MMO-Champion - Armory Stats - Achievement Points, Blue Tweets, Setup of the Month, Icy Veins Contest
What's New in the Closed Beta

Armory Stats - Player Achievement Points Distribution
Today we are taking a look at the achievement points distribution of Level 90 players. There are 7.6 million characters and 2.9 million accounts that make up this sample. Main character is defined as the character with the most achievement points on an account.

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Blue Tweets
Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
Warlords of Draenor Item Stats
Depends on if you are a class that benefits from all stats, some don't... and wish to reforge the bad stat.
Truly bad stats (and they do exist) are on us to fix. When one stat is 5% better and still considered mandatory = tough to fix. (Source)
Miss a break point by few hundred haste? Stuck with wasted stats until perfectly itemized piece drops. Back to BIS lists.
"Miss a break point by a few hundred haste" and "wasted stats" implies a level of min-maxing not necessary for almost all players. (Source)
Barely missing a break point? That's a rounding error for most of us overcome by better use of abilities and movement in a fight. (Source)
haste breakpoints for DoTs and HoTs are important. missing by 1 point means 1 less tick, and they are noticable.
There won't be break points on hots and dots any longer. (Source)
does this mean haste will increase the duration? instead of reducing time between ticks
Haste will increase the number of ticks, possibly resulting in a final fractional tick. (Source)

Please keep Reforging in. Now that hit and exp are gone, I don't see the reason for it to be removed.
It would mean you still have to reforge everything to your best secondary stat according to someone's website. (Source)
Reforging being gone won't stop min-max-ers to min-max their characters, at all. It will stop players defining their style.
I find that a bit contradictory. Whose style is it to do less damage by reforging into the wrong stat? (Source)
It is probably possible to get secondary stats closer, but not possible to get them all within 1% of each other in all fights (Source)
Maybe they meant: "want secondary stats to affect play style, not dps". Would be cool (hard as hell) to do that
Yeah it's hard because there will always be a mathematically-solvable right answer for DPS. Not so for tanks and healers. (Source)
We try to get around that by varying the situations a lot. Some fights need burst. Others need AE. Others need movement. (Source)
My dream: lots of abilities for dps, you pick and choose what your rotation uses due to what stat you favor. works in theory?
In theory. Might mean balancing a whole lot of different potential rotations. (Source)

It would mean you COULD reforge everything. You're taking AWAY choice. Now, a crappy piece of gear is a dud.
It's not really a "choice" though when the choice is play more effectively (reforge) or less effectively (be lazy). (Source)
a statment like that caterning for the people that dont give a shit about playing the game is a ..
I think you misinterpreted the statement. I was arguing reforging isn't really a choice because most players don't want to be bad. (Source)
(They may be bad anyway, but they likely aren't trying to be bad.) (Source)

Bringing back AP/SP is a bad idea. since stacking Agi/Str/Int we get even more from the 5% buff. Plz, dont hate us.
That is solveable. The idea is to make sure jewelry etc. can be shared more easily, particularly between Str and Agi users. (Source)
Another idea is rings swap Str and Agi (but not Int) the way armor does or something similar. (Source)
if I'm getting this right. There will be no primary stat on non-armor pieces?
Possibly on weapons, just because weapons are fairly iconic and don't have as much class overlaps as say rings can. (Source)
Obviously, this is all stuff that's in flux as "we" work through it all. (Source)

The post doesn't make this clear, but are they getting rid of Tier tokens?
We haven't decided. There is still some benefit in dropping paly-priest-warlock instead of just warlock. (Source)

Tertiary Stats
New loot system will make loot distribution a PITA. I'm not looking forward to dealing with more loot related drama.
Overall we find sharing fewer items to be better for morale even if the pieces that do drop are highly coveted. (Source)
I meant "Overall we find SHARDING fewer...." That changes the whole context. (Source)

Think tertiary stats dramas organized raids? Chest drops, give to tank. +lifesteal chest drops, give to tank again. 1st wasted
That will happen on rare occasions. But what if a chest drops with Lifesteal but a secondary the tank doesn't like, say crit? (Source)
My point is that overall the landscape will have more answers than just "Is it BiS? If not, pass." (Source)

