MMO-Champion - Warlords of Draenor - Flying Delayed Until First Major Patch, Hearthstone Beta Keys
Update: Added a new response to some feedback.

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Warlords of Draenor - Flying Delayed Until First Major Patch
Originally Posted by Blizzard (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)
There's a lot of discussion about flying/not-flying and I'd like to try to sum things up and maybe realign the discussion a bit. Some of the other threads are near-cap, some have really gone down tangents, so I'm just picking this one to throw a reply into. Apologies to the other threads.

We intend to disallow flying while leveling from 90 to 100, and have flying become available again in the first major patch for Warlords of Draenor. No flying while leveling has been the case during Burning Crusade, Wrath of the Lich King, and Mists of Pandaria. We allowed flying during Cataclysm because as those zones were mixed-in with the 1-60 world it just would have been really jarring to dismount you as you fly into Hyjal, etc. but we would have disallowed it for Catalcysm zones as well if there was a reasonable solution there.

Flying trivializes combat. A lot of people like to say we're trying to force world PvP, or that we just really want people to look at the pretty trees we made, but those really aren't the reasons that drive this same decision we've made every expansion. Flying allows you to escape or enter combat at-will. There's a reason why flying isn't allowed in dungeons and raids, or battlegrounds and arenas, and that's because it would trivialize the core mechanic of the game in those areas - combat. For much the same reason it trivializes how content is approached in the outdoor world based on the simple fact that you can lift off and set down wherever you like.

So that's the main reason. But sure there are a lot of other problems it can cause for content design such as zones having to get a lot bigger because flying mounts can travel so quickly (and thus making ground travel in them take much longer), it reduces the impact of elevation within zones, it completely removes the ability for us to pace or present content in any structured way, and in general removes our ability to determine how and when players approach a situation, see a vista or location, or charge into/out-of a combat situation. It just greatly reduces any gameplay we want to create by allowing infinite choice in how content is approached to best suit a player's intention to (usually) avoid that content.

I totally sympathize with people's desire to do that, they want to be efficient and have it be their choice, but we have to balance our intent to create a game against creating a sandbox where anything goes. There's a happy medium there somewhere, but flying mounts in most cases just do too much to undermine too many of our core intentions with the game world, the basis of the game: combat, or guiding players through a game experience, and for those reasons we have continually chosen (when we could) to disallow flying mounts in the 'current' outdoor content. In the past that's meant only while leveling, but in our experiences with the Isle of Thunder and Timeless Isle we feel like we can extend that for a bit longer in the new content, and have it be kind of a big deal again once you're able to earn flying in the first big content patch, and in the meantime putting focus on flight paths as well as having some more interesting travel options for players to use.

Update: So a couple things I wanted to bring up in addition to what I posted earlier. The first was that we're of course refining our questing experience, you may have heard a bit about it from BlizzCon, and that expands to max level content as well. In Mists of Pandaria there was quite a bit of outdoor content at max level, but it was almost entirely in the form of dailies. From BlizzCon we shared we're looking to provide something quite a bit more story driven like the 5.1 Operation Shieldwall/Dominance Offensive with some of the exploration lessons we learned from the Timeless Isle, and that extends to the max level experience as well. We want the transition at max level not to be questing and story to a harsh "now you do dailies", but something that's more natural and feels a lot like the leveling experience just at max level for better reward. And so that goes back to all of the reasons I gave before about how flight interrupts some of the core mechanics we think present the best leveling and questing experience, and I thought it'd be good to point out that it'll also play a big role at max level due to our questing refinements.

The second thing is we really like when flying feels like a reward and something you've earned for each new expansion or area. It's such a powerful ability and we look back at BC (at least for epic riding) or Wrath and those were really big keystone achievements for us as players (mainly because they had some pretty huge gold costs on them...). Regardless of the unlock method though it was one of the bigger moments when you unlocked flying, took to the skies, and were able to see the world from an entirely different vantage because for most of us it wasn't easily attainable. Our plan has been to recapture some of that but make it a bit cooler, and while we don't have specifics just yet, it'll be something more involved than just paying gold; something that further emphasizes how powerful flight is. Unlocking it won't just be level 100 on the day 6.1 comes out with some gold, but something you'll be working toward over the course of the initial expansion release, and 6.1 will introduce the final steps to complete it. Think of something like a mini Legendary cloak quest. It's such a enormous power to be able to fly we really want it to be more of a key moment when you unlock it, and something that feels like an accomplishment more than just shelling out some gold like we've had in the past.

