MMO-Champion - PvP Gear in 5.2 and Beyond
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PvP Gear in 5.2 and Beyond
Originally Posted by Blizzard (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)
Change is coming to PvP gear in the relatively near future, and we wanted to provide a not-so-brief update on the improvements we’re planning, while pulling the curtain aside a bit so you can see the thought processes that motivated the coming changes. We also thought this would also be a great time to get the World of Warcraft PvP community involved in the discussion.

The Challenges
There are a few main issues that we’re working to address within the next couple of patches:

Early Advantage
Currently, it’s very common for players that have a head start at the start of the season to earn the best gear quickly and gain a dominating position on the ladder with a very high Match Making Rating (MMR). It’s then pretty common for those players to only participate on the ladder in a minimal way before reaping their rewards at the very end of the season. That’s not particularly good for competition, and we don’t think that it’s a very fun way for a competitive ladder to work. We would like to see the ladder remain active, and for high ranking players to earn their positions throughout the season, instead of just blitzing early and camping a spot above a certain threshold.

Mid-season Start
Players getting into PvP mid-season face a very significant challenge to gear up and become competitive because players that started earlier in the season are so far ahead in terms of gear. We want to make it more reasonable for a player to join in on organized PvP mid-season, while still rewarding the commitment of players that have remained invested in PvP throughout the season.

Rating Requirements
The current rating requirements on PvP gear create an artificially sharp division between players over 2200 rating and those below that rating threshold, which is unduly difficult to cross. We’d prefer that teams progress up the ladder on a curve against gradually more difficult opponents, instead of running into a wall at a certain rating.

Gear Advantage
Over time, the gap in power between Honor and Conquest PvP items has widened. This happened, in part, because it’s necessary for us to preserve the balance in power between PvP and PvE gear so that one doesn’t become the most obvious path to victory for the other. Right now, there are four tiers of PvE items, but only two tiers of PvP items. To keep Honor items from being the best choice for entry into PvE, they needed to have a lower item level than equivalent Raid Finder items. At the same time, Conquest gear still needs to be better for PvP than Heroic raid items, which puts it way over on the opposite end of the power scale from its Honor counterpart. While there are items that bridge the gap between Raid Finder and Heroic Raid loot, there really haven’t been any PvP items to bridge the gap between Honor and Conquest gear. We plan to solve that problem by introducing new tiers of PvP items, changing which currencies it takes to buy items and when, and by making PvP weapons more readily available in general.

Flexibility
While the item upgrade system has the benefit of allowing players that have “finished” their PvP set to continue to progress their character’s power, because there’s built-in pressure to continue upgrading their main set, it also means that players don’t always feel comfortable spending those points on alternate sets of gear for different specs (though it’s worth mentioning that the upgrade system will be disabled for patch 5.2). We’d like to make it easier for players in this position to experiment with alternate specs and stats.

Moving Forward
Meeting these challenges will mean that some changes are coming to MMR, PvP gear, and how gear is earned and paid for:

Team Rating Inflation
As we’ve mentioned previously, we want to see the ladder rankings decided toward the end of a season, and not a foregone conclusion dictated by what happens at the start. As discussed in the PvP in Mists of Pandaria Dev Watercooler, as of patch 5.2 Team Rating will gradually increase as players participate in PvP over the course of the season. We expect the new system to help ensure that the ladder remains active at all ratings and that the competition stays fierce from start to finish.

