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  1. #681
    The Lightbringer Durzlla's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cairhiin View Post
    With SW:TOR, Diablo III and Guild Wars 2 as competitors, sorry doubt it.
    You do realize diablo 3 and GW2 aren't competitors of wow right? Sure their both online games, but because your not paying for them monthly a lot of people will play wow as we'll as those 2.
    Quote Originally Posted by draykorinee View Post
    Youre in the mmo forums and you find mmos boring, Im heading on over to the twilight forums to add my unecessary and shallow 2 cents.

  2. #682
    My favorite part about this is kids applying 3rd grade math to what they see. ZOMG $15 x 1,700,000 = big numbar! Sky is falling! Blizzard is broke!

    Please, never get a job where you are responsible for any kind of budgeting, finance, investments, etc...

  3. #683
    Quote Originally Posted by Durzlla View Post
    You do realize diablo 3 and GW2 aren't competitors of wow right?
    They compete for playing time. And if someone is not playing WoW much, they tend to decide after a while to save $15/month.
    "There is a pervasive myth that making content hard will induce players to rise to the occasion. We find the opposite. " -- Ghostcrawler
    "The bit about hardcore players not always caring about the long term interests of the game is spot on." -- Ghostcrawler
    "Do you want a game with no casuals so about 500 players?"

  4. #684
    Quote Originally Posted by Durzlla View Post
    You do realize diablo 3 and GW2 aren't competitors of wow right? Sure their both online games, but because your not paying for them monthly a lot of people will play wow as we'll as those 2.
    yes they are, for the people whose most valuable resource is not money, but time
    Change game in brutal ways to get more players
    Lose players because of the changes
    The formula is wrong

  5. #685
    Quote Originally Posted by Muni View Post
    I believe we're all in denial about the people games we love. ie: the game is slowly but surely coming to an end. 1.7 million subscribers in 3/4th of a year. The downslide will only continue...it's already started to snowball.

    Theres no reason to come in and act in such denial though...the games had an amazing run...time to let go.
    Lmfao I love this kind of idiotic reasoning. "Yeah guys, we should all quit too. I mean, the game only has well more than 10 times the subs that EQ and UO had at their respective peaks combined. Obviously it's all over, just let it go and move on! There will definitely not be new content or anything, I know they stopped making expansions for EQ back in like 2004 when that game died. Blizzard is abandoning ship just like SOE did, we should too."

  6. #686
    There is snowball effect in business Drakhar...

  7. #687
    Quote Originally Posted by Drakhar View Post
    My favorite part about this is kids applying 3rd grade math to what they see. ZOMG $15 x 1,700,000 = big numbar! Sky is falling! Blizzard is broke!

    Please, never get a job where you are responsible for any kind of budgeting, finance, investments, etc...
    It's even worse when people pretend that Blizzard doesn't care from a financial point of view. There are different sub models and in Asia it's not the same as in EU/NA sure, but this is money "lost" (lost in the fashion that they will not get them as opposed to if they had kept the subscribers. They haven't actually lost money). And it is a big deal, Blizzard is not just sitting at HQ going "oh well, easy come easy go" they care, and they care a lot. This is big money and not getting it is not something they just casually wave off.

  8. #688
    Quote Originally Posted by Skilz View Post
    It's even worse when people pretend that Blizzard doesn't care from a financial point of view. There are different sub models and in Asia it's not the same as in EU/NA sure, but this is money "lost" (lost in the fashion that they will not get them as opposed to if they had kept the subscribers. They haven't actually lost money). And it is a big deal, Blizzard is not just sitting at HQ going "oh well, easy come easy go" they care, and they care a lot. This is big money and not getting it is not something they just casually wave off.
    Who suggested Blizzard doesn't care? The point is why the fuck do we care so much, I don't hold Blizzard-Activision stocks. That is, people with a functioning brain, not the sheeple like Muni. And before anyone goes off with their doomsaying "zomg less revenue means less contentz for us," I'd like to see a shred of evidence for that which would relate to WoW that isn't misguided conjecture.

  9. #689
    Quote Originally Posted by Jamos77 View Post
    We're all guessing...even Blizzard at this point
    Ehm... hasn't that always been the case?
    When WoW launched (or of course, before pre-sales etc) blizzard employees got riled up when they heard their plan was to get one million subs for WoW!!!!!!
    Exactly, their goal was one million. They've had over 10 million for over 5 years. Blizz didn't even know how popular it would be and they don't know now :P All they can do is try and do what is best in their eyes to keep their players playing or draw even more players into the game.

    Not trying to bash you here (I know things can come over the wrong way through text), but you're not the first one who seems to think blizz is very sure that they'll be able to keep up their position as market leader. In general blizz seems to just do what they think is best, and that hasn't changed much since warcraft 2 (I started following em since then). There are changes on the business level (some of which I don't agree with), but you pretty much have to as a growing company, no matter what section you're in.

  10. #690
    Quote Originally Posted by Drakhar View Post
    My favorite part about this is kids applying 3rd grade math to what they see. ZOMG $15 x 1,700,000 = big numbar! Sky is falling! Blizzard is broke!

    Please, never get a job where you are responsible for any kind of budgeting, finance, investments, etc...
    What's partially to blame for this thinking is that the subscriber counts are not broken down by territory. If we saw "X for North America" then these detractors would at least be armed with correct information.

