MMO-Champion - New Fiery Mechanical Mount Coming Soon, Flying in Warlords of Draenor
New Fiery Mechanical Mount - Coming Soon
Blizzard posted a preview of an upcoming mount on their social media accounts this afternoon.

"Fiery mechanical steeds are best when they can be used with friends."



Warlords of Draenor Alpha - Build 18179 Sword
There was one weapon model which didn't make it into the notes yesterday. Unlike many of the weapons we have previewed so far, this one is not from quests or crafting!





Flying in Warlords of Draenor
Originally Posted by Blizzard (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)
This probably should have been kept to the original thread, but caution to thee, wind, I say! (I say that.)

So everyone has seen various posts and comments around the World Wide Web about flying not being allowed in Draenor, why, and what that means. It’d probably be helpful to try to sum up some of those things, and potentially help build a foundation for anyone’s discussions on the topic going forward. If everyone has the same info then it just helps conversations glide along, as you can expect everyone else knows what you know! Knowledge Parity! (Knarity?)

Anyway, it’s important to first dissuade concerns that we’re looking to slow down the game (I’ve recently posted about this in another thread, but it bears repeating). We’re going to be making sure flight paths and other forms of travel are quick and efficient, with a goal of getting you to the places you want to go. The flight paths in Draenor are not going to be loop-de-loop sightseeing tours, and we’re going to be looking to our beta testers to let us know if any are less than tip-top.

Our goal is not to make travel time consuming or painful, and with players on ground mounts we know we'll have to do more to try to ensure people can get to where they want to go quickly… BUT being able to lift off and fly over content compromises many of our goals in how the game world is approached, how it's played, how it's consumed, and how the content is designed to account for those factors.

As an example, let us consider a quest to assassinate an enemy leader. From the ground you approach a fort with guards at the gate. You charge and are able to dispatch them and sneak in a side hallway. You methodically take out packs of roaming sentries, and some of them shout at you as they run toward you. You notice they’re in the middle of practicing dark and forbidden magics, and you take a moment to disrupt their ritual. Dashing into the main courtyard you spot your target, sneaking and fighting your way to him--and with a forceful slash--the fort’s captain is vanquished, and as guards are alerted you fight your way out, glorious and triumphant in your success.

Alternatively, from a flying mount, you fly over the gate, see some guy whose name is highlighted, land on top of him, kill him, and then fly away.

Being efficient is great, being clever is great, and using your cleverness to be efficient is great, but how many of us have done the Tillers dailies up on the cliffside where the Hozen are, and waited for packs to pass by before setting down right where you’re supposed to, use whatever thingamabob you’re supposed to, and then lift off ASAP hoping-hoping-hoping nothing aggros? How many of us have become furious when we actually have to fight something!? Is that clever gameplay? Is that being good at playing the game, or is it using a mechanic to avoid having to play it? Is that what the game should be, and what our expectations should be as gamers playing it?

I hope everyone can agree, regardless of personal opinion toward flight vs. non-flight, that flying fundamentally alters how content is approached in a world where the gameplay exists wholly on the ground.

In Draenor we’re designing max-level content, portions of zones or zones in their entirety that will be dedicated to max-level gameplay—and not just the top of a cliffside, or some dailies in the Vale. There’s a harsh change in how the game plays between leveling, and when you hit max level. Hitting 100 and instantly switching everything you do to raiding or Arenas is pretty abrupt, and we want to try to keep that questing experience available at max level with something more robust than daily quests. We don’t think having all of that content inside buildings, or constantly challenged by sky cannons, or with magical no-flying smoke, or within some kind of dismount bubble is the most straightforward or best solution to the ultimate issue in that World of Warcraft is not a flight sim, and that's just not what the content of the game is about. Even at level 100 there will be no small portions of the game world intended to provide relevant content even to max-level players. These zones may even unlock over the course of the expansion, or the content in them will progress in story and scope throughout content patches. Content has to be designed with the expectation that there either is or is not flight, and approaching ground-level content from the ground offers more compelling gameplay. Raids, dungeons, and PvP continue to disallow flying for this same reason.

It's also important to think about not just what the content is, but how it's experienced. Not everyone that plays the game cares how quests and outdoor content are experienced, of course. Some may find it unnecessary; they don't feel it adds anything to their experience. Others play through it fairly quickly, enjoy it, but don’t particularly want to put much thought into why. Some may begrudgingly trudge through the content just so they can get to the part of the game they do want to play, and any other number of situations and preferences.