Gear Changes
To accomplish the goals of making PvP more accessible and less punishing, gearing more consistent and flexible, and flattening the power curve out over the course of a season, there are some significant changes in the works:
  • 2200 rating requirements removed from all PvP gear. (5.2)
  • Gear will be available in four tiers:
    • Dreadful Gladiator’s gear will be crafted. (5.2)
    • Malevolent Gladiator’s gear, including weapons, will be purchased with Honor Points. (5.2)
    • New tier of PvP items: Tyrannical Gladiator’s gear will be purchased with Conquest Points. (5.2)
    • Tyrannical Gladiator’s gear can be purchased for Honor after 27000 Conquest Points are earned for the season. (5.3)
    • Elite Tyrannical Gladiator’s gear can only be purchased with Conquest Points after 27,000 Conquest Points have been earned for the season. (5.2)

The 2200 rating requirements on gear will be removed in patch 5.2, and when that happens, the only barrier to acquiring top of the line Elite gear will be the 27,000 Conquest Point seasonal currency requirement. While highly rated players will still earn gear more quickly, there won’t be an invisible wall to progression at 2200 rating.

As of patch 5.3, patches that don’t include the start of a new season will offer players the opportunity to purchase Conquest Point weapons without first meeting the seasonal currency requirement for them. We’re relaxing these restrictions because, by the mid-point of the season, the restriction has served its purpose and is no longer necessary. It’s worth noting here that the 27,000 Conquest Points earned requirement must always be met to buy Elite armor and weapons in every season.

In terms of relative power, we’re tuning the item levels, PvP Power, and Resilience on the new set of PvP items so that the difference between Malevolent and Elite Tyrannical Gladiator’s gear is similar to the relationship between this season’s Dreadful and Malevolent Gladiator’s gear. This helps accomplish the goal of smoothing out the power curve by adding a tier in the middle of the PvP gear spectrum. Also, to add choices and flexibility, once the seasonal currency requirement is met, players will have the option to purchase Tyrannical pieces for Honor, which should allow players to more easily experiment with alternate stat loadouts and specs.

Mid-Season Catch Up
Players who are starting their journey into PvP mid-season start significantly behind the gearing curve. While we want to avoid invalidating the effort of players that have competed for the whole season, we agree with the feedback we’ve received that the starting gap is too large, so a new Conquest Point catch-up cap will be implemented using the following formula:

(Current week of the season) * 1000 – (Conquest earned thus far this season)

Here are some examples of how this will work:

Player A is starting PvP for the first time in week 10 of the season, and hasn’t earned any Conquest Points at all that season. He will have an additional cap of 10,000 points added to his normal weekly rating based cap.

Player B has already earned 5,000 Conquest Points by week 10, so she would have an additional cap of 5,000 points added to her normal weekly rating based cap.

Player C has been playing all season long, and has earned more than 10,000 Conquest Points by week 10. He only has the normal weekly cap to work with (but should already be on their way to being well geared).

If a player “redeems” their catch up cap by earning all those points, then they’ll begin the next week at their normal weekly rating based cap. Should they miss more weeks, then the catch up cap accrues again.

So, to sum up the planned changes for Patch 5.2:
  • Rating requirements will be removed from PvP gear.
  • Malevolent Gladiator’s gear, including weapons, will be available for purchase with Honor Points.
  • A new tier of Conquest Point gear will be added that becomes available once 27000 Conquest Points have been earned for the season.
  • Team Rating will gradually increase during the season for teams and players that continue to compete in PvP. This system is explained in the Mists of Pandaria PvP Dev Watercooler.

And here are the specific changes that are planned to hit in Patch 5.3:
  • In patches that don’t include a new season (including patch 5.3), the seasonal currency requirement of 27,000 Conquest Points earned will be lifted from weapons. The seasonal currency requirement must always be met to purchase Elite items, though.
  • Once the seasonal currency requirement is met, players will be able to purchase Tyrannical Gladiator’s gear with Honor Points.
  • The Conquest Point catch up cap will be introduced.

Conclusions
Overall, we expect that these changes will create a more active and competitive PvP environment, narrow the gear gap between the highest rated players and those still working their way up the ladder, and open the door for more experimentation in terms of class or spec.
We look forward to hearing your opinions and feedback on these upcoming changes!
This article was originally published in forum thread: PvP Gear in 5.2 and Beyond started by chaud View original post
Comments 264 Comments
  1. Zots's Avatar
    5.2 is going to be the best patch ever. period.
  1. Hextor's Avatar
    Probably best PvP change in years. Now it's all about the skill (or spec balance ^^)
    P.S. I laugh at all the mmr exploiters that only play a few weeks and then feel entitled to be the sole owners of t2 gear.
  1. CodeConqueror's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by JhanZ View Post
    They should not give elite gear to 2200 players anymore. Reverting the change would be a bad idea. I'll break it down.

