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WoW Down to 9.6 Million Subscribers
Activision Blizzard's press release states that World of Warcraft is down to 9.6 million subscribers as of December 31, 2012. This is lower than the amount of subscribers from the "over 10 million" announced for Q3 2012. A few other interesting points:

  • Mists of Pandaria was the #3 best-selling PC game at retail.
  • Diablo III was the #1 best-selling PC game at retail, breaking PC-game sales records with more than 12 million copies sold worldwide through December 31, 2012.
This article was originally published in forum thread: WoW Down to 9.6 Million Subscribers started by chaud View original post
Comments 954 Comments
  1. Fawxey's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Polly Cronopolis View Post
    Wow, you've been playing the same video game for nearly eight years. You must be a super exciting individual. Honestly, didn't you pause for a second after typing out that you've been playing since Nov. of 2005 and realize how pathetic that is? 2005 - 2013 - YIKES! Also, pretty lol that you think 5.2 is going to be the best patch so far. Though, you probably say that about every patch since you appear to be a mega-fanboy.

    (Oh, and yes, the game does suck. Fact. Look it up.)
    I've been doing life for 24 years, i must be a really pathetic person too for doing the same thing for so long.
  1. But I Hate You All's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    Then why exactly do you think 5.2 isn't going to be an awesome patch?
    Don't twist my words

    Quote Originally Posted by Dch48 View Post
    No not every patch. The current title holder of best ever would be held by 4.2, the Firelands patch, which with the exception of the overtuned Ragnaros encounter was awesome from beginning to end. I also am not aware of any objective reference material I can look up which will say that the game sucks as a proven fact. In fact the overwhelming consensus is completely the opposite. The fact that I and many others, have been playing it since 2005, or even earlier is proof in itself that it does not in fact, suck.

    I play a Hunter and 5.2 is going to be the best patch for the class since 4.2 in terms of new tameable beasts and challenges. Aside from that, the storylines and progression will be great for all classes. It's shaping up to be similar to the Sunwell patch but without the huge mistake of the Sunwell raid itself. At least this time everyone should be able to experience everything instead of less than 2% of the participants. Warlocks also have to be very excited by getting something they have wanted for a very long time.

    If the negative Nancy's don't like hearing the facts, that is no fault of the vast majority who still enjoy playing the best game ever made.

    ^ that is all opinion which he claimed was facts.

    But to answer you the patch seems meh dailies, Raid etc nothing really making it THE BEST PATCH EVER IN WOW!!!!!! that's my opinion.
  1. rhorle's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Alastaircrawly View Post
    But to answer you the patch seems meh dailies, Raid etc nothing really making it THE BEST PATCH EVER IN WOW!!!!!! that's my opinion.
    I gotcha. You don't think it will be good just because you don't. There aren't any more dailies the most Major WoW content patches and the Raid is supposed to be similar to one of the best raids in the history of WoW (Ulduar). And I didn't twist any of your words, I asked you a question based on your implication that you don't think 5.2 will be an awesome patch.
  1. But I Hate You All's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    I gotcha. You don't think it will be good just because you don't. There aren't any more dailies the most Major WoW content patches and the Raid is supposed to be similar to one of the best raids in the history of WoW (Ulduar)]. And I didn't twist any of your words, I asked you a question based on your implication that you don't think 5.2 will be an awesome patch.
    the bold is more opinion. Some of us do not enjoy dailies. Some do not care about raiding.
  1. rhorle's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Alastaircrawly View Post
    the bold is more opinion. Some of us do not enjoy dailies. Some do not care about raiding.
    It isn't just an opinion. It is a widely regarded opinion that Ulduar is one of the best raids ever introduced into WoW. Since you disagree what would qualify as one of the best raids in WoW? Also why do you keep deferring your answer? Let me rephrase it then, What activity would make it an awesome patch for you?

    It also begs the question, if you don't enjoy any of the activities in the game why do you stay and discuss the game? And rate patches for a game you don't like? Move on.
  1. Celista's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Alastaircrawly View Post
    the bold is more opinion. Some of us do not enjoy dailies. Some do not care about raiding.
    Serious question: who REALLY likes dailies? By "like" I do not mean simply tolerate, I mean actually look forward to doing them...
  1. rhorle's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Celista View Post
    Serious question: who REALLY likes dailies? By "like" I do not mean simply tolerate, I mean actually look forward to doing them...
    I do. They are quick, easy and fun and they give something to do when I'm waiting for other things. I prefer the Tillers and Golden lotus dailies and rarely do the others because I like them less (I am exalted with everything). My only issue with them is that they can't be done in a raid group as that can be a perfect time to knock some out. (While you wait for people to show up, or if you are stand by and what not). Why not dailies, what else would you be doing? One time quests? Sitting in a city? AoE farming things for rep or gold? You don't even have to do them if you don't want to. Yes even the MoP dailies are optional.