I’m sure some of you see the fortress example with the flying mount and see nothing wrong, if that’s how someone wants to play the game they should be allowed to. But a game is largely defined by its limitations, and the rules within which you must find or create a solution. We’re not trying to create a slow and laborious game (hopefully people actually enjoy the content!), or expect people will be yelling “YIIIPPPEEEEE!” while fighting a mob that aggroed when they tried to pick an herb, but there’s a big difference between a slow and laborious game and the expectation of instant gratification—not to mention the somewhat nebulous intention of creating and maintaining an engaging and immersive game world. World of Warcraft is a persistent online roleplaying game, and as much as we let players choose how they improve their characters within the world; leveling through dungeons, or PvP, or questing; choosing to do Arenas, or raids, or both; we’re still always wanting to create a holistic experience that supports all of these things. That doesn’t mean we think it’s a good idea to force people to read all their quest text, or stare at and appreciate the pretty new models, or anything like that, but it’s not unreasonable to see that combat and content exist on the ground, understand that, embrace that, and make decisions to support it.

In summary: It’s important to us that we integrate max-level questing into the expansion more thoroughly than designated daily locations on mountain tops, or only have the option of releasing new max level content in magically appearing islands where flight has different rules because reasons. We also know that being able to approach content that’s on the ground from up in the air compromises much of what creates the game world, how it's played, and how it's consumed. The game experience is fundamentally altered when you can lift off and set down wherever you want. And lastly, that we’re not intending to slow anyone down, and we’re going to make sure that players can get where they want to go efficiently through more direct flight points, and potentially alternate travel methods.

None of this is new philosophy; it's something we've maintained since Burning Crusade when flight was introduced, but it has evolved over the years, and I expect it to continue to be—like everything we do—an iterative process. And hopefully this has been at least marginally informative.

yet, we have yet to receive an answer as to when flying will be implemented, if at all. sounds to me like not at all.
We don't know. We don't purport to have definitive answers for anything, especially before we've even begun external testing.

Everything in this game is about time consumption. Hands down. I see no problem with that because after all the business model dictates it (meaning the goal is to acquire another monthly payment from the customer).

I guess what im saying is that there are adults in the room and we know that no flying at drop of xpacs is purely a business decision (again, one thaty I do not have a problem with).

Try shooting us straight from time to time...were not all kids.

Making a fun game makes people want to play the game, not nickle and diming their time. Was the game an insulting disservice to you as an adult before flying existed?

The dishonest are want to identify dishonesty, even where it doesn't exist.
This article was originally published in forum thread: New Fiery Mechanical Mount Coming Soon, Flying in Warlords of Draenor started by chaud View original post
Comments 436 Comments
  1. Rodeith's Avatar
    Finally! It is done.

    Flying seemed interesting in the start but it really just got more and more stupid.

    Alternatively, from a flying mount, you fly over the gate, see some guy whose name is highlighted, land on top of him, kill him, and then fly away.
    If people think that the game will be more boring with ground mounts only then, deep within, you probably don't like the game to begin with.
    "Fly up, pick up your items, fly down." 5 minutes game play. What will you do the rest of the day?
    No games are design around something like this or you would have to do 100 daily quests to make it worth playing. (Which in fact no one will think it is because... well dailies isn't THAT fun and a 100 of em? No thanks.)

    Interesting game play is designed around what you do and not what you don't.
  1. War30's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Fathr View Post
    Now that is a core feature of those classes, having the ability to choose when to attack and when not to. This is not the same as removing flight, a druid or rogue might still want to attack. Hell playing a rogue and ambushing things is what makes a rogue in essence!
    But its the same hypocritical excuse on the blue post which says,"Alternatively, from a flying mount, you fly over the gate, see some guy whose name is highlighted, land on top of him, kill him, and then fly away". So stealth walk by mobs kill named guy stealth back out. Same crap.
  1. Rorcanna's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Rodeith View Post
    Finally! It is done.

    Flying seemed interesting in the start but it really just got more and more stupid.



