MMO-Champion - Patch 5.4 PTR - Build 17325, Shaman and Windwalker Concerns, Blue Tweets
Patch 5.4 PTR - Build 17325
Build 17325 will be deployed to the PTR realms soon.

Spell Changes
Originally Posted by MMO-Champion
Death Knight (Forums, Talent Calculator)
Blood
  • Soul Reaper now does 130% weapon damage, up from 100%. Damage and AP scaling increased by 20%.

Frost
  • Soul Reaper now does 130% weapon damage, up from 100%. Damage and AP scaling increased by 20%.

Unholy
  • Soul Reaper now does 130% weapon damage, up from 100%. Damage and AP scaling increased by 20%.

Paladin (Forums, Talent Calculator)
  • Light of the Ancient Kings now heals the target of your heals for 30% of the amount healed, rather than the target of your heals and allies within 10 yards of the target.

Holy
  • Guardian of Ancient Kings no longer heals nearby friendly targets. Now heals for an additional 30% of the amount healed, up from 10%.

Shaman (Forums, Talent Calculator)

Elemental & Restoration
  • Lava Burst base damage increased by 11%. SP scaling no longer listed.

Enhancement
  • Fire Nova damage and SP scaling increased by 82%.
  • Lava Lash now does 300% weapon damage, up from 260%.

Raid & Dungeon Abilities
  • Blade of the Hundred Steps Imbues all players of the tank role in the current quadrant of this warehouse with a boon. Attacks have a chance to call down a bolt of lightning, inflicting 354,000 413,000 Nature damage to enemies within 4 yards and stun them for 2 1.5 sec. This effect bypasses a creature's immunity to stuns and has a 15-second cooldown. Unlimited range. Instant.
  • Caustic Blood Injects the victim with poison, inflicting 0 Nature damage every second. This effect stacks up to 10 times. This effect fails to apply to tanks using their Active Mitigation abilities. Unlimited range. 3 sec cast. 10 yd range. 3 sec cast.
  • Corrosive Blood Inflicts 0 Nature damage initially, and then 0 Nature damage every 2 seconds. Limited to 1 target 2 targets. 300 yd range. 3 sec cast.
  • Embodied Doubt Inflicts 150,000 Shadow damage to all enemies within the realm of Y'Shaarj. Increases damage taken by Embodied Doubt by 2% 25%. Stacks. 1,000 yd range. 2 sec cast.
  • Falling Ash Summons a core of smouldering ash that will fall over 30 15 sec. Deals 999,999 Fire damage to enemies within 17 yards and 0 Fire damage to all enemies on impact. 3 sec cast.
  • Foul Stream Deals 200,000 Deals 300,000 Nature damage to all enemies on a line. 50 yd range. 3 sec cast.
  • Poison Bolt Inflicts 100,000 Inflicts 200,000 Nature damage. Limited to 1 target. 40 yd range. 2.5 sec cast.
  • Serrated Slash The sawblade slashes nearby targets, inflicting 50 250,000 Physical damage and knocking them back. Instant.
  • Serrated Slash The sawblade slashes nearby targets, inflicting 50 250,000 Physical damage and knocking them back. 300 yd range. Instant.
  • Shock Pulse A mighty seismic eruption knocks enemies back and inflicts 75,000 Nature damage. 4 sec cast.12 sec cooldown.
  • Sundering Blow Inflicts 0 Physical damage and sunders the target's armor, reducing armor by 10% for 60 30 sec. Generates 5 rage per stack of Sundering Blow on the target. Next melee. Melee range. 3 sec cast.
  • Toxic Storm Summons a powerful toxic storm that deals 200,000 300,000 Nature damage to enemies within 9 yards every 2 sec. and periodically creates Toxic Tornadoes. Instant.
  • Toxic Tornado Toxic winds deal 200,000 300,000 Nature damage to enemies within 5 yards every 1 sec. and knocks them up. Instant.



Blue Posts
Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
Battlefield: Barrens and Path of the Last Emperor
What about the quest leading up to the Battlefield barrens that offer the 502 boots?
Hi there. The quest, 'Path of the Last Emperor' will not be going away when patch 5.4 goes live. (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)

Shaman (Forums / Skills / Talent Calculator)
Patch 5.4 Resto Shaman Concerns
So first off, yes, these changes are indeed being made as measures to help with the input lag problem. We obviously recognize that they're pretty big changes and we're going to have to do some additional tuning as a result (and that goes for everyone effected, not just Shaman).