Ridiculously powerful items being very rare and random like D3, w/o the ability to grind for these as much as you want. Why?
We want the long tail to be exciting. Otherwise you earn BiS quickly and shard everything else for weeks. (Source)

Why does WoD loot seem like Diablo loot system with a 1 week lockout and huge party requirement?
It's not nearly as random as Diablo. We just want to keep that 14th Immerseus kill somewhat exciting. (Source)
Lots of people will not see that as something cool or amazing dropping. To them it will feel like the other drops are shit.
Then they're going to go weeks and weeks without a new item if they pass everything that isn't BiS. MC loot style wasn't that bad. (Source)

If Tertiary stats aren't 'common enough to build a set around', then where's the gameplay? Who cares about +0.74% run speed.
Since we don't have to balance around the case of a run speed set, we should be able to make the effects much larger than 0.74%. (Source)
Run speed might be a bit too BiS for casters as a tert. stat dont you think?
Run speed will still be pretty rare and on some fights it's totally useless. Seems like a fine position for it overall. (Source)

Computers - Setup of the Month (by chaud)
Each month or every 2 months, depending on the hardware evolutions, the lovely chaud will work on a couple of hardware setups for those of you who are thinking of upgrading their computer!

This month
New GPUs from AMD are here, at least on paper. Finding any AMD GPUs is hard now, as is finding some of the Nvidia GPUs. Prices for many GPUs went up due to demand and the older GPUs being discontinued.

The current SSD prices are stable, with most SSDs under $1 per gigabyte when on sale.

The Haswell CPUs run a little bit on the warmer side. Depending on how much you want to overclock, you may need to spend a bit more for a better CPU cooler like the NH-D14 or H90.

Unless you are doing a lot of video rendering or something that is similarly multithreaded, you do not need the 4770K and should spend that money elsewhere.

Make sure to keep your AMD and Nvidia drivers up to date.

Don't hesitate to post any feedback in the comments of that news post, and don't forget to visit the Computer Forum for any extra questions! If you are interested in Folding@home, take a look in our team's thread.


Peripherals/Monitors
ComponentPuppy Dolphin
MonitorASUS VS228H-P 22-Inch Monitor - $126ASUS VS248H-P 24-Inch Monitor - $180
KeyboardKensington Pro Fit Media Keyboard - $18Cyborg V.5 - $45
MouseLogitech G400s - $40Razer DeathAdder 2013 - $53
SpeakersCreative A220 2.1 Speaker System - $28Logitech Z313 Speaker System - $35
ComponentNarwhal Unicorn
MonitorAsus VE258Q 25-Inch Monitor - $233HP ZR2440W 24-inch - $356
KeyboardLogitech G510s - $97CM Storm QuickFire XT - $101
MouseLogitech G500 - $76Razer Naga (Buttons on the Side) - $50
SpeakersLogitech Z323 2.1 Speaker System - $52Logitech Speaker System Z523 - $93


Puppy and Dolphin
All of these parts can be mixed and matched to create a build between Puppy and Dolphin.
ComponentPuppy Dolphin
CaseNZXT Source 210 - $35NZXT Source 210 - $35
Power SupplyCorsair CX500 - $50XFX Core Edition PRO 550W - $70
CPUAMD FX-6300 - $110AMD FX-8320 - $140
HeatsinkCooler Master Hyper 212 Plus - $26Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO - $33
MotherboardASUS M5A97 R2.0 - $95ASUS M5A99FX PRO - $115
MemoryKingston HyperX Blu 4GB 1333 - $438GB G.Skill DDR3 1600 - $85
Graphics CardASUS 7770 - $93Sapphire 7870 OC or ASUS GTX 660 - $185 / $170
Hard DriveWestern Digital Caviar Blue 500GB - $57Western Digital Caviar Black 1TB - $89
DVDAsus 24X SATA DVD+/-RW - $22Asus 24X SATA DVD+/-RW - $22
Total$531$759 - $774