    1.) The people actually complaining about are very few in number, there's really nothing to worry about from them crying endlessly.
    2.) Giving elite gear to everyone encourages more people in general to participate.You remove the carrot on a stick from mediocre players and give a carrot on a stick to nearly every PvP player. This = success.
    3.) From a business standpoint, it's a sound idea. More people like I said will be intrigued and subs will increase because of it. Also, having more options to choose from color variations will help reduce boredom and increase variety.
    4.) 2200 players aren't really good. They are mediocre. If anything put a cosmetic tabard and give it to 2400, 2500, and 2600 players. Those players truly deserve it. 2200 is honestly nothing impressive, from the view of a player who's been much higher in the past.
    5.) It helps kill the boosting/carry business. People will no longer have an incentive to buy T2 weapons OR special snowflake gear anymore, this can only be good for the community. It will help increase competition and people looking to get the 2200 ratings simply to prove they are good, not to chase some carrot on a stick.
    6.) It will help remove the toxic tryhards who can only brag about their snowflake gear and are too bad to get any other cosmetic reward. It will reduce elitism and general hostility that's prevalent in the PVP community today. The top, top players I've actually talked to or read a post from DO NOT CARE about this. They simply do not, because the challenge is all that's needed for them and they do not need to feel special, because they realize it's absolutely pathetic.

    All in all, it's an excellent change and one I have no doubt Blizzard considered and planned through. This change can ONLY be good for the PvP community as a whole. If you do not support this, frankly, you are being a selfish brat and only caring about stroking your ego instead of realizing the big picture.
    1) Not true. I've seen tons of them here and on the official post. Whether any change is good or bad, there will almost always be a vocal group endlessly crying about it.
    2) By this measure, there's no reason to do anything in game that requires skill to earn. Extend this logic to PVE and you should also give all players who participate in normal raiding a way to earn heroic tier gear without having to down heroic bosses. Granted PVE and PVP shouldn't be treated the same, but the logic remains.
    3) There's no way to know for sure how/if it will impact subscription numbers but it will most likely increase them due to frustrated players that gave up might come back and try again. But, how many players will walk away due to nothing to aim for when reaching high ratings? Who knows, maybe none.
    4) Sounds like BS but w/e. If 2.2k isn't anything special, then they should adjust the rating requirement to reflect what minimum rating a skilled player should be able to attain. I think 2.2k still demonstrates enough skill to merit a reward (yes, some people will get carried but there's no way to fully eliminate that); it doesn't make you the most skilled, but skilled enough IMHO.
    5) This is already addressed by #2.
    6) You exemplify the exact elitism and toxic hostility in the selfishly bratty way you claim to be against (your final statement reflects this as well). You sound like a bitter player who hasn't been able to reach 2.2k this season or last and just want a way to feel better about it. But, what do I know, I don't know you, just your words.
  1. Rafal's Avatar
    Yay, these PVP changes are great! >.> it always bugged me that no matter what I would never catch up to the 2200 crowed. I never felt that way about Heroics raids in PVE. ...

    Why?

