MMO-Champion - Character Leveling Stats, New Video Game and WoW Forums, Blue Tweets, Blizzard Art
Legendary Build Changers, Travis Day on Paragon 2.0, Travis Day on Paragon in Ladder, Lylirra on Datamining

Armory Stats: Characters that reached Level 90 in Mists of Pandaria
It is finally time for Armory Stats to make a return! This week we decided to take a look at the percentage of characters that made it from being level 85 during the end of Cataclysm to level 90 today. These stats compare a sample of 6.7M characters from late 2012 and checks which players reached level 90 as of the first week of September. Keep in mind a few things before interpreting these stats:

  • Some characters that were leveled to 90 and then abandoned, so some of their profiles won't show up on armory. 95% of the profiles that we were able to access were played within the last two months.
  • Some characters are lost to name changes, realm transfers, and faction changes.
  • The absolute percentages here have little meaning because of those issues, so they should only be used for comparing one group to another.
  • The Cataclysm values used here were scaled using the MoP average and Cataclysm average, excluding the Death Knight value from the Cataclysm average calculation. Death Knights are excluded from the Cataclysm average because they are an outlier, as many people leveled them to 80 during WotLK and then abandoned them.
  • Cataclysm population standard deviation (excluding Death Knights) was 2.32%
  • Mists of Pandaria population standard deviation was 1.66%
  • We did the same thing during Cataclysm at a slightly earlier point in the expansion and you can find the results here.

Don't see a chart? Enable javascript!

Don't see a chart? Enable javascript!

Class Leveled to 85 in Cataclysm (Scaled) Leveled to 90 in Mists of Pandaria
Death Knight 18.10% 23.68%
Druid 26.07% 25.56%
Hunter 25.81% 27.44%
Mage 26.76% 23.27%
Paladin 23.67% 24.72%
Priest 25.69% 25.49%
Rogue 20.92% 21.08%
Shaman 24.60% 24.29%
Warlock 24.18% 26.16%
Warrior 25.35% 25.04%


MMO-Champion - New Video Games and WoW Discussion Forums
It's time to expand a little more and add some more forums dedicated to other games, as well as expand the WoW forum section! We are adding (or expanding) these forums today:


These new forums should give a little more freedom to the growing community on the Video Games forums and should make most of you happier. If you're not happy enough, you can probably find an answer to your angry questions below.

Why didn't you open a forum for [insert game here] when you opened one for [insert similar game here]??? [insult here]
We only opened forums for games that already have a lot of activity on the Video Games forum in the first place. If your game isn't here, it just means that we don't have a giant thread about it, because not enough people are interested yet.

I can't filter these new forums out of the Recent Forum Posts box on the front page!
We know about the issue with the forum filters not saving correctly, and it will be fixed this week. The new forums will also be added to the list then, so you can filter them out if you want.


Blue Tweets
Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
PvP
only thing remaining for 2s to be "viable" is healer mana balancing and some class changes (most are coming in 5.4)
In 3s, you can generally assume a healer. Do we balance 2s around a healer or around 2 DPS? Big difference. (Source)

why isn't it possible to check your mmr or others for that matter?
Because it's a matchmaking tool, not a score or achievement players are intended to try and grind upwards. (Source)

how do you feel Pvp went this xpac? Do you have much say into decisions or leave that to holinka n team
Holinka is part of my team, so we make sure we are all on the same page. (Source)
I think the PvP ilevel change proved confusing and perhaps controversial. It was intended to make PvP gearing easier. (Source)
Prior to that, a new character (or alt) had a ton of work to do before they could even survive gearing. (Source)
But there were downsides, such as the optics of PvP ilevel being lower than PvE, and the effect on world PvP. (Source)
That's not the only thing I would mention as a PvP postmortem, but twitter's not the best medium for the discussion. (Source)
Wouldn't it have been easier to simple reduce the cost the honor gear?
The biggest problem was between Honor and Conquest gear. So we would have needed to make the Conquest cheaper. (Source)
But if Conquest is too cheap, then there isn't much of a PvP season because people gear up and call it done. (Source)
Super high-end PvP players will keep playing to determine rank, but a lot of players finish once they're geared. (Source)

i'm not rushing into any conclusions but is it me or do i see the word "easier" over and over again?
It wasn't fun for players starting out PvP to get roflstomped over and over until they finally had decent gear. (Source)
"Easy" in this context meant less of a delta between Honor and Conquest gear. (Source)