Narwhal and Unicorn
All of these parts can be mixed and matched to create a build between Narwhal and Unicorn.
ComponentNarwhal Unicorn
CaseCooler Master HAF 912 - $60Corsair Air 540 (Special Layout) - $150
Power SupplyCorsair 650TX V2 - $105Corsair 750HX - $130
CPUIntel i5-4670K - $222Intel i7-4770K - $320
HeatsinkThermaltake Frio - $62Noctua 6 NH-D14 - $80
MotherboardASUS Z87-A - $140ASUS Z87-PLUS - $163
Memory8GB G.Skill DDR3 1600 - $8516GB G.Skill DDR3 1600 - $166
Graphics CardASUS GTX 760 - $250ASUS R9 280X OR EVGA GTX 770 - $380 / $380
Hard DriveWestern Digital 1TB Caviar Black - $89Western Digital 1TB Caviar Black - $89
SSDSAMSUNG 840 128GB (Review) - $120
OR
Plextor 128 GB M5 Pro (Review) - $119
Corsair Neutron GTX 120GB (Review) - $130
OR
SAMSUNG 840 Pro 128GB (Review) - $130
DVDAsus 24X SATA DVD+/-RW - $22Asus 24X SATA DVD+/-RW - $22
Total$1154 - $1165$1619 - $1630


Icy Veins Christmas Contest
Our friends over at Icy Veins have acquired some very nice prize packages for their contest this year, with Collector's Editions of WoW, J!NX Apparel, AskMrRobot and Curse Premium accounts, mounts, pets, and more. All you have to do to enter is reply to their post with a WoW-themed Christmas Card.

This article was originally published in forum thread: Armory Stats - Achievement Points, Blue Tweets, Setup of the Month, Icy Veins Contest started by chaud View original post
Comments 71 Comments
  1. Lynneiah's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by fleshfurnace View Post
    "Why does WoD loot seem like Diablo loot system with a 1 week lockout and huge party requirement?"
    - It's not nearly as random as Diablo. We just want to keep that 14th Immerseus kill somewhat exciting.

    Alright who in the hell wants to kill the same boss 14 times just to get one piece of loot?
    That's not the point. The point is you have to kill that boss the 14th time anyway if the end boss is still on farm (which after 14 weeks, it might very well be). And when you do, and it drops something that's a (possibly minor) upgrade to someone, it won't be a complete waste of time.
  1. Trasvi's Avatar
    It would be interesting to see what the 'average minimum' number of achievements is, the number you would naturally acquire just by levelling to 90. Various exploration, quest, pets, mounts, world events, dungeons, etc. The graph seems to indicate that could be ~2k.
    Also, a few weeks ago I logged in for the first time since WOTLK and I'm on 9.2k :/ everyone else, are you even trying?



    I think Blizz has realised that the gear enhancement game has gone too far. If a piece of gear drops, you need to upgrade/upgrade/gem/enchant/reforge/transmog before you put it on. They want to cut down on some of those steps. Transmog is well liked and won't go away; enchanting and gemming still need to be around to give those professions a purpose. Upgrading might be on the chopping block but it does help get rid of the problem of high-level raiders having no real use for their currency. Reforging OTOH is thoroughly uninteresting considering that most people will either use a bot, or learn from the internet what their approximate best stats are.


    My dream: lots of abilities for dps, you pick and choose what your rotation uses due to what stat you favor. works in theory?
    This would be kind of cool, but it also would serve to eliminate what few remaining defining elements of each class/spec are left: Fire is the 'crit' mage, for example. They need to keep things a little bit separate other that just the colour of the fireballs you throw.


    With the tertiary stats, I think a lot of the time people aren't going to care that much. Encounters will most likely still be balanced for 0 +speed. How often will you really need +lifesteal as a mage when you have a perfectly capable healer waiting on you? Tanks will love it, but I can't imagine anyone else 'needing' it.


    [quote]Miss a break point by few hundred haste? Stuck with wasted stats until perfectly itemized piece drops. Back to BIS lists.
    "Miss a break point by a few hundred haste" and "wasted stats" implies a level of min-maxing not necessary for almost all players. (Source)
    Barely missing a break point? That's a rounding error for most of us overcome by better use of abilities and movement in a fight/quote]

    I think some people are taking this a bit out of context. For the majority of players, the ones doing normal modes, you're going to get a much bigger difference just based on your latency or movement than you will getting up to the next haste point. I mean, look at your 'theoretical maximum' dps on whatever sim tool you use and see how well you actually compare. Only a handful of players will be within small enough margins of that number for their haste caps to make a real difference to them anyway. And, blizz is just going to remove that problem by giving an extra 95% tic if you're 5% away from the next cap. Great!
  1. Moradim's Avatar
    see heres the thing. you dont need to be in a world first guild to care about min/maxing, or gearing in general.