Looking at some of the Shaman-specific concerns we've seen come up:

Earthliving Weapon: We recognize that the changes mean less opportunity for Earthliving to proc, but we're not sure it's overall a big deal. Given Earthliving's duration and the fact that the new, "smart" Healing Rain will still be hitting several targets (just not all at once), we still expect that most people standing in a Healing Rain will still wind up with Earthliving active. If there is a negative impact, we don't expect it to be a big one. It is something we'll keep an eye on, though.

Ancestral Vigor: This we consider to be a good deal more important, as keeping Vigor active on as many targets as possible is one of Resto's strengths (and feels good as part of their overall kit). Due to the ramp-up time, we feel that having Vigor fall off is a much bigger setback than Earthliving. We haven't made a final call on exactly what we'll do here yet; one idea we've discussed is extending Ancestral Vigor's duration, but that could easily change as we continue tuning.

Ancestral Guidance/Ascendance: We're not sure there's actually a problem here. Currently, past 6 targets, Healing Rain's actual healing output is reduced per player it affects. The end result is that roughly the same amount of raw healing is going out if it only hits 6 players as it would if it were hitting 25. In fact, in many cases, it could actually be more. If even one of those 25 players were already at full (say they've got a bunch of absorbs on them, or used something like Divine Shield or Dark Bargain), that amount that previously would have just been overhealing will instead be allocated to someone else that actually needs it.

Again, we recognize that these changes are going to require some extra tuning, so we'll be keeping a close eye on how things shake out in continued testing. (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)

Monk (Forums / Skills / Talent Calculator)
Patch 5.4 Windwalker Feedback
We’re definitely getting very, very different results from you guys in our own testing. For clarity, I’m not just talking about simulations – we’re getting much higher performance, in tier 16 gear, in actual playtesting on the 5.4 PTR client. We’ve even gone so far as to make duplicates of several of your characters just to be certain we’re testing under the same exact conditions.

This leads us to believe one of two things:

  • There’s some sort of bug we haven’t caught yet that’s causing a massive DPS increase somewhere unexpected (which is possible, and we’re investigating, but haven’t found anything to suggest that’s the case), or
  • We’re doing something that the community isn’t, which could possibly be due to inaccurate simulations (which in turn lead to incomplete testing of alternative builds or rotations)
One trend in particular that we’ve noticed is that PTR Windwalkers are placing far more emphasis on Haste than we are. There’s a few minor rotational and talent differences as well when we compare our parses to yours (most of which come from the lower haste), but the biggest difference by far seems to be in how we’re prioritizing secondary stats.

Again, these are results we’re able to replicate in the same test environment you guys have, using the same gear, with the same buffs/debuffs and so forth.

We're not comparing 5.4 Windwalker to 5.3 Windwalker, we're comparing 5.4 Windwalker to 5.4 everyone else. (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)

Blue Tweets
Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
Misc
The bit about hardcore players not always caring about the long term interests of the game is spot on. (Source)
But it's not the players' job to make a good game. It's the devs' job. So not sure you can blame even HC players. (Source)

The screenshot with four class specs and a tinker class is fake. We can't confirm/deny every rumor but this one is just a clever fake. (Source)
Thanks for clarifying that. Is the Tinker a class that you feel would fit into WoW? I'd love to see it.
Not sure. Might be a little too whimsical for WoW. Would depend on the treatment. (Source)

any comments on the controversy behind alleged trademarking of The Dark Below?
Players seem very confident in their ability to CONFIRMED! these days. (Half Life 3 - CONFIRMED!) (Source)

Please, Greg... tell me we'll get to see the real scope of Azjol-Nerub someday.... soon™?
I am personally a huge Azjol-Nerub nerd, but I can't ram through my pet projects single handedly. Maybe someday. (Source)

Dear WoW community, the pitchfork and torches strategy has never been an effective one for fomenting class change. (Source)
I've been doing this long enough (15 years!) to know that players love the revolution narrative: (Source)
The downtrodden unite into a resistance movement that rises up against The Man and gets much needed change for their neglected characters. (Source)
It's a charming story and probably reassuring when the developers in truth have almost all the decision making power. (Source)
how about unsubbing? Is that effective?
Out of protest? I don't think so. Too hard for that message to get through. (Source)