    Because there isn't a random wall of entry preventing any sort to progress whatsoever.
  1. asaguden's Avatar
    Uhm... so exactly what's the point of having the ''elite'' sets in 5.2 if EVERYONE can get it? there's nothing elite with it at all than, that's like having a race and giving seriously everyone a gold medal, then the gold medal is worth shit, now they might aswell just have the normal set and nothing else. Atleast in my opinion that feels stupid. Also, they really need to add some sort of reward for being higher rated than others mid-season, like tabards or transmog gears and so on, otherwise there's no point in playing arenas, you can just get the super high cap in RBGs instead.
  1. JhanZ's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by asaguden View Post
    Uhm... so exactly what's the point of having the ''elite'' sets in 5.2 if EVERYONE can get it? there's nothing elite with it at all than, that's like having a race and giving seriously everyone a gold medal, then the gold medal is worth shit, now they might aswell just have the normal set and nothing else. Atleast in my opinion that feels stupid. Also, they really need to add some sort of reward for being higher rated than others mid-season, like tabards or transmog gears and so on, otherwise there's no point in playing arenas, you can just get the super high cap in RBGs instead.
    Why do you think you are elite at 2200? You are anything but elite. You are still miles behind the really good players that can achieve Gladiator and beyond. Blizzard is just removing the carrot on a stick from mediocre players and placing it in front of nearly everyone, boosting PvP popularity. It's a good change that you are too blinded by your ego to see.

    People say they have nothing to work for anymore, then why do so many of these "elite" players still play tons of games after attaining their gear set? Certainly not because the incentive is now removed once you have it. Sorry, but none of you make sense. At. All.

    Good riddance.
  1. Deathgoose's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by 1magga View Post
    soooo, whats the reward for being awsome in arena now ? elite gear was the reward, now there is nothing for 2200+,2500+ etc rewards
    For being able to /brofist your teammate(s) after winning yet again instead of telling them "they suck and need to l2p ffs brb, gonna hit /2 and look a better team "
  1. CodeConqueror's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by JhanZ View Post
    Why do you think you are elite at 2200? You are anything but elite. You are still miles behind the really good players that can achieve Gladiator and beyond. Blizzard is just removing the carrot on a stick from mediocre players and placing it in front of nearly everyone, boosting PvP popularity. It's a good change that you are too blinded by your ego to see.

    People say they have nothing to work for anymore, then why do so many of these "elite" players still play tons of games after attaining their gear set? Certainly not because the incentive is now removed once you have it. Sorry, but none of you make sense. At. All.

    Good riddance.
    You embody the exact elitist, snobby, toxic players you rail against. Any point you're trying to make is being drowned out by your attitude.
  1. Prokne's Avatar
    IMO PvP gear shouldnt even exist. PvP should be all about skill and gear advantages should have nothing to do with it. If you play an FPS game like CS or Halo, everyone has access to the same equipment and the only thing that matters is how well you use it. Other games like CoD where you can earn new weapons, its mostly just a skin and the basic weapons are just as good.

    All characters should be normalized with the same stats whenever you enter a PvP instance.
  1. asaguden's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by JhanZ View Post
    Why do you think you are elite at 2200? You are anything but elite. You are still miles behind the really good players that can achieve Gladiator and beyond. Blizzard is just removing the carrot on a stick from mediocre players and placing it in front of nearly everyone, boosting PvP popularity. It's a good change that you are too blinded by your ego to see.

    People say they have nothing to work for anymore, then why do so many of these "elite" players still play tons of games after attaining their gear set? Certainly not because the incentive is now removed once you have it. Sorry, but none of you make sense. At. All.
    I never said you're elite because you're at 2200, you're just better than others obviously, but mostly i was just talking about the elite gear itself, the extra reward at higher rating. I wouldnt care if it was just called ''tier 2'' or simply called nothing but just another color, but there still has to be some kind of reward, because that makes it so much more fun. I think most people, even you, agree's with me when i say that everything is more fun when you get something cool out of it. Sure now you might say, but hey, you get a title in the end of the season if you're good, but that's in the end of the season, what about the rest of the season? At the moment i play my main to very high rating, then i usually dont do that much arena on that char, but then i instead do alot of arenas on all of my alts to reach higher goals, which one atm is 2200 where i get some sort of reward for my work. I LOVED the system they had in tbc and wrath, where you got your parts the higher rated you were, because then there was not just the 2200 goal, but actually alot of goals and mile-stones you could reach, which made it really fun. But that's just me, i love having a goal and getting a reward for reaching it.
  1. Sidone's Avatar
    It would be good for some people here to follow this link. http://blue.mmo-champion.com/topic/2...-52-announced/ It shows blue responses to some of the questions also mentioned here. Infact, the original thread as a whole is a good read.
  1. dokilar's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Lemonpartyfan View Post
    Or you could just go play that game, instead of trying to drastically change this game to suit yourself.
    lol ok, really?