  11. #691
    Deleted
    The 10 million subs left have some of the old gamers that wow attracted in years past, plus many more that joined wow during wrath (as old gamers were quiting dissapointed), cause it was in fashion.
    Those people got to know the game as an epic grindfest/easymode.
    Also those people joined the success bandwagon. Not a hard choice, wow is cool.

    The fact is though, that the result of 3 consecutive quarters with subs losses can work to them in a strange way.
    Think of it as a 25 people ICC pug back from the old days.

    You join, you do the 4 bosses with no wipe group looks good.
    And as master looter is finishing his job and you re waiting in front of the fat abominations to continue, one moron leaves group.
    Shortly after all the morons have left the group and you re left with 8-9 people and RL to say thanks for the raids guys bb.

    This is the mentality of the new age wow gamer. The "i want to see the content/get the epicz for seeing it". 1 jumps off the boat others are rushing to follow, cause if they don't they re not cool for staying in a failed boat...
    Previous changes (wrath) chaced away great part of the healthy wow population.
    Those changes at start of cata chased away the spoiled wrath generation. The nerfs that followed chased more of the old time gamers ("have fun slaying dragons!" the fairwell mesage of an EU 25 top guild after they finished tier 11 well into top 100 as they diserved to finish the journey).

    The conclusion? Again i will repeat it. Designing your game to make it apealing to as many people as posible rather than to be played is the fatal mistake some devs (under pressure ofc) made. YOU CANT PLEASE ALL and you re watering down your own game as you re trying to do so.
    Last edited by mmoc4cbbce03d2; 2011-11-09 at 02:33 PM.

  12. #692
    How much has Rift, Warhammer online, and other mmos lost? You guys make this sound like the end of the world (like you always do =D) but it isn't. WoW won't end till the Titans blow us up.
    "I just wanted them to hand us our award! But they were just talk!, talk!, talk!......" - Wrathion

  13. #693
    Quote Originally Posted by Hankscorpio View Post
    - WOW is dying. Best make plans for a future mmo in the next year.
    Because I'm sure 10.3 million users means an MMO is dying, I'm sure. Get your head out of your ass.

    ---------- Post added 2011-11-09 at 09:37 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Leonne View Post
    yes they are, for the people whose most valuable resource is not money, but time
    They aren't, actually, unless GW2 makes something with microtransactions. It's basically all about success, money-wise.

  14. #694
    Quote Originally Posted by Malefic View Post
    People saying WoW is dead are extremely naive.

    To put it into perspective MMO's like Rift etc are circa the 1.5mill subscribers mark (I believe), and they're living happily.
    The studios supporting Rift and such are nowhere near as big as Blizzard. Please keep in mind, Blizz is a worldwide organization with an absolutely gigantic headquarters in CA. They employ a great many people -- and they do so because their revenue is very, very high. It's high because WoW brings in millions upon millions of dollars a month. The reason they have such leeway with Starcraft 2 and Diablo 3 is because their bills are getting paid by WoW, and when SC2/D3 launch it is a one-time profit... the only ongoing profit would come from expansions (or in SC2's case, the final game release).

    If the bottom suddenly falls out on WoW, their ongoing revenue stream will begin to dry up. They will start cutting jobs. Support staff will go first, with less players to support. Then infrastructure, with server mergers. Then perhaps actual cuts on the development teams. A drop to even 5mil subscribers will change the landscape at that company, rest assured. At 1.5mil, there will be a great deal of "belt tightening."

    That is, until Titan launches and they see a resurgence (or so they hope) of MMO revenue.

  15. #695
    I was anticipating a steady loss of 100k per month. To learn that this trend has now doubled before Diablo III, SWTOR, GW2 etc. are even out... wow. We can defo say that WoW's glory days are behind it.

  16. #696
    Quote Originally Posted by runeb1980@hotmail.com View Post
    I was anticipating a steady loss of 100k per month. To learn that this trend has now doubled before Diablo III, SWTOR, GW2 etc. are even out... wow. We can defo say that WoW's glory days are behind it.
    They pretty much did see 100K net losses per month -- in NA/EU/KR. The larger number is because China turned its nose up at Cataclysm too, just like the rest of the world did.

    WoW isn't dead, or even dying, but you can bet any amount of money you want that it's going to change radically after the Cataclysm experience. The devs and Morhaime have been telegraphing this almost constantly in recent months. Hardcores who liked a tough end game, you're not going to be happy.
    "There is a pervasive myth that making content hard will induce players to rise to the occasion. We find the opposite. " -- Ghostcrawler
    "The bit about hardcore players not always caring about the long term interests of the game is spot on." -- Ghostcrawler
    "Do you want a game with no casuals so about 500 players?"

  17. #697
    Stood in the Fire
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aberration View Post
    Hey "Dude", I know a lot of people that are re-subin in 4.3 for the new content.
    And because you know people that's gonna make up for the 800k lost?

  18. #698
    Didn't realize they'd gotten Cata already, but that makes sense. Also makes sense that there's a sort of stabilization in the established regions. I think the impact of D3, SWTOR, GW2 and others will be even harder felt now, and I think with MOP & rapidly declining subscriber numbers, people might start to look around for another MMO, which might spur this development even more.

  19. #699
    No worries, I am sure it was mostly Gold Farmers if it was from that neck of the world.

  20. #700
    Quote Originally Posted by DuleRa View Post
    No worries, I am sure it was mostly Gold Farmers if it was from that neck of the world.
    lol, the 800k loss last quarter was probably chinese farmers quitting over the guardian cub

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