    if a knowledgeable player can get a little more out of their gear by actually paying attention to stat weights or WHY they reforge out of a certain stat, why is that a bad thing? "cause people look at spreadsheets"?

    people who dont reforge or care about hit/expertise caps will be able to play just fine. why punish players that actually put some thought into their gearing, by removing reforging period? I just dont see the logic behind the change.
  1. ihyln's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by ProfessorTjc View Post
    Why are you recommending air coolers for the Narwhal/Unicorn computer setups? I would honestly think closed loop watercooling would be much better than any of those. Closed also takes up less space in your system and doesn't cover your ram slots.
    his recommendations have been a joke for a long time. Who picks a 280x or 770 for unicorn? If you are already spending that much get a 290x or 780 TI. And the SSDs, my god has he never heard of the Samsung Evo? There is zero point in recommending 128GB SSDs for unicorn. He should really stop recommending parts as they are awful.
  1. melak's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by kittycovox View Post
    19410 here.. planning 20k before MoP. thought 19k was kinda normal these days. guess not. NOW I CAN CALL MOM AND TELL HER IM GOOD
    normal... i guess this proves that most people really don't care about points that give you nothing but a teenage e-peen ?
  1. Trasvi's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Moradim View Post
    see heres the thing. you dont need to be in a world first guild to care about min/maxing, or gearing in general.

    if a knowledgeable player can get a little more out of their gear by actually paying attention to stat weights or WHY they reforge out of a certain stat, why is that a bad thing? "cause people look at spreadsheets"?

    people who dont reforge or care about hit/expertise caps will be able to play just fine. why punish players that actually put some thought into their gearing, by removing reforging period? I just dont see the logic behind the change.
    How is it 'punishing' players? It's removing a lot of the "" hard work "" which required you to meticulously study your class and be intimately familiar with game mechanics ask Mr Robot when you got a new piece of gear. Everyone will be on the new level playing field of no reforging, so it won't be like you're at a disadvantage. It might even mean that you have more access to better gear, as you won't have other players wanting your piece as an 'upgrade' because they can reforge hit to haste.

    Blizzard has made a habit of removing the reliance on 3rd party tools which have become mandatory to support gameplay. Things like the Dungeon Journal, Quest Tracker, recognition of iLevels, weren't supported previously in the game until addons or tabbing out of wow to check wowhead became too common. Reforging is in the area of not really reflecting any 'skill' on the player's part - merely same area. Min-maxers aren't displaying any kind of skill or knowledge of the game by Asking Mr Robot to do their reforging. It just adds another step on to acquisition of gear.
  1. Triklops's Avatar
    Why do you show the achievement points of "main" characters here? The whole point of accountwide achievements was to give the players the opportunity to no5 have a "main" char but play what they like. I spread all my 13k points between at least 4 active characters.
  1. chaud's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Triklops View Post
    Why do you show the achievement points of "main" characters here? The whole point of accountwide achievements was to give the players the opportunity to no5 have a "main" char but play what they like. I spread all my 13k points between at least 4 active characters.
    People with several alts and high achievement point counts skew the curve otherwise. Everyone has almost the same amount of achievement points on all of their level 90 characters, so this way I am just counting one character per account.

    Quote Originally Posted by ProfessorTjc View Post
    Why are you recommending air coolers for the Narwhal/Unicorn computer setups? I would honestly think closed loop watercooling would be much better than any of those. Closed also takes up less space in your system and doesn't cover your ram slots.
    The H100i is $50 more than the NH-D14, runs louder, and runs only a few degrees cooler. Not worth the money or noise if you don't need the different form factor.

