is cause they were #1. You dont expect this kind of excuses from them.

Needless to say they deserved it and atleast they apologized and admitted they were wrong even though we know its to save face.

Originally Posted by wilcox1232

fix it before it goes live and it won't be a problem. You can't tell me NOBODY thought of this before it went live. They shouldn't have to apologize the game let them do it therefore its in the game.

You really don't understand the definition of Exploit do you? It's a multi-million dollar game, there are bound to be bugs and exploits to find. By taking advantage of it, they violate the ToS, simple as that.

You find an exploit, you report it. Or face the consequences as many top guilds have.

One must wonder if they did this exploit on their real main character's account. I think it's safe to assume that they know the consequences of cheating, and they also know that when new content comes out that Blizzard keeps an eye on the top guilds, invisibly. Therefore, it's logical to conclude that they did not do this on their main character's account. Furthermore, given the amount of money and time that they invest in this game, one can safely conclude that they have more than one account. If Blizzard were to ban them it would not make a difference because they have characters in the same gear as their mains on different accounts, so they would just log on those accounts and raid.

Originally Posted by Thallidomaniac

It does when you miss out a legitimate World First by milliseconds to a guild that resorted to such exploits.

Learn to read, he said Blizz would take care of it and other players should just stay out of it. It is good they got punished, but it doesn't make me happy or sad...what does it mean to me what some other guild on a different realm is doing.

So they knew it was wrong and they still did it anyways.

Originally Posted by P4R45171K

Does their cheating affect you? Why can't people play this game for their own amusement? Who cares how many guilds exploited, they will get their punishment and it will affect you exactly 0%. All these people saying glad they got suspended or glad they got their comeuppance are just being silly. 99% of the people who play wow do not care, will not care, heck most do not even know who paragon is, nor do they care. It's a game, have fun playing your game. If your game is made better by other people's misery, then you need a new game.

Then you sir must be the 1%. No of course it doesn't affect me with what they did. The fact is they, as the number 1 guild should have reported it. They didn't. They chose to keep going to get the world first. That, Mr. 1%, is why I'm posting here.

Originally Posted by dazmar

What about Ensidia, Method, Envy, and who knows what other guilds?

I don't get why people single out Paragon. At least they owned up to it.

Exactly but they are world first haters gonna hate

From Method: http://www.methodwow.com/board/conte...R-exploit-bans Paragon weren't the only ones, according to this some got perma bans as well.

This post from Hermanni on the Paragon forums pretty much sums up why an apology was useless and why Paragon are no better than the rest:

I logged in 30 minutes ago to unequip some items from my character for general amusement. Great success.

What a half-assed apology. We don't think we cheated, just eliminated RNG. But we are... sorry? For future apologies don't list what you think are justifications and say you don't think it justifies your behavior. It is clear you think that you were justified and are only apologizing because you got caught.

blizz should of banned all accounts permanently. just more swifty justice here, where they dont dare ban people that do wrong if they have enough followers on twitter

Wow, super mature and smart open letter to the community by DParagon. Big change from the drama in the Ensidia days every time they got banned. There is a big hope that WoW will still be going strong in WoP looking from both sides, the players that are staying and that Blizzard is still doing a lot to make it fun and interesting which is extremely hard for such an old game.

i am glad blizzard have done this to cheaters or exploiters. I remember in another game i played where a very similar thing happened and loads of players left because the company didnt react fast enough or hard enough.

And let be honest we are all going to suffer for this with the extended maintainace happening on the servers to check the database etc, so they cheat and we all suffer thank you these cheaters for making this happen.

Originally Posted by snuffglops

"The fact that others were using it as well is no justification for doing it ourselves."

I just cannot agree with that. I could have gotten away with that statement. ALL of my friends in this game could have gotten away with that statement. But Paragon is probably the best PvE guild in the world. They're going to do virtually everything they can to keep it that way. When they see that other people are taking advantage of a bug that could give them a decent enough edge to get a world first, they're going to take it. And so, if I were leading Paragon, that would have been my reply to Blizzard. "We do everything we can to remain the most competitive PvE guild in the world. If other people are taking advantage of a bug that Blizzard should have gotten fixed on PTR, then we're going to do the same thing."

It kind of reminds of people taking steroids in Major League Baseball. By the time the era was at an end, you had so many players saying that they were doing it just because so many other people were as well, and they didn't want to lose their edge in the game.

Cheating is wrong and using the excuse that you needed to do it in order to be competitive is never right. Do you really believe it is ok for top level athletes to take PEDs because they need to to be competitive? That's why there are rules in place to ban those who get caught. They took their chances and they are serving their suspension.