I know you like good args., but it's hard to know what counts. You do ignore some good args. for reasons you can't say in pub.
Sure. And sometimes we agree with an argument and still won't make a change for other reasons. (Source)
We aren't going to answer "What can I do to make an argument so good that you will 100% make a change?" (Source)
And also part of what you're seeing is just the impossibility for us to publicly address every argument or even every popular one. (Source)

Any chance you'll ever release a copy of your internal sim (if you have it) to give us a tool to bypass those problems?
No. Everyone would invest too much energy trying to prove our tool wrong. It's how these things go. (Source)

Took a look at your twitter for the first time ever. I do not envy you. People are rough. Curious, do you raid on a raid team?
Yes. I'm on a heroic 25 team. I have been raiding just about since I dinged 60. (Source)
Do your guildies know who you are? How do you respond to their criticism?
Many know. I let them bitch away. It's not fair not to be able to just because I joined them. (Source)
I would bet he plays a lock.Fire mages nerfed 60% afflic/destro buffed. #numbersshowlockswerealreadyahead
.Do you guys realize I would actually get fired if I just kept buffing my characters all the time? (Source)
I think creators should not play thier own game , and yes we do believe you favor buffs of the toons you play .I
I think I'd be pretty out of touch if I didn't play my own game. How would I know what to fix? Who yells the loudest? (Source)

I hear you're on a 25H team. Roughly how much of your day/week is WoW related? work wise and personal play time.
I play WoW entirely too much when I'm not working, but I feel like I need to in order to stay in touch. (Source)

Ola, Mr. Street. just a thought; do you JUST work on WoW? if so, anything else at Blizzard you'd like a crack at?
I spend 90% of my time on WoW. I help out on other games, usually feedback or brainstorming, when those teams ask. (Source)
I worked on RTS games for years so I have a soft spot for SC and I have always been a Diablo fan. (Source)
This article was originally published in forum thread: Patch 5.4 PTR - Build 17325, Shaman and Windwalker Concerns, Blue Tweets started by chaud View original post
Comments 52 Comments
  1. vamonos's Avatar
    "One trend in particular that we’ve noticed is that PTR Windwalkers are placing far more emphasis on Haste than we are. There’s a few minor rotational and talent differences as well when we compare our parses to yours (most of which come from the lower haste)". i srsly doubt that a few k haste is a "massive" dps difference
  1. Rocheku's Avatar
    So he did confirm the tinker class to be fake nut he did not flat out state the dark below to be fake
  1. pixor's Avatar
    wtb more prot warrior buffs please!
  1. ItachiZaku's Avatar
    Well, any good WW would stack haste, so just keeping everything the same, just adding the gear should be the first step to testing the gear. What I think they might be doing is the Rune trinket stat strat, that sets haste lower so it's the proc, which might be throwing them off. If you don't have that trinket, you are stacking the fuck out of Haste.
  1. Xekus's Avatar
    Though all these DK buffs are godsent, it is not what i want for my class.
    Oh well, bittersweet victory kinda i guess.
    Buffs are great, but i want utility.

    Crossing fingers for next expansion then.
  1. Kyuuseishu's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by AnTwan View Post
    30% reduction to healing and SP scaling? So much for my resto shaman being buffed in 5.4 That's a pretty drastic pull back. I understand they were having lag issues due to healing but was it really because healing was too efficient? And why just Shaman and pallies? What about Resto Druid or Holy Priest who also have AE healing? I wish I understood more about why the change was needed but right now it feels like cutting these abilities so they don't have to bother fixing the problem.
    Well it is still buffed compared to live HR (40% increase from live even with the nerf, also the healing nerf wasn't anything to do with lag, it was purely based on HR efficiency in general), they are targeting persistent ground heals aswell as CD's which destroy the combat logging, holy priests HW: Sanctuary and a monks SCK have also been affected by this, probably other things to come as they cut down combat log bloat.
  1. Kazlehoff's Avatar
    Took a look at your twitter for the first time ever. I do not envy you. People are rough. Curious, do you raid on a raid team?
    Yes. I'm on a heroic 25 team. I have been raiding just about since I dinged 60. (Source)
    This just in GC favors 25m. no wonder all this BS about "UUHH we have to save 25m UUHHH"

    if 25m was worth saving it would save its self. /topic
  1. Lovecrafts's Avatar
    Pretty sad about the windwalker stuff. Blizzard's code is so bloated that they can't figure out how players are getting so much DPS out of that spec. My hope is that no players come forth with the answer and leave Blizzard's staff looking like continued idiots.
  1. Callypso's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Xekus View Post
    Though all these DK buffs are godsent, it is not what i want for my class.
    Oh well, bittersweet victory kinda i guess.
    Buffs are great, but i want utility.

