Jaina's Newfound Hatred of the Horde

[Verdugo]

.......I cant see how its ascension...they live in sewers and are rotting....[COLOR="red"]

Ascension from primitive needs of the living, with only downside being aesthetic one?

http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Nurgle#.T85vR8Vzh0I

Read about this guy, he is pretty swell in this.

[Dreknar20]

.......I cant see how its ascension...they live in sewers and are rotting....[COLOR="red"]

---------- Post added 2012-06-05 at 04:30 PM ----------
.

Not to mention they are missing limbs and such

Can you imagine the smell when Forsaken come to visist the Horde in Kalimdor?
Their rotting flesh combined with the desert heat??!?!?! Good God

---------- Post added 2012-06-05 at 09:24 PM ----------

In theory nothing, but it would be too risky for Sylvanas to attempt world domination she is already under constant surveillance,so if they leave her alone the logicel step would be to sit still and continue to "live".

theres also the fact that the Forsaken are not powerful enough to take on all of Azeroth all by itself

The Forsaken and the rest of the Horde need each other so they can pool their respetive military power to match the Alliance

---------- Post added 2012-06-05 at 09:28 PM ----------

well thats is my point though, she almost died attacking greymane...if that happens everyone will be a risk, even the horde. is there even a reason to keep them alive? all they do is spread death, no living creature can live were they have been...they are nothing but trouble, even orcs spare inncoents, forsaken do not.[COLOR="red"]

well thats a very touchy topic

It depends on whether you consider Forsaken as "people"
and whether ou should just committ genocide against them

The Alliance dont really consider undead as people, hence why they dont accept the Forsaken saying Lorderon is theirs

The Horde need the Forsaken for political and military reasons

[Evilfish]

theres also the fact that the Forsaken are not powerful enough to take on all of Azeroth all by itself

That's not a fact. I think the Forsaken could probably take over at least the eastern kingdoms if they really wanted. Come to think of it, all things considered they are probably the most powerful army there is in Azeroth, more powerful that that army stormwind hides somewhere only rivaled by the Scourge. Aside the plague which is the most leathal weapon, more lethal than the belf mana bombs, Sylvanas can also raise the dead to join her ranks, so esentially by the time she reaches Storwind and Ironforge her army would be ... well, really numerous. Plus the belfs would back them up, if not out of loialty for their Alliance with Sylvanas then certainly out of fear, and they'd probably be killed anyway, collateral damage and all that.

Short version - Forsaken = Undead army that fights really dirty using biological weapons and use the enemy's dead to bolster their ranks.

[Dreknar20]

Well we dont really know Sylvannas's true intentions
She may be content with just defeating her current enemies

Plus, in my opinion, the Forsaken would be wrecked by the combined might of the Horde and Alliance

[Trassk]

dear lord, can we please not have this turned into another Forsaken thread.

[Kralljin]

dear lord, can we please not have this turned into another Forsaken thread.

New unritten rule, sooner or later any lore discussion ends with a topic that is directly related to Sylvanas


But on the topic Alliance vs Horde.

In my opinion Blizzard tried to show that both sides are "good" but somehow the Horde is more like a pseudo good guy.

Actually i had hoped for the MoP that both sides go into a role as the "bad ones", you know where they start losing any honor or morale just for the sake of killing the enemy.
And at the end some shiny guy (Not Thrall) would show up and actually put some sense back into their heads and that they should look what they have done, what that has to do with honor and anything the cherished before.
Heck, they could still kill Garrosh at the end because he doesn't want to stop.

But as it looks now it is more like the Alliance are the good ones and the Horde are the baddies.
How imaginative, a faction consisting of Humans, elves, dwarves and any other light worshipping race are the good ones while the more savage races are the bad ones.

In the end i can only say that i currently see no real winner, the alliance may look like the winning faction but personally i think that the alliance isn't getting any less boring when they get attention which only serves that they are good guys again, that is not original, if you want to make something interesting, you need a conflict and there is no conflict within the alliance.

The Horde is obviously a loser too, the Horde under Thrall actually worked towards that they are not just the bad ones, when MoP is over the Horde has yet to prove again that they are a New Horde and not some unification of bloodthirsty Tribes / Clans / whatever.


Personally if i had to choose a faction past MoP, from the current viewpoint (which includes the actions of Horde / alliance in MoP Beta) i'd choose no faction, because:
Alliance is boring as ever
The Horde is in a similiar situation as after the 2nd War, only with races like goblins, undead and Blood elves, which simply don't fit to the "core Horde races", but that's another story.

[nachoo]

dear lord, can we please not have this turned into another Forsaken thread.

Are you mad hes not trying to make it about thrall?

[Florena]

New unritten rule, sooner or later any lore discussion ends with a topic that is directly related to Sylvanas


But on the topic Alliance vs Horde.

In my opinion Blizzard tried to show that both sides are "good" but somehow the Horde is more like a pseudo good guy.

Actually i had hoped for the MoP that both sides go into a role as the "bad ones", you know where they start losing any honor or morale just for the sake of killing the enemy.
And at the end some shiny guy (Not Thrall) would show up and actually put some sense back into their heads and that they should look what they have done, what that has to do with honor and anything the cherished before.
Heck, they could still kill Garrosh at the end because he doesn't want to stop.

But as it looks now it is more like the Alliance are the good ones and the Horde are the baddies.
How imaginative, a faction consisting of Humans, elves, dwarves and any other light worshipping race are the good ones while the more savage races are the bad ones.

