MMO-Champion - Mists of Pandaria Buff and Debuff Design
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Mists of Pandaria Buff and Debuff Design
Originally Posted by Blizzard (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)
We recently released an update to the Mists of Pandaria talent tree. Since the expansion is still in development, these updates represent a snapshot of where we are at any given moment and not a final design where we step back and say “Ladies and gentlemen, we have achieved perfection. Let us not change a thing.” If you’ve been playing the game for a while, you’ve probably realized by now that we never think we’ll hit perfection, and we probably never will.

One design that we haven’t focused on much yet is the plan for various group buffs and debuffs. Some specs have their buffs in place and some do not. Rather than trying to describe each omission, we thought we’d just dump the whole design on you here. As with the rest of the expansion’s systems, we’re not even in beta yet, so there’s plenty of time for things to change.

First, some underlying design goals, so you might understand where we’re coming from. Our main goals for group buffs are:


  • Make you feel more powerful when grouped with other players.
  • Give you lots of freedom to invite whom you want. This gets to be a problem when there are too many mandatory buffs spread out among too many specs. . .
  • …But not offer too many incentives to class stack. If you can achieve every buff with, say, only three players, then there might be a tendency to fill all of the other slots with whoever is best for a particular situation. Some class stacking is inevitable at the cutting-edge level, but to some extent, the players on the cutting edge of raiding enjoy extreme min-maxing. For the rest of us, we try to make sure you can finish all of the encounters without feeling like you need a huge roster of folks waiting in the wings for their one fight.
  • We tend to be more generous to DPS specs, since groups -- especially raids -- already have ample reasons to bring tanks and healers.
  • We generally don’t want a DPS spec to have to switch to a different spec in the same role just to bring a different buff. An example would be a Combat rogue who has to go Assassination just for a buff. In our experience, players are less likely to switch from a ranged to a melee DPS spec just for a buff, so DPS shaman and DPS druids might bring different buffs.

And finally some notes on the categories below:


  • The list only includes what we consider “traditional” buffs, such as Prayer of Fortitude. It doesn’t include utility like being great at snaring, battle rez, knock backs, high DPS while moving, and other mechanics. Those ultimately all factor into a raid or Battleground comp as well.
  • The matrix is a little more complex than it appears. A paladin, for example, can only offer one Blessing at a time, while a warrior can only do one shout at a time. You can’t assume one character can cover every buff or debuff listed below at the same time.
  • Some of these are active (you must cast them, like Prayer of Fortitude) while others are passive. Note that totems no longer bring passive buffs as a rule.
  • You’ll see several categories consolidated or gone. Bleeds no longer made sense, since everyone who cared about bleeds already buffed themselves. Magical resistance we just removed from the game, though there are some abilities that provide magical damage reduction.
  • We are still likely to use the design that hunters, especially Beastmaster hunters, can fill in for missing buffs or debuffs by using certain pets.

As always, we’d love to get your feedback on this design.

Buffs

Stats
Effect: +5% Strength, Agility, and Intellect
Example: Blessing of Kings
Brought by: Any druid, any monk, any paladin

Stamina
Effect: +10% Stamina
Example: Power Word: Fortitude
Brought by: Any priest, any warlock, any warrior

Attack Power
Effect: +10% melee and ranged attack power (which will be the same value again)
Example: Battle Shout
Brought by: Any death knight, any hunter, any warrior

Spell Power
Effect: +10% spell power (there will no longer be a 6% version)
Example: Arcane Brilliance
Brought by: Any mage, any shaman, any warlock

Haste
Effect: +10% melee and ranged haste
Example: Improved Icy Talons
Brought by: Frost and Unholy death knights, any rogue, Enhancement shaman

Spell Haste
Effect: +5% spell haste
Example: Moonkin Aura
Brought by: Balance druids, Shadow priests, Elemental shaman

Critical Strike
Effect: +5% ranged, melee, and spell critical chance
Example: Leader of the Pack
Brought by: Guardian and Feral druids, any hunter, any mage

Mastery
Effect: +5 mastery
Example: This is a new category
Brought by: Windwalker monks, any paladin, any shaman

Debuffs

Weakened Armor
Effect: -12% armor
Example: Sunder Armor
Brought by: Any druid, any rogue, any warrior

Physical Vulnerability
Effect: +4% physical damage taken
Example: Brittle Bones
Brought by: Frost and Unholy death knights, Retribution paladins, Arms and Fury warriors

Magic Vulnerability
Effect: +8% spell damage taken
Example: Curse of the Elements
Brought by: Any rogue, any warlock

Weakened Blows
Effect: -10% physical damage done
Example: Previously Demoralizing Shout; now Thunder Clap
Brought by: Blood death knight, Feral and Guardian druid, Brewmaster monk, Protection or Retribution paladin, any warrior (any tank)