    Crossing fingers for next expansion then.
    AMZ says hi? You get a pretty sweet raid cd, what more utility do you want?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Lovecrafts View Post
    Pretty sad about the windwalker stuff. Blizzard's code is so bloated that they can't figure out how players are getting so much DPS out of that spec. My hope is that no players come forth with the answer and leave Blizzard's staff looking like continued idiots.
    You are reading that wrong. It is us saying the dps is low and blizzard basically saying that were doing it wrong. Without specifying what " it " is ofc.
  1. Saiyoran's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by AnTwan View Post
    30% reduction to healing and SP scaling? So much for my resto shaman being buffed in 5.4 That's a pretty drastic pull back. I understand they were having lag issues due to healing but was it really because healing was too efficient? And why just Shaman and pallies? What about Resto Druid or Holy Priest who also have AE healing? I wish I understood more about why the change was needed but right now it feels like cutting these abilities so they don't have to bother fixing the problem.
    On Malkorok 25 man testing RShams with Healing rain were bursting to over 1 million HPS during the stacked phase. Obviously this is an extreme example, but they were pretty overpowered in a stacked situation. Then again, they were relatively weak otherwise for a lot of this xpac, but for stacked fights there will be little reason to bring another class before this nerf happened.
  1. Raincrow's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Shudder View Post
    Do you think I care if you think I'm small? Calling someone who lies a liar doesn't make me small. I don't believe him, deal with it. It's PR, if he actually played he would know more about the game and wouldn't make ignorant statements all the time like not knowing what classes have blanket silences. The fact that he said he's in a heroic 25m is a joke. There is no way someone as busy as him has the time to progress heroics. If you want to believe everything that is spoon fed to you then gratz on being "big".

    Now queue the I work 90 hours a week and I'm 13/13 posts.
    I play. I have played for a significant amount of time. I have played every class but priest to high level (85+).

    I still don't know all the classes that have blanket silences. There are classes that I play that I leveled to 85 through questing and 5 mans, and I still don't know the names of half their abilities. There are times I don't even know the names of the abilities I'm ACTIVELY using without a reminder, because I look up my rotations once or twice on Noxxic or Elitist Jerks, and my power names thereafter are irrelevant and slip my mind. A couple weeks after I start playing, my rotation is "1, 2, 3, 2, G, F on cooldown, 1, 3....". Forget knowing anything about abilities I DON'T actively use. Hell, I didn't remember my monk had a stun until the Enlightenment quest person said "Use Paralysis" and I was like "HUH?". And then I never bothered to read the tooltip, so my son had to remind me it could be used at range.

    I've raided heroics, though not in MoP. Not knowing the names assigned to my abilities has never prevented me from doing excellent DPS or being a great healer (though oddly, I tend to have a much easier time remembering healing and tanking ability names. Probably because those roles are significantly less rotational and much more reactionary).
  1. Xekus's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Callypso View Post
    AMZ says hi? You get a pretty sweet raid cd, what more utility do you want?

    - - - Updated - - -



    You are reading that wrong. It is us saying the dps is low and blizzard basically saying that were doing it wrong. Without specifying what " it " is ofc.

    You mean my 3 seconds AMZ says hi, right?
    Yeah nah, still going with purgatory.

    3 seconds is a god damn joke, and utter bullocks compared to what other classes have.
    And that is the general complaint the dk`s have atm, no utility, nor the ability to soak various things like every other class do.
    the buff(i would not even call it a buff) to AMZ is not going to cut it.
    I am not going to focus on timing my AMZ perfectly instead of focusing on my dps.

    5-6 seconds AMZ, and i would be a happy man, but 3 seconds is simply a joke.
    There is other classes who can get have a dk`s buffs(and still have more things to contribute with)
    There is more than enough classes to have CR so in most cases dk`s dont even have to use that.
    What else do dk`s have that is benefitting to a raid group? Nothing, you could argue that grip is somewhat a utility, but you cant even use that on over half of the bosses in ToT.

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