Anyway, I felt like those two things were worth spelling out.

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This article was originally published in forum thread: Warlords of Draenor - Flying Delayed Until First Major Patch, Hearthstone Beta Keys started by chaud View original post
Comments 1064 Comments
  1. Raysz's Avatar
    Hasn't this been the case with every expansion so far, or is the difference that we'll have to wait till the first patch to fly?

    As long as in fly everywhere else, I don't care. It's nice to explore.
  1. Ineluki's Avatar
    Way to over react people, its not like they are not allowing flying at all in WoD. Its just for the first few months, if thats a big deal wait until 6.1 to buy the game. We didnt have flying while leveling in any expansion except Cata so I dont know why anyone is surprised about that.
  1. Karragon's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Ineluki View Post
    Way to over react people, its not like they are not allowing flying at all in WoD. Its just for the first few months, if thats a big deal wait until 6.1 to buy the game. We didnt have flying while leveling in any expansion except Cata so I dont know why anyone is surprised about that.
    We aren't surprised about that, or even particularly bothered about it. We are bothered by the fact we can't fly at max level till some arbitrary date and that we have to do some stupid quest line to be able to fly. It's an unnecessary, artificial time sink
  1. Mordrador's Avatar
    Time for emo drama kids that never played vanila the most non commercial game ever that happened to leave us enjoy the best move ever bliz did after removing most non commercial things from the game. GJ blizzard and pls...emo kids like karragon rest in peace
  1. Anarky's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Karragon View Post
    We aren't surprised about that, or even particularly bothered about it. We are bothered by the fact we can't fly at max level till some arbitrary date and that we have to do some stupid quest line to be able to fly. It's an unnecessary, artificial time sink
    Hello? you're playing an MMO, the whole game is an unnecessary artificial time sink.
  1. jrr's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Mordrador View Post
    That doesnt mean its not good to have back some things from the old game. Blizzard changed most of them to become a more commercial game for more profit. I agree with him and i think the game has to do that. Plus it will happen for only one patch not permanent sadly. Relax and enjoy the envolved game graphics and the world blizzard is making from scratch. Imo its not a patch of waiting but a half patch waiting based on time requirement to lvl etc
    If flying was such a big mistake, as blizz and som more say, why diddent they remove it inteirely, that is easy, to many whould quit.

    As i said in another post i dont mind none flight while lvling, but after that i want flying, and i REALY dont want to have flying hidden behind long quest (unnless it is account wide), because i dont want to do that same questline/rep grinding on all my 12 chars.

    I PAY every month for this game (yes you also play), and yes i want to save time, so i can do the things that i like to do in wow, not use all my time zig zaging thrue the world, to some silly quest.
  1. Nixius's Avatar
    I feel like a junkie and the dealer is wanting more and more for the next fix until walking the streets when told like a hooker.

    Maybe it's time to go cold turkey soon.
  1. Karragon's Avatar
    So I'm an emo kid because I don't want to waste my time?

    Also I did play in vanilla thank you very much and the addition of flying mounts in TBC was probably, for me, the best thing they ever did with the game.

    I have no idea what your comments about "non-commercial" have got to do with anything at all
  1. Umbrokill's Avatar
    Good going Blizzard! I really hope they don't change it back. I like flying and all, but it really takes a lot away from the game and how its designed to be played. I hope they keep most of Draenor non flying and instead add some zones where you can fly. Flying and especially 310%speed flying is just too fast. And for the people who are complaining about not being able to use their favorite flying mounts that they have spent time and money on, most of them function as ground mounts also you know. This is a good change and the people who don't recognize it as such are either lazy or spoiled, I hope you quit over something as trivial as this so the rest of us don't have to interact with people like you.
  1. Magemaer's Avatar
    I totally approve this change.
    Good job, Blizzard. Good job indeed.
  1. TeslaHolmes's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Karragon View Post
    Yes, yes I did because that's how stupid I find this restriction on flying
    "I find your well thought and explained arguments wrong, so here is a completely stupid and inefficient comparison that only makes my argument for my opinion even weaker than before.