Can Hunter's Please have Viper Sting back base mana drain ftw in pvp
Very unlikely. We found mana drain to be really unfun for the victims. (Source)
mana drain is unfun? and what about CC? this is unfun too for the victims..
CC tends to last for short periods unless you're chained. Mana drain can mean a very long time. More CC counters too. (Source)
That's not to say CC design is perfect. However, the risk of less dominant CC is more dominant "blow him up" strategies. (Source)

2/2 2v2 has an audience without them still, but it wouldn't feel to me like you're giving it a real go again.
Yeah, that was our point. For a time we wanted to offer them but not really motivate players to try them. (Source)
But they still remain so popular, maybe we should just embrace 2s as a full feature. (Source)

Future
any chance of new 5 mans in the future? I'm casual and find LFR very tedious and dull. It killed my subscription alas...
We would like to provide more 5-player dungeons than we were able to do for MoP. (Source)

Can we get a audio slider for voices? Annoying wanting to hear dialogue but then being deafened by combat noises and spells :<
Yeah, that's a common request. It's on our list. (Source)

Hi, Greg. (Probably a question more for the animation team, but) will Hunters ever get quivers back as part of their models?
Yes, that is a goal. No ETA. (Source)

ever thought of having rested xp effect rep gains at max level? Avoid tabards and other junk.
Yeah. We investigated that but the design got a little complicated quickly. Does XP alone consume rest or rep too? (Source)
Solvable problems, but not trivially solvable at the time. (Source)

Thoughts of a Tinker class? If not now maybe down the road?
I've said before it depends on the treatment. Too easy for that class to be too wacky or precious. (Source)
A more steampunk vibe sounds cool to me. A dude in a mech having misfires that poop out springs and gears less so. (Source)
I don't know. Lucca from Chrono Trigger could work. A little bit of gnomish (tee hee) world enlarger goes a long way IMO. (Source)
But maybe one of the designers will come up with a pitch perfect design that blows us away someday. Shrug. (Source)

can we expect smaller ilvl increases after squish? from 155-160 etc. And how do you avoid large increase with LFR/Flex/N/H
The power deltas at max level would be preserved. They are important. Less important these days that BWL gear is a big upgrade. (Source)

how do ilvl increases work after squish to avoid peak numbers again?
It's something we might have to do again someday, but this would buy us several expansions. (Source)
Saw bashiok saying he wasnt sure about tech reasons for it. i point to Ra-Den 25 getting bugged after health loop.
The numbers for e.g. boss health were not coded with such large numbers in mind. (Source)
We can change that of course but the point is we have to do something, either squish or suck up that engineering work. (Source)
(The armchair programmers who say our guys can do that trivially or are incompetent are just out of their league. No offense.) (Source)
Re: item squish. Programmers rarely tell you no. They tell you how long something will take and what you have to give up to get it. (Source)
I really do think it would be refreshing to do 300 dps instead of 300,000. Much more grockable.
we are all about the grock. (Source)

are older raids going to be scaled accordingly to allow soloability still?
Yes. It is a requirement of squishing that it does not interfere with overpowering old dungeons or raids. (Source)

will we ever get an option to turn down other players spell effects seperate from ours?
Many spell effects in 5.3 and more in 5.4 look different for you than others. If that's not sufficient, we'll explore more. (Source)

Any update of being able to toggle off enchant graphics like we can with cloaks or helms? Many 'moggers would love this!
It is a goal. Discussing whether the right way is a "hide enchant" option or to let you mog enchants as well (even to none). (Source)

