GW2 Thief Discussion

[Lurker87]

But extremely random and overpowered.

Which is counter-productive if ArenaNet wants this game to be taken seriously as an eSport and be picked up by actual leagues and sponsors.

It's not extremely random, you'll always lock someone out of an ability and it will always be one of their 2-5 abilities. If you know the class and what weapon they're using, you'll know what abilities you can get.

I mentioned it may be overpowered