    That'll show 'em!"
  1. jrr's Avatar
    [QUOTE=TeslaHolmes;23599510]It's not my fault people like you make it so much fun.

    lol you wont get much fun out of ganking me, i just roll over and let you kill me, while i call my friends to come gank you, while i quest on.
    i just get anoyed of the time waisted.

    I help them in other ways...
  1. Asmekiel's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Eggowaffles View Post
    Good. Fuck flying.
    Choice is a bitch. Good we get rid of it.
  1. Sarevokcz's Avatar
    Well, here we go, not reneweing sub for extra couple of months then. Taking out like every single fucking convenient thing out of the game is retarded decision, and they wonder, why subs are dropping... Its shame tho, first exp launch im gonna miss
  1. Mordrador's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Umbrokill View Post
    Good going Blizzard! I really hope they don't change it back. I like flying and all, but it really takes a lot away from the game and how its designed to be played. I hope they keep most of Draenor non flying and instead add some zones where you can fly. Flying and especially 310%speed flying is just too fast. And for the people who are complaining about not being able to use their favorite flying mounts that they have spent time and money on, most of them function as ground mounts also you know. This is a good change and the people who don't recognize it as such are either lazy or spoiled, I hope you quit over something as trivial as this so the rest of us don't have to interact with people like you.
    From the most successfull comments until now. +1
  1. Midoree's Avatar
    Making it epic for one character to unlock is all good an well however if I have to do this for all my alts then I will probably stop playing this expansion pack as quickly as I did MOP.
  1. EuropeanSon's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Karragon View Post
    Yet another person who has missed the point entirely.

    This isn't about "shooting for level cap" this is about not being able to fly at level cap
    Apparently there will be quests at 100 as well, and at least another no-fly zone. Also, we're not allowed to fly in Timeless Isle or Isle of Thunder either, but the fact we're given something to do or an interesting quest line makes up for it, which I think it's the direction the devs are taking.

    I think we shouldn't complain about not being able to fly, but instead we should ask for content worth experiencing on ground mounts only. That's a reasonable request.
  1. Karragon's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by TeslaHolmes View Post
    "I find your well thought and explained arguments wrong, so here is a completely stupid and inefficient comparison that only makes my argument for my opinion even weaker than before.

    That'll show 'em!"
    They are not well thought out and explained, they are shoe-horned onto a decision they have made to panda to a tiny vocal minority of players who wanted flying mount removed because "QQ we can't gank any more"

    It is pointless, arbitrary, unnecessary and above all a total waste of time, time which I could instead spend doing the things in game such as dungeons, or raids.

    My comparison is valid in that regard, Blizzard are arbitrarily preventing us from doing something that we want to do in the game, artificially slowing us down from experiencing the content that we want to experience with no more valid reason than "we feel like it", exactly as in my comparison.
  1. Blupparen's Avatar
    Meh, I already have hearthstone beta. But atleast I made my friend happy.
  1. Tisane's Avatar
    There's nothing wrong with this update in my opinion. In Vanilla the ground-mount travel distance was much and MUCH larger compared to what the travel distance will be on Draenor. You can also still use FP's on Draenor. So in the end you'll only have to travel maybe 3 times longer on your ground mount compared to your flying mount, so instead of a 10 sec flight it's a 30 second run, is that so horrible? It's shocking to me too see that so many people are actually against it. Are we getting this much spoiled? It's not like you'll be the only one traveling on your ground mount, and the rest of the playerbase traveling on their flying mount.

    Anyway, to those who want to unsubscribe now due to a flying mount delay update I've got only 1 thing to say: Yes, please unsubscribe, maybe we'll get a few reasonable players back in return. I'd rather have the game with only 100k ''normal'' players left than playing this game with over 7 million players which of 50% of the players are never satiable.

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