    I really don't see any good reasons why someone would be utterly against an activity that has you playing the game. If you dislike playing the game that much then why even play it in the first place?
  1. Celista's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    I do. They are quick, easy and fun and they give something to do when I'm waiting for other things. I prefer the Tillers and Golden lotus dailies and rarely do the others because I like them less (I am exalted with everything). My only issue with them is that they can't be done in a raid group as that can be a perfect time to knock some out. (While you wait for people to show up, or if you are stand by and what not). Why not dailies, what else would you be doing? One time quests? Sitting in a city? AoE farming things for rep or gold? You don't even have to do them if you don't want to. Yes even the MoP dailies are optional.

    I really don't see any good reasons why someone would be utterly against an activity that has you playing the game. If you dislike playing the game that much then why even play it in the first place?
    You don't need to enjoy all aspects of a game to still enjoy playing the game...dailies would be much better if they could be done in a raid group, agreed. You can pvp now in a raid grp at least.

    Still think it's weird that people "enjoy" something so monotonous and repetitive, but I agree with the rest of what you said.
  1. therayeffect's Avatar
    Well I hit the number roughly but it was on the low end of my spectrum. A little surprised it was that big of a drop but I guess my anecdotal evidence wasn't wrong. I like how bad news gets barely a mention, nearly buried in all of these same-old, same-old updates. I even like the spin on it too. "People are more apt to leave than they used to" Yes because MoP isn't fun. It's really boring. There was no innovation and instead a massive regression on a lot of fronts. I really like the spin on how a lot of people bought it and quit too. MoP is awful in my opinion and in the opinion of a lot of people's. I think this is the biggest decline in the first period after an expansion ever, even bigger than the casual cryfest that was Cata Launch but don't quote me on that. I find it hilarious that two completely opposite launch's have basically the same result.
  1. Osmeric's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by therayeffect View Post
    . I think this is the biggest decline in the first period after an expansion ever, even bigger than the casual cryfest that was Cata Launch but don't quote me on that.
    Sorry, I had to quote you.

    Cata was worse, if you consider that it rolled out in stages. The west got it in late 2010; China got in July 2011. The total prompt loss from the two releases (looking at Q1 2011 and China in Q3) looks like it was about a million.
  1. rhorle's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Celista View Post
    Still think it's weird that people "enjoy" something so monotonous and repetitive, but I agree with the rest of what you said.
    But what else would you be doing? Farming crafting materials? Chain running dungeons? Grind rep from killing things? Level the Xth alt? The problem here is that "monotonous and repetitive" are only being applied to dailies and not everything else in the game. Dailies are being brought down to a basic level while nothing else is. It isn't a even comparison.

    Which again brings up the point of if you don't like playing the game. Using your abilities, skills, gear, and character to do stuff in the game. Then why are you even playing in the first place?
  1. Celista's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    But what else would you be doing? Farming crafting materials? Chain running dungeons? Grind rep from killing things? Level the Xth alt? The problem here is that "monotonous and repetitive" are only being applied to dailies and not everything else in the game. Dailies are being brought down to a basic level while nothing else is. It isn't a even comparison.

    Which again brings up the point of if you don't like playing the game. Using your abilities, skills, gear, and character to do stuff in the game. Then why are you even playing in the first place?
    Dailies are the worst culprits when it comes to monotony, but yeah, we can cut out more if you like Cut the rep grinds! Cut the valor grinds! I'm down for all of that. More time to down raid bosses and pvp...at this point in the game's lifecycle I *almost* spend more time preparing to raid (farming, dailies, LFR, etc) than actually raiding.

    As for the rest of what you said, I already answered your question. Someone who truly enjoys the game isn't going to stop playing because they don't like one part of the game...one small part of the game does not equal the whole game. For me, I keep playing as long as I'm enjoying the pvp and the raiding, and that IS using my abilities, skills and character to do stuff in the game, arguably with more preparation and thought than is required to mindlessly slog through another set of dailies.
  1. rhorle's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Celista View Post
    Dailies are the worst culprits when it comes to monotony, but yeah, we can cut out more if you like Cut the rep grinds! Cut the valor grinds! I'm down for all of that. More time to down raid bosses and pvp...at this point in the game's lifecycle I *almost* spend more time preparing to raid (farming, dailies, LFR, etc) than actually raiding.
    So dailies are repetitive and monotonous but doing the same bosses in a raid week after week with the same tactics and the same skills is not? That is a double standard. Doing dailies and raiding both involve the same amount of repetitiveness and monotony. When you get tired of doing it you take a break from doing it or you lower the amount you do the action in a given period of time.
  1. Celista's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    So dailies are repetitive and monotonous but doing the same bosses in a raid week after week with the same tactics and the same skills is not? That is a double standard. Doing dailies and raiding both involve the same amount of repetitiveness and monotony. When you get tired of doing it you take a break from doing it or you lower the amount you do the action in a given period of time.
    I guess. I don't find raiding to be as monotonous and repetitive because you are pushing through to the next heroic boss, or your raid group has it on farm and you're essentially done after everyone has their bis a couple of months in. Dailies imo need more variety or more storyline progression or more challenge, 5.1 dailies are a step in the right direction but doesn't really go far enough.