The amount of QQ over "models are ~25% done" is hurting my brain.
Also, shelved does not mean cancelled. (Source)
Dance Studios and Dota style BG and Azshara Crater BG still on the table?
Yes. Things like aerial combat, less so. (Source)

What is the practical difference between "shelved" and "cancelled" if neither is "actively being worked on"?
Players are assuming the work is constant. Consider cars go fast sometimes and slow sometimes. (Source)
Character models require some of our most skilled artists and a lot of review. The first ones will take longer as well. (Source)
We could also generate them faster if we stopped all other art production, but that wouldn't be acceptable either. (Source)
The good news is this is something actively being worked on, not a shelved project like dance studio or abyssal maw. (Source)
Cancelled - unlikely to ever work on it. Shelved - nobody working on it at the moment, but we still like the idea. (Source)
You have to understand, our ambition always exceeds our reach. We have a lot of great ideas that we haven't gotten around to yet. (Source)

Any chance WoW will ever receive audio on all quests in the game? With voices of corresponding races. That would be so epic
It would be cool, but it slows down development a lot and makes it really hard to iterate on quests. (Source)
Personally, as a player I find I can read text much faster than I can listen to VO babble on though. (Source)

Siege Of Orgrimmar Art
Today we have some of the art done for Siege of Orgrimmar by Vergne Fanny, one of Blizzard's 3D Artists. The last one gives you an idea of how much work goes into something as small as a ground texture!

This article was originally published in forum thread: Character Leveling Stats, New Video Game and WoW Forums, Blue Tweets, Blizzard Art started by chaud View original post
Comments 54 Comments
  1. nekobaka's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Somebody View Post
    Okay, but is it trying to insinuate that one class became more fun to play than another class during MoP? These charts are pretty much live bait for whiners complaining about their underrepresented class when it really is just numbers for the sake of numbers.
    Then you have GCs responses towards players asking for class revamps that warlocks got and pointing towards the problem of losing players from these changes with a somewhat negative tone like it was a big enough issue. What we dont see from this data is the accounts and if players jumped from one main to another or just did not level an alt. Personally I think warlocks are far harder to play then they ever have been before along with new mindsets of how to play each spec. I do very well with demo, although I still preferred the Cata version and I hate the MoP Affliction.
  1. chaud's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by nekobaka View Post
    Then you have GCs responses towards players asking for class revamps that warlocks got and pointing towards the problem of losing players from these changes with a somewhat negative tone like it was a big enough issue. What we dont see from this data is the accounts and if players jumped from one main to another or just did not level an alt. Personally I think warlocks are far harder to play then they ever have been before along with new mindsets of how to play each spec. I do very well with demo, although I still preferred the Cata version and I hate the MoP Affliction.
    Moving forward I'm going to try and maintain the DB scanners always instead of taking a break between expansions, which will allow us to have a history of class representation numbers.

    Once I have the DB filled out completely, we can do fun things like looking at what classes people have on their account, along with which are alts (making the assumption that the highest ilvl character is their main).

    Quote Originally Posted by Arbsbear View Post
    Chaud, Do you guys ever consider removing unpopular sub forums ? If they ever get to that point ??
    None are on the chopping block today. We will see how things go in the future.
  1. Madruga's Avatar
    Mages are the second least represented class and the one that took the biggest hit between 85 and 90... With our rollercoaster design, I am not surprised.
  1. ImpTaimer's Avatar
    Chart doesn't have monks.

    That's where all the missing DK and Rogues went.
  1. tgrhwke's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Darkrulerxxx View Post
    where is the monk stats?
    Were there monks in Cataclsym or any other expansion before Mists? That's why there's no monk stats.
  1. Somebody's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by chaud View Post
    Moving forward I'm going to try and maintain the DB scanners always instead of taking a break between expansions, which will allow us to have a history of class representation numbers.

    Once I have the DB filled out completely, we can do fun things like looking at what classes people have on their account, along with which are alts (making the assumption that the highest ilvl character is their main).
    That... that would be amazing. Like Dewote said, if we could get these numbers between patches, we would have a much better representation of what is going on in the class distribution.