    If people think that the game will be more boring with ground mounts only then, deep within, you probably don't like the game to begin with.
    "Fly up, pick up your items, fly down." 5 minutes game play. What will you do the rest of the day?
    No games are design around something like this or you would have to do 100 daily quests to make it worth playing. (Which in fact no one will think it is because... well dailies isn't THAT fun and a 100 of em? No thanks.)

    Interesting game play is designed around what you do and not what you don't.
    Exactly, so thinking that the removal of flight rather than expanding on the idea will bring something that we haven't already had during leveling so many times isn't exactly clever.

    And that old "you probably don't like the game to begin with"-crap is nothing more than that...crap. I have loved this game since I started, and as such I KNOW what I enjoy and don't. I enjoy leveling and have nothing against being grounded at times, but I also love flying and the freedom it brings over taxis.

    Tell me, what will they be doing that they haven't been doing for the past 8 years when it comes to grounded content? 5 minutes of picking up a quest objective? Please, that's overstating it...it took me a whopping 2 minutes to get from questgiver to quest objective and beginning the journey back last night as I was, you guessed it, grounded. What I did the rest of the time I spent? Oh I don't know...I kept questing and doing what I enjoyed? Same as I have been for 6 years with and without flyers?
  1. kaldonir's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by War30 View Post
    But its the same hypocritical excuse on the blue post which says,"Alternatively, from a flying mount, you fly over the gate, see some guy whose name is highlighted, land on top of him, kill him, and then fly away". So stealth walk by mobs kill named guy stealth back out. Same crap.
    There always existed NPCs who can stealth detect stealth.
  1. dejec1989's Avatar
    is it just me or does that more look more "Dark Aminus losing blood as you run" than fiery?
  1. Zebuthecow's Avatar
    I really am behind them on the no flying. The people raising hell are generally younger players. I have family, friends, and a lot of coworkers who play WoW, and every single one of them not only agree with the no flying, but love it.

    I mean, to hear the same posters over the years repeating how great vanilla was and yet, when they implement something like this- no flying- into the game, these same people threaten to quit, pitch hissy fits, and cuss people out- over flying in a game. A game.

    Ever since they announced this, I have been looking for the plethora of reasons why flying should be in the game- I have yet read a single pro other than it makes the game a lot easier. Easier.

    So no sympathies from myself and about 22 others I know who play the game. I am not even touching on how many guildies are behind the idea.

    Sure, we have a few who are having temper tantrums over it, but again- they are either younger players or players who just do not enjoy the game much as it is anyway.

    When I would tend bar, I would come up with ideas to improve a drink's taste that many times would be met with "no. no. no." from my managers and some guests. Some did not like any change whatsoever. What did I do? I changed it anyway, called it something else, and the same people loved the changes I made in the drink. In their minds it was a different drink. In reality it would be the exact same drink on the menu, but with a slightly heavier amaretto and fresh lemon or lime juice as opposed to Rose's.

    Give it a chance. It is going to happen. I see the benefits and the conveniences of flying. There will be times I will miss it. A few people are expressing arguments better than others. But some- Your endless outrage is like being stuck on an 8 hour flight with 10 screaming babies. Maybe that worked for you your whole life- screaming until a parent gave in and gave you a toy.
  1. MasterHamster's Avatar
    If the amount of XP required 90-100 was increased because three quarters of quests were missed due to players leveling too quickly, is that also "artificial prolonging of content" and a "pure business move"?
    If the cost of pre-raid gear (justice, valor, etc) was increased because they let players get pre-raid decked in mere hours, is that also "artificial prolonging of content" and a "pure business move"?
    If the drop chance of gear was decreased because it's now less likely to give you a duplicate, is that also "artificial prolonging of content" and a "pure business move"?
    If professions gets recipes with mats that require a fair amount of farming/effort to gather, is that also "artificial prolonging of content" and a "pure business move"?
    If mobs and bosses in dungeons and raids gets their health increased because they were dying too quickly for the level, is that also "artificial prolonging of content" and a "pure business move"?
    If the world felt scarce and more roaming mobs were added for a sense of danger, is that also "artificial prolonging of content" and a "pure business move"?
    If Garrisons aren't instantly maximized the moment you hit 100, is that also "artificial prolonging of content" and a "pure business move"?
    If the gear requirement for raids were increased slightly because of balancing itemlevels, is that also "artificial prolonging of content" and a "pure business move"?
    If the amount of nodes were decreased because they were flooding the economy, is that also "artificial prolonging of content" and a "pure business move"?
    If there isn't a flight patch every ten yards, is that also "artificial prolonging of content" and a "pure business move"?
    If large quest chains would make you travel across zones, not just locally, is that also "artificial prolonging of content" and a "pure business move"?