    like blizzard (any company really) doesnt take the good ideas from other games and implement them in their own product?

    you are welcome to your opinion but i strongly disagree with it. the pvp gear system is quite good and something that i think should be in just about every mmo. in a pvp setting everyone, i believe, should be given the same gear. it should be about skill > gear. in the past i was a firm believer that the entry level blue honor gear should have been puchased for a small amount of gold similar to the way swtor did. when gw2 came out i thought that that was the better approach.

    pvp is about killing the other player, plain and simple so while i believe skill determines your ability to do this its not the case 100% of the time. someone who just hit 90 in greens will get absolutely stomped by people who are in full pvp gear. there is really no competitiveness/challenge that person can put up until they obtain better gear so whats the point in forcing them to grind?

    now, if they can just finally change the way all spells/abilities work they might actually get some sort of resemblence of balance in the game
  1. Nerraw's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Zoros View Post
    How many guilds try to get the first world kill? Less than 1%
    How many players at the beggining of expansion try to be first lvl max? Less than 1%

    Players are realistic and prefer human goals. 2200 rating was a challenging goal with a good reward feeling for an important amount of players. The highest rating is something that only a minimal amount of players care about.

    Why atempt to raise the rating? If Blizzard don't make me feel unhappy with rewards at higher rating than mine, I'm happy where I am. In other words, PvP will be farming. Each week cap your conquest points and that's all. No goals and at the end, boring as doing daylis.
    I didn't say where they'd be the best. Realm best, or faction best, or even guild best, are things people do strive for.
  1. jimlow's Avatar
    Damn looks like I will be grinding honor on my alts to get some PVP weapons. They are better then anything I can get in LFR or Heroics. Hopefully they might add some 490 craftable weapons.
  1. manniefaces's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by JhanZ View Post
    Why do you think you are elite at 2200? You are anything but elite. You are still miles behind the really good players that can achieve Gladiator and beyond. Blizzard is just removing the carrot on a stick from mediocre players and placing it in front of nearly everyone, boosting PvP popularity. It's a good change that you are too blinded by your ego to see.

    People say they have nothing to work for anymore, then why do so many of these "elite" players still play tons of games after attaining their gear set? Certainly not because the incentive is now removed once you have it. Sorry, but none of you make sense. At. All.

    Good riddance.
    The point of the game is fun and competition. It is not so you can brag about having something others are looked out of having. If you are the best then the gear should not matter.
  1. JhanZ's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by manniefaces View Post
    The point of the game is fun and competition. It is not so you can brag about having something others are looked out of having. If you are the best then the gear should not matter.
    Exactly my point. People complaining about not having shiny gear that many others don't is absurd. Anyway, I've exhausted my will to argue this shit anymore. Changes are going through and the game will be infinitely better in 5.2. Praise Blizzard!
  1. caninepawprints's Avatar
    I love these changes. I wish they had been implemented a long time ago. Now I have a reason to really get into PVP!
  1. Zoros's Avatar
    We will return to wotlk days, when what matters was not acomplish a challenge, just raise alts and gear them through farming.

    Where is the carrot on a stick? Ratings are meaningless, we need rewards to go for.
  1. Neversage's Avatar
    Smart changes. I appreciate the clever way to keep the gap between vets and newbs consistent instead of having it widen as each season progresses.
  1. FixDestruNow's Avatar
    I really don´t get it. If 12 million people liked the game and played it, why change the game???

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