Slow Casting

Effect: -30% casting speed
Example: Mind-numbing Poison
Brought by: Any death knight, any rogue, any warlock

Mortal Wounds
Effect: -25% healing received
Example: Mortal Strike
Brought by: Arms or Fury warrior, any rogue, any hunter

Greg “Ghostcrawler” Street is the lead systems designer for World of Warcraft. He was unsuccessful in convincing the rest of the class team to change Arms warrior mastery to decreased falling damage taken.
This article was originally published in forum thread: Mists of Pandaria Buff and Debuff Design started by chaud View original post
Comments 231 Comments
  1. Hey Zeus's Avatar
    itd be great if they made these affect bosses. since for the most part you cant use like 3/4s of your 'special' abilities against bosses. i like to be able to gouge thaddeus if i so choose.

    otherwise... nice i guess? i dont really care about buffs... skill > buff anyways.
  1. Kebren's Avatar
    I really wish they change the concept where melee bring melee buffs and casters bring caster buffs. Basically to get your healers a full set of buffs, you're going to bringing alot of casters. It just continues to promote stacking alot of casters and bringing the minimum number of melee. Throwing spell haste and spell power on some melee would help alot.
  1. Hey Zeus's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by TankRamp View Post
    People still play this game?
    people who dont play this game are still so obsessed they cant leave forums about it?
  1. Eon Drache's Avatar
    Weakened Blows is going to suck if it doesn't change for Paladins. As is, we have to sacrifice a charge of Holy Power and some dps to keep up the debuff if we are the only ones that use it.
  1. Agatha's Avatar
    Greg “Ghostcrawler” Street is the lead systems designer for World of Warcraft. He was unsuccessful in convincing the rest of the class team to change Arms warrior mastery to decreased falling damage taken.
    That made me laugh... And I love the fact that any rogue can have 10% melee haste
  1. NatePsychotic's Avatar
    Haste
    Effect: +10% melee and ranged haste
    Example: Improved Icy Talons
    Brought by: Frost and Unholy death knights, any rogue, Enhancement shaman
    Unholy Death Knights get this as a passive now? Nice!
  1. sonololo's Avatar
    bye +5% crit taken from fire mages.
  1. Caiada's Avatar
    Looks good overall, I think. Just some further refinements to the WotLK/Cata model.
  1. Reserk's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by NatePsychotic View Post
    Unholy Death Knights get this as a passive now? Nice!
    O.o Nice didn't pick that up. Very welcome change. I didn't like bringing Unholy DKS mainly for that reason.
  1. Bruescrues's Avatar
    What happened to Horn of Winter?
  1. Glnger's Avatar
    oh yay! MS will still be a around... le sigh
  1. mudkipzz's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Bulli85 View Post
    why dont they just make it so when you go into a dungeon, press a button and u instantly have all the buffs, since they want you to have all the buffs already
    good idea bro sounds lovely
  1. Nobar's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by NatePsychotic View Post
    Unholy Death Knights get this as a passive now? Nice!
    2 passives (brittle bones and icy talons).
  1. Karshda's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by BLSTMASTER View Post
    I thought they were going to make DI a raid wide haste buff instead of the current version (haste for 2 ppl and increased dot/hot).
    Weird to see it missing here :/*
    I believe that Dark Intent is the 10% spell power buff for Warlocks now


    Quote Originally Posted by Bruescrues View Post
    What happened to Horn of Winter?
    Think Horn of Winter is the 10% attack power buff
  1. Frazzle.d's Avatar
    More unique buffs that are synchronious with OTHER specs / classes as well as their own would be nice to see. There aren't ENOUGH of spells like Dark Intent, Unholy Frenzy, Power Infusion.. for example.

    To promote engaging, engrossing and involved, intelligent group based MMO play, you must give players spells that give them a choice; ie: do I use this on myself to perform better personally, or will I save it for the melee dps hero when he pops his self buffs?
  1. NatePsychotic's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Nobar View Post
    2 passives (brittle bones and icy talons).
    Going to see so much haste while solo when they introduce these talents before MoP.
  1. Sforza's Avatar
    As far as i know, hammer of the righteous also gives a charge of Hp.
  1. Nielah's Avatar
    Looks interesting indeed.
  1. jonbourrie's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Glnger View Post
    oh yay! MS will still be a around... le sigh
    Cause caster comps are inefficient!! Get a clue.
  1. Milkshake86's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by chaud View Post
    Mists of Pandaria Buff and Debuff Design
    Originally Posted by Blizzard (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)
    We recently released an update to the Mists of Pandaria talent tree. Since the expansion is still in development, these updates represent a snapshot of where we are at any given moment and not a final design where we step back and say “Ladies and gentlemen, we have achieved perfection. Let us not change a thing.” If you’ve been playing the game for a while, you’ve probably realized by now that we never think we’ll hit perfection, and we probably never will.