    Every-fucking-thing in the game can be accused of being made purely to slow you down.
    Proper design is what it is.
  1. Casomir's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by dejec1989 View Post
    is it just me or does that more look more "Dark Aminus losing blood as you run" than fiery?
    Yeah, mount looks very Dark Animus.
  1. Rorcanna's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Zebuthecow View Post
    I really am behind them on the no flying. The people raising hell are generally younger players. I have family, friends, and a lot of coworkers who play WoW, and every single one of them not only agree with the no flying, but love it.

    I mean, to hear the same posters over the years repeating how great vanilla was and yet, when they implement something like this- no flying- into the game, these same people threaten to quit, pitch hissy fits, and cuss people out- over flying in a game. A game.

    Ever since they announced this, I have been looking for the plethora of reasons why flying should be in the game- I have yet read a single pro other than it makes the game a lot easier. Easier.

    So no sympathies from myself and about 22 others I know who play the game. I am not even touching on how many guildies are behind the idea.

    Sure, we have a few who are having temper tantrums over it, but again- they are either younger players or players who just do not enjoy the game much as it is anyway.

    When I would tend bar, I would come up with ideas to improve a drink's taste that many times would be met with "no. no. no." from my managers and some guests. Some did not like any change whatsoever. What did I do? I changed it anyway, called it something else, and the same people loved the changes I made in the drink. In their minds it was a different drink. In reality it would be the exact same drink on the menu, but with a slightly heavier amaretto and fresh lemon or lime juice as opposed to Rose's.

    Give it a chance. It is going to happen. I see the benefits and the conveniences of flying. There will be times I will miss it. A few people are expressing arguments better than others. But some- Your endless outrage is like being stuck on an 8 hour flight with 10 screaming babies. Maybe that worked for you your whole life- screaming until a parent gave in and gave you a toy.
    As if it brings more weight to your opinions than anyone elses to be old, but...28 years old here, heavily against them backtracking for easy solutions rather than expanding and improving. I have friends that are neutral about it, love the idea, and hate the idea. And no, they're not very young, and they ALL enjoy and love the game as it is and has been for the past 9 years. That includes all those years WITH flying. You use a lot of ad hominem and it's never clever.
  1. War30's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Die Hard View Post
    I am glad Blizzard is sticking to their philosophy for a change with no flying in WoD, instead of pleasing the whiners. Flying should never have been implemented in WoW, like good old vanilla, no one complained back then, the world felt alive and it was fun to level.
    Really? Fun? You sure? Because I remember those long queue times to play. Crappy connection, being booted out to start the same nonsense over. The world was boring. No exploration, no back story, and it took forever to get a mount. So I leveled a character to 60 did all 5 mans canceled and waited until Burning Crusade where they introduced Flying mounts and I never stopped playing since. Well until I see all the details on what is going to happen in the new Expansion.
  1. Kazag's Avatar
    ...and this is what I've been paying 13 euro per month? instead of giving me (us) new content they are developing new mounts... puff
  1. Bender's Avatar
    As an example, let us consider a quest to assassinate an enemy leader. From the ground you approach a fort with guards at the gate. You charge and are able to dispatch them and sneak in a side hallway. You methodically take out packs of roaming sentries, and some of them shout at you as they run toward you. You notice they’re in the middle of practicing dark and forbidden magics, and you take a moment to disrupt their ritual. Dashing into the main courtyard you spot your target, sneaking and fighting your way to him--and with a forceful slash--the fort’s captain is vanquished, and as guards are alerted you fight your way out, glorious and triumphant in your success.

    Alternatively, from a flying mount, you fly over the gate, see some guy whose name is highlighted, land on top of him, kill him, and then fly away.
    Ok, so yet again they operate under the false assumption that being restricted to the ground equals immersion. I guess they are trying to make an example here but seriously, how about comparing two equal situations? Comparing the same situation from two completely different point of views, where the first one is told from the perspective of someone caring about the lore and immersion while the second one doesn't give a shit about it. I could write a one page essay of how much cooler I think it is being able to do option #2 (yes, from a perspective of immersion), yet they choose to assume that the fly-guy doesn't give a crap about it and work from there.