    Blizz only really messed up by making dailies required for rep this expansion, since it decidedly took away from the "freedom of choice" MoP was supposed to offer. Otherwise they would have been fine as is, a feature in game targeted towards players who enjoy that type of content.
  1. rhorle's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Celista View Post
    Blizz only really messed up by making dailies required for rep this expansion, since it decidedly took away from the "freedom of choice" MoP was supposed to offer. Otherwise they would have been fine as is, a feature in game targeted towards players who enjoy that type of content.
    You don't need anything from reputation though. Nothing that requires rep is critical to advancing in the game. You can gear up for raiding with zero rep Items. You don't need to use quotes there is real freedom of choice in MoP. Want to run dungeons? Run them and get into raiding. Want to do dailies to unlock rewards? Do them. It is a feature in game targeted towards players who enjoy that type of content.

    Also you can be done with dailies after a couple of months in, just like with farm bosses. Dailies just get treated different for no reason other then they are dailies.
  1. Celista's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    You don't need anything from reputation though. Nothing that requires rep is critical to advancing in the game. You can gear up for raiding with zero rep Items. You don't need to use quotes there is real freedom of choice in MoP. Want to run dungeons? Run them and get into raiding. Want to do dailies to unlock rewards? Do them. It is a feature in game targeted towards players who enjoy that type of content.

    Also you can be done with dailies after a couple of months in, just like with farm bosses. Dailies just get treated different for no reason other then they are dailies.
    No no no stop. I'm tired of this argument, yes you can clear content in blues (which I personally have done, multiple raid tiers), but you need rep to spend your valor, there's no getting around it. There should have been no rep requirement at all.

    The average raider uses their valor at some point during the tier, particularly now that valor items are upgradeable.

    And yes, you can stop doing them after a couple of months, if you do your dailies diligently. Honestly there is no legitimate reason why Blizzard had to tie valor to rep or rep after a certain level to dailies exclusively. It was bad design, and there is no getting around that fact for me. There should have been at least one other means of obtaining rep available, and preferably in a way that encouraged group play, as dailies can be completed almost entirely solo (although it can be moderately more efficient to complete dailies while in a group).

    Thankfully my rep grinds are long over, but I certainly won't be using valor upgrades for my druid or my other alts.
  1. rhorle's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Celista View Post
    No no no stop. I'm tired of this argument, yes you can clear content in blues (which I personally have done, multiple raid tiers), but you need rep to spend your valor, there's no getting around it. There should have been no rep requirement at all.
    You aren't required to spend valor on anything though. Just because you've earned it doesn't mean you have to be allowed to spend it on everything without doing anything. It only takes a week or two of dailies to get honored to buy Valor gear, why aren't you willing to do any work? By the time you can afford to buy those pieces you could have unlocked those pieces. (You can only earn 1000 valor a week

    You also can get epics from other sources then Valor to gear up for raiding and fill out slots. No matter how much you want to deny it or say how tired you are of an argument it doesn't change the fact that dailies have never been required in MoP. And there is more choice now then in past expansions. (How you didn't find chain running heroics for rep as repetitive and monotonous is a separate issue entirely).

    With the changes in 5.1 you can get unlock Valor upgrades in a week of dailies, even less in 5.2 with the different ways to gain rep. MoP is all about having to work to get things instead of being handed them. For having to play the game in order to get things out of the game.
  1. Celista's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    You aren't required to spend valor on anything though. Just because you've earned it doesn't mean you have to be allowed to spend it on everything without doing anything. It only takes a week or two of dailies to get honored to buy Valor gear, why aren't you willing to do any work? By the time you can afford to buy those pieces you could have unlocked those pieces. (You can only earn 1000 valor a week

    You also can get epics from other sources then Valor to gear up for raiding and fill out slots. No matter how much you want to deny it or say how tired you are of an argument it doesn't change the fact that dailies have never been required in MoP. And there is more choice now then in past expansions. (How you didn't find chain running heroics for rep as repetitive and monotonous is a separate issue entirely).

    With the changes in 5.1 you can get unlock Valor upgrades in a week of dailies, even less in 5.2 with the different ways to gain rep. MoP is all about having to work to get things instead of being handed them. For having to play the game in order to get things out of the game.
    You should be able to spend it due to the fact that you earned the currency. Saying valor is not required is pointless, because nothing in this game is actually required in order to play, save a computer, internet access and game time.

    The rest of your argument has been addressed already and we are talking in circles at this point, so I'm ending the conversation here.
  1. Aquamonkey's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Celista View Post
    You should be able to spend it due to the fact that you earned the currency. Saying valor is not required is pointless, because nothing in this game is actually required in order to play, save a computer, internet access and game time.

    The rest of your argument has been addressed already and we are talking in circles at this point, so I'm ending the conversation here.
    High level gear and crafting patterns were locked behind rep back in Vanilla and it was bought with currency that people earned (gold).
  1. manniefaces's Avatar
    Only 9.6 million, obviously WoW is dead. (HEAVY SARCASM)

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