    One design that we haven’t focused on much yet is the plan for various group buffs and debuffs. Some specs have their buffs in place and some do not. Rather than trying to describe each omission, we thought we’d just dump the whole design on you here. As with the rest of the expansion’s systems, we’re not even in beta yet, so there’s plenty of time for things to change.

    First, some underlying design goals, so you might understand where we’re coming from. Our main goals for group buffs are:


    • Make you feel more powerful when grouped with other players.
    • Give you lots of freedom to invite whom you want. This gets to be a problem when there are too many mandatory buffs spread out among too many specs. . .
    • …But not offer too many incentives to class stack. If you can achieve every buff with, say, only three players, then there might be a tendency to fill all of the other slots with whoever is best for a particular situation. Some class stacking is inevitable at the cutting-edge level, but to some extent, the players on the cutting edge of raiding enjoy extreme min-maxing. For the rest of us, we try to make sure you can finish all of the encounters without feeling like you need a huge roster of folks waiting in the wings for their one fight.
    • We tend to be more generous to DPS specs, since groups -- especially raids -- already have ample reasons to bring tanks and healers.
    • We generally don’t want a DPS spec to have to switch to a different spec in the same role just to bring a different buff. An example would be a Combat rogue who has to go Assassination just for a buff. In our experience, players are less likely to switch from a ranged to a melee DPS spec just for a buff, so DPS shaman and DPS druids might bring different buffs.

    And finally some notes on the categories below:


    • The list only includes what we consider “traditional” buffs, such as Prayer of Fortitude. It doesn’t include utility like being great at snaring, battle rez, knock backs, high DPS while moving, and other mechanics. Those ultimately all factor into a raid or Battleground comp as well.
    • The matrix is a little more complex than it appears. A paladin, for example, can only offer one Blessing at a time, while a warrior can only do one shout at a time. You can’t assume one character can cover every buff or debuff listed below at the same time.
    • Some of these are active (you must cast them, like Prayer of Fortitude) while others are passive. Note that totems no longer bring passive buffs as a rule.
    • You’ll see several categories consolidated or gone. Bleeds no longer made sense, since everyone who cared about bleeds already buffed themselves. Magical resistance we just removed from the game, though there are some abilities that provide magical damage reduction.
    • We are still likely to use the design that hunters, especially Beastmaster hunters, can fill in for missing buffs or debuffs by using certain pets.

    As always, we’d love to get your feedback on this design.

    Buffs

    Stats
    Effect: +5% Strength, Agility, and Intellect
    Example: Blessing of Kings
    Brought by: Any druid, any monk, any paladin

    Stamina
    Effect: +10% Stamina
    Example: Power Word: Fortitude
    Brought by: Any priest, any warlock, any warrior

    Attack Power
    Effect: +10% melee and ranged attack power (which will be the same value again)
    Example: Battle Shout
    Brought by: Any death knight, any hunter, any warrior

    Spell Power
    Effect: +10% spell power (there will no longer be a 6% version)
    Example: Arcane Brilliance
    Brought by: Any mage, any shaman, any warlock

    Haste
    Effect: +10% melee and ranged haste
    Example: Improved Icy Talons
    Brought by: Frost and Unholy death knights, any rogue, Enhancement shaman

    Spell Haste
    Effect: +5% spell haste
    Example: Moonkin Aura
    Brought by: Balance druids, Shadow priests, Elemental shaman

    Critical Strike
    Effect: +5% ranged, melee, and spell critical chance
    Example: Leader of the Pack
    Brought by: Guardian and Feral druids, any hunter, any mage

    Mastery
    Effect: +5 mastery
    Example: This is a new category
    Brought by: Windwalker monks, any paladin, any shaman

    Debuffs

    Weakened Armor
    Effect: -12% armor
    Example: Sunder Armor
    Brought by: Any druid, any rogue, any warrior

    Physical Vulnerability
    Effect: +4% physical damage taken
    Example: Brittle Bones
    Brought by: Frost and Unholy death knights, Retribution paladins, Arms and Fury warriors

    Magic Vulnerability
    Effect: +8% spell damage taken
    Example: Curse of the Elements
    Brought by: Any rogue, any warlock

    Weakened Blows
    Effect: -10% physical damage done
    Example: Previously Demoralizing Shout; now Thunder Clap
    Brought by: Blood death knight, Feral and Guardian druid, Brewmaster monk, Protection or Retribution paladin, any warrior (any tank)

    Slow Casting

    Effect: -30% casting speed
    Example: Mind-numbing Poison
    Brought by: Any death knight, any rogue, any warlock

    Mortal Wounds
    Effect: -25% healing received
    Example: Mortal Strike
    Brought by: Arms or Fury warrior, any rogue, any hunter

    Greg “Ghostcrawler” Street is the lead systems designer for World of Warcraft. He was unsuccessful in convincing the rest of the class team to change Arms warrior mastery to decreased falling damage taken.
    No incentive to run 25m at all

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