    Being efficient is great, being clever is great, and using your cleverness to be efficient is great, but how many of us have done the Tillers dailies up on the cliffside where the Hozen are, and waited for packs to pass by before setting down right where you’re supposed to, use whatever thingamabob you’re supposed to, and then lift off ASAP hoping-hoping-hoping nothing aggros? How many of us have become furious when we actually have to fight something!? Is that clever gameplay? Is that being good at playing the game, or is it using a mechanic to avoid having to play it? Is that what the game should be, and what our expectations should be as gamers playing it?

    This entire paragraph is completely irrelevant to the debate because this is fucking exactly what people who want to avoid combat does when on their ground mounts.
  1. Bloodgrip's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Kazag View Post
    ...and this is what I've been paying 13 euro per month? instead of giving me (us) new content they are developing new mounts... puff
    Did you miss the many posts over the last few months about Warlords of Draenor?
  1. MasterHamster's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Bender View Post
    I could write a one page essay of how much cooler I think it is being able to do option #2 (yes, from a perspective of immersion), yet they choose to assume that the fly-guy doesn't give a crap about it and work from there.
    Please do, I want to know how giving people the ability to choose exactly when and how they approach all content (or rather, the final quest objective, while avoiding pretty much all danger) is as immersive as experiencing it in the way it's designed to be.

    Timeless Isle would be so much fun if we were all patrolling the skies, swooping down to kill the rare that spawned on our minimaps.
  1. Xistenz's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Ryme View Post
    The scale of those swords is pushing the limits in my opinion...

    That's what she said.
  1. Rorcanna's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Bender View Post
    Ok, so yet again they operate under the false assumption that being restricted to the ground equals immersion. I guess they are trying to make an example here but seriously, how about comparing two equal situations? Comparing the same situation from two completely different point of views, where the first one is told from the perspective of someone caring about the lore and immersion while the second one doesn't give a shit about it. I could write a one page essay of how much cooler I think it is being able to do option #2 (yes, from a perspective of immersion), yet they choose to assume that the fly-guy doesn't give a crap about it and work from there.


    This entire paragraph is completely irrelevant to the debate because this is fucking exactly what people who want to avoid combat does when on their ground mounts.
    Well said. Your entire post was, but that line in particular.
  1. Kazag's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Bloodgrip View Post
    Did you miss the many posts over the last few months about Warlords of Draenor?
    can you play it now? guess not till the second half of 2014...
  1. Nozuka's Avatar
    great another RAF mount... and i'm in a country where RAF is not available..


    but i love the no flying part. totally agree with the blue post.
  1. Rorcanna's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by MasterHamster View Post
    Please do, I want to know how giving people the ability to choose exactly when and how they approach all content (or rather, the final quest objective, while avoiding pretty much all danger) is as immersive as experiencing it in the way it's designed to be.

    Timeless Isle would be so much fun if we were all patrolling the skies, swooping down to kill the rare that spawned on our minimaps.
    Timeless Isle is fun? Running around and mindlessly killing mobs that whilst they can one-shot you aren't very challenging when it comes to mechanics is fun...?

    The way it is designed to be can only include grounded movement...? If they are so dead set on me moving through a door rather than going down onto a rooftop and making my way inside from there then they can leave flying be and mount defenses that make it impossible to just swoop in. THEIR lack of ability to make content challenging and immersive can't be blamed on flying being available. Just look at the Landfall faction hubs, those have aerial defenses and it works pretty well.

    Roof or ground, there could be mobs that stops you from taking the faster way if that's what it all comes down to.
  1. MasterHamster's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Rorcanna View Post
    Well said. Your entire post was, but that line in particular.
    Doesn't really matter whether or not fly or ground-guy cares about immersion.
    If given the choice, both lore-guy and no-fucks-given-guy would still be compelled to fly because it'd make them far more efficient.
    Denying this in an MMO is foolish.

    Makes as much sense as expecting PvPers not to buy equal-to Conquest gear if sold without a rating requirement. "Well, you could have waited until 2k rating before buying it! Choice!"

    THEIR lack of ability to make content challenging and immersive can't be blamed on flying being available.
    And your answer is more anti-air flak cannons?

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