    I think people also want to see some kind of graph showing monks. This might give some sort of reasoning as to why rogues and mages are the lowest population. Like if we could have all the monks who leveled to 90 next to the classes who leveled from 85 to 90 (this assumes that the players that didn't level from 85 to 90 started up a new monk) alongside a comparison of players still at 85. Of course you can't get the full scope of this since many people quit sometime during Cataclysm and will not have active armories, but it will account for people who haven't leveled their alts yet. Also having this information now will yield the information we seek come next expansion (or patch, rather).
  1. themightysven's Avatar
    not surprised rogue is lowest here
    some left for monks
    some left because of horrible melee mechanics
    I almost left due to every scripted quest fight ignoring stealth (i.e. the biggest source of damage)
    The big question, are they going to re-do Rogues, or Hunters, these are the two where all specs are the same, but hunters have way more players, and so market draw
  1. Vajarra's Avatar
    Yes looking at my own stable of 85s, 1/4 seems about right. I just don't have the incentive to get them all to cap, I don't know why. The recent XP nerf does help though.
  1. Jerakal's Avatar
    Rogue the lowest? Sounds about right. With some of the more difficult rotations, less pleasing DPS, only pure melee DPS class and better options available in the form of Druid or Monk.
  1. Santoryu's Avatar
    You could also stop embedding your vids with Flash.
  1. nautot's Avatar
    "will we ever get an option to turn down other players spell effects seperate from ours?
    Many spell effects in 5.3 and more in 5.4 look different for you than others. If that's not sufficient, we'll explore more. (Source)"

    Any chance we can choose color of our spells and effects? or is it asking too much?
  1. SodiumChloride's Avatar
    Holy crap, Mages took a nose dive from Cata to MoP.

    2nd lowest just after Rogues at lvl cap.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Also looking at the preview pictures. Ya, retexturing the models is just a 5 hour job ...
  1. ru aware brah's Avatar
    I had all 10 classes to 85 in cataclysm in mop only 5 made it to 90 for the achievement dk priest war pally and shammy...
  1. dhru's Avatar
    The next exp. will be a bigger failure... No new class or race. All expansions had got one of these at least... To get back lost players.
    They have been killing their game since wotlk.
    After 5.1 I just watch wow streamers, and I see everything in that game, and I can spend my money to my PC.
  1. Nerraw's Avatar
    Excellent choice with merging a couple of topics into one forum. It was really needed.

    Quote Originally Posted by dhru View Post
    No new class or race
    Got a definite source for this?
  1. Aretak's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Somebody View Post
    Bookmarked for future reference since this message will likely not get across to the majority.
    I'll believe it when I see it. I simply think that anybody who believes such a major restructure of the game will go off without a hitch and relatively change nothing is incredibly naive. Of course Blizzard are going to say it won't be a problem, because they want the stat squish no matter what, and it'll be pushed through for 'the greater good' even if they break a lot of high level soloing in the process. Then we'll get a lot of apologies and hand-wringing, followed by a couple of years of abilities in old raids being tweaked to try and clean up the mess.
  1. Kourvith's Avatar
    One day ... maybe one day, GC will aknowledge that no, rogues are not "fine".
    Having well working mechanics and balanced skills does not necessarly mean fun to play, and those graphs are a good proof. Rogue has been the least changing class since 2006, it's been said year after year. It's impossible to keep being entertained with the class for longer than a few monthes. Long time vets said it, newcomers (less than 2 xPac) said it. But still, Bli² are still patting themselves on the back.
  1. Violetx's Avatar
    Interesting how hunter class is the highest. I thought it would be mages or warlocks.
  1. Strafer's Avatar
    Finally a Lore forum.

    THANK YOU
  1. enchanted's Avatar
    I think rogues deserve some love and a major class overhaul since they really didn't change much throughout the expansions. Also, Good there are less dks now since hopefully all the bad players from the DK class are gone and only the good ones left. To this day I see frost tanks in lvl 60-65 dungeons... And also thanks for opening the sub forums

Site Navigation