In the end i can only say that i currently see no real winner, the alliance may look like the winning faction but personally i think that the alliance isn't getting any less boring when they get attention which only serves that they are good guys again, that is not original, if you want to make something interesting, you need a conflict and there is no conflict within the alliance.

The Horde is obviously a loser too, the Horde under Thrall actually worked towards that they are not just the bad ones, when MoP is over the Horde has yet to prove again that they are a New Horde and not some unification of bloodthirsty Tribes / Clans / whatever.


Personally if i had to choose a faction past MoP, from the current viewpoint (which includes the actions of Horde / alliance in MoP Beta) i'd choose no faction, because:
Alliance is boring as ever
The Horde is in a similiar situation as after the 2nd War, only with races like goblins, undead and Blood elves, which simply don't fit to the "core Horde races", but that's another story.

It could go that way, but I'm getting the impression that both sides are really going to get out of control in MoP's future patches. From the sound of things, it's probably not going to be until the Orgrimmar patch that Varian really finally shapes up and pulls himself together. Up until that point I suspect the Alliance will be partaking in some unsavory things as well. Possibly related to Jaina's newfound hostility. That said we don't know for sure yet.

[Dreknar20]

It could go that way, but I'm getting the impression that both sides are really going to get out of control in MoP's future patches. From the sound of things, it's probably not going to be until the Orgrimmar patch that Varian really finally shapes up and pulls himself together. Up until that point I suspect the Alliance will be partaking in some unsavory things as well. Possibly related to Jaina's newfound hostility. That said we don't know for sure yet.

Yeah Blizz did say at the Press Congerance that both sides will be committing atrocities
Both sides

[RyanEX]

Yeah Blizz did say at the Press Congerance that both sides will be committing atrocities
Both sides

I musta missed that part of the press conference.

[Florena]

If it's done well, it'll be both sides escalating the conflict and trading increasingly harsh blows until things get really out of hand.

[Darth-Piekus]

Actually no.Check the Press Conference one thousand times if you want. The only thing Metzen stated is that one side will commit terrible crimes which will lead to the Siege of Orgrimmar by the Alliance and what's left from the sane Horde. Please don't make imaginary assumptions.

[Deleted]

Is it ok to get a boner from this?

[Darth-Piekus]

I don't think the Forsaken are able to take over Eastern Kingdoms. I think the Forsaken currently are stuck in where they are. They stopped at the Thorandil Wall. They tried to go to Hinterlands but were decimated. In the east there is the Argent Crusade. So I think they cannot do anything else at the moment. If they go and try to conquer the Eastern Kingdoms eventually they will turn the Argent Crusade, The Knights of the Ebon Blade and some other neutral factions against them because simply they will have to fight them in order to get the Western and the Eastern Plaguelands.

[Verdugo]

I don't think the Forsaken are able to take over Eastern Kingdoms. I think the Forsaken currently are stuck in where they are. They stopped at the Thorandil Wall. They tried to go to Hinterlands but were decimated. In the east there is the Argent Crusade. So I think they cannot do anything else at the moment. If they go and try to conquer the Eastern Kingdoms eventually they will turn the Argent Crusade, The Knights of the Ebon Blade and some other neutral factions against them because simply they will have to fight them in order to get the Western and the Eastern Plaguelands.

Implying that the Ebon Blade would do anything... Only reason they sought destruction of the scourge was revenge for betrayal. They couldnt care less about well-being of the living.

[Darth-Piekus]

You don't understand. In order to conquer the Eastern Kingdoms they will have eventually need to wage war on the parts conquered by the Argent Crusade and the Knights of the Ebon Blade. Do you think that both those factions will sit idly by and let them take the lands they are trying to heal?

[Verdugo]

You don't understand. In order to conquer the Eastern Kingdoms they will have eventually need to wage war on the parts conquered by the Argent Crusade and the Knights of the Ebon Blade. Do you think that both those factions will sit idly by and let them take the lands they are trying to heal?

Knights of the Ebon Blade are no carebears, they helped in battle against the scourge for their own reasons. Should forsaken attack Argents, they wouldnt care. As for Argent Crusade... without Ebon Blade, the crusade in northrend would fail.

[checking facts]

I don't think the Forsaken are able to take over Eastern Kingdoms. I think the Forsaken currently are stuck in where they are. They stopped at the Thorandil Wall. They tried to go to Hinterlands but were decimated. In the east there is the Argent Crusade. So I think they cannot do anything else at the moment. If they go and try to conquer the Eastern Kingdoms eventually they will turn the Argent Crusade, The Knights of the Ebon Blade and some other neutral factions against them because simply they will have to fight them in order to get the Western and the Eastern Plaguelands.

did you even quest in hinterlands? the forsaken didn't try to invade there. they went there with a small expedition to research about spider poison.

and they were rather succesfull

[Combatbutler]

did you even quest in hinterlands? the forsaken didn't try to invade there. they went there with a small expedition to research about spider poison.

and they were rather succesfull

If you level on the Alliance side, they attack the Quel'Danil lodge and are stoped by the Draenei and High elves there. But yes they get what they came for.

Knights of the Ebon Blade are no carebears, they helped in battle against the scourge for their own reasons. Should forsaken attack Argents, they wouldnt care. As for Argent Crusade... without Ebon Blade, the crusade in northrend would fail.

Yes the Ebon Blade isn't better than the Forsaken, but blizzard stated they are watching Sylvanas and the Forsaken closely now. Which is ironic, since they have no problems killing innocents if they are in their way.

[igame]

I think this has something to do with getting dumped by thrall, for the most annoying broad in the world