    Quote Originally Posted by ihyln View Post
    Who picks a 280x or 770 for unicorn? If you are already spending that much get a 290x or 780 TI.
    Those are the GPUs that fit at that price range. If the price for that system was $200 more, those GPUs would fit. For most of the current games, the 280x is enough to run at max or nearly max settings at 1920x1080.
  1. rickhunterr's Avatar
    Is it just me or is blizzard trying to solve for a problem that players don't care about, and creating a problem that players do care about. The problem being a bland loot system that WILL create loot drama. The loot system they are offering us only caters to disorganized/PUG groups. For guilds that use EPGP or Suicide Kings or even loot council they are screwed because the guild leadership or the players have to decide if they want to spend accumulated points or decide who is more worthy for beneficial tertiary stat. This random good third stat is only even mildly appealing to someone playing a solo game like diablo not a group game like World of Warcraft. I think the no reforge idea is terrible also since it means EVERYONE will play exactly the same, since they have to accumulate the BIS list from some secondary website, instead of reforging the gear from suggestions from a secondary website. Does their argument even make sense on why they are changing it. When they say that people go to Websites and copy the same reforges, that is true to a point, but rarely if ever does someone have ALL the BiS gear for their toon. Players do work their character to the same goal, but they don't use the same reforges. Do you think the Holy Priest from Paragon could have solo healed that fight without reforging? You've taken our characters from cookie cutter builds to literally paper dolls.
  1. Alissana's Avatar
    stop calling it min-max players. Its such a stupid term
  1. mrgummage's Avatar
    Finally something I can say I am above average in. 12600 achievement points!

    Maybe that's not something to brag about...
  1. Darkinfinity's Avatar
    Hmmm 15350 achievement points. Seems weird to be that high above average since there are a few hundred players on my server with more achievement points. Although...I know some ppl who have been playing since tbc and just got "it's over 9000". And some others are only at 7k.

    But now with MoP I always thought that the average would be around 12k...
  1. Rioo's Avatar
    Random stats are so bad for the game. It will only increase the loot drama.
  1. Talyrius's Avatar
    I only have 17k achievement points. I've been slacking quite severely with this expansion. This needs to be rectified!
  1. ProfessorTjc's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by chaud View Post
    The H100i is $50 more than the NH-D14, runs louder, and runs only a few degrees cooler. Not worth the money or noise if you don't need the different form factor.
    Ok but what about the H55? $50 and it's a closed loop watercooling that works amazingly well. IMO The H55 is way better than the Thermaltake Frio and $12 less.

    H55: http://www.amazon.com/Corsair-Series...3&keywords=h60

    I would like to also note that the H100i is $111 which is $31 more.

    H100i: http://www.amazon.com/Corsair-Series...keywords=H100i
  1. chaud's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by ProfessorTjc View Post
    Ok but what about the H55? $50 and it's a closed loop watercooling that works amazingly well. IMO The H55 is way better than the Thermaltake Frio and $12 less.
    Runs slightly warmer, has a pump that was noisy in the H50 version (not sure if H55 fixed it), and still has the risk of leaks. Not worth it.
  1. Warlord Booty's Avatar
    My a-iLevel would have been 3 points higher, if I went with the higher ilevel, but terribly itemized pieces that dropped (and for elemental shaman, Ordos is a completely waste of a boss). I was already at 20% hit due to always getting spirit drops, but worse was the spirit/crit drops that are completely pointless. Reforging to haste or mastery was not an upgrade in almost every instance.
  1. Talyrius's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by chaud View Post
    Runs slightly warmer, has a pump that was noisy in the H50 version (not sure if H55 fixed it), and still has the risk of leaks. Not worth it.
    Leaks aren't very likely unless you're physically rough with it. I'd be more worried about the pump dying. However, fans die as well.
  1. Azrile's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Ineluki View Post
    Overall Im looking forward to WoD, but I do feel that removing reforging is a bad idea. With the removal of hit,expertise,parry, and dodge it really makes reforging something that will only be done by min-maxers or peeps playing around with different ideas. If your unlucky with the stats on drops atleast you have a way to try and counter that.
    Agree completely. To me, without exp/hit, reforging is a fun thing where we can cater to our playstyles. I know this isn´t the norm, but on my alts, and even on my off-spec for main, I rarely reforge based on some website... I reforge based on how I want to play that role. Doing LFR as a disc-atone priest is vastly different than doing progression raiding.

    The devs are being blinded by the whole Min-Max argument and failing to realize there is a lot of gameplay to reforging for other types of players.
  1. Antvg's Avatar
    Not to sound bad, but 770 doesn't cut it for some time. It won't support AC4 on max settings. Calls for 780 or better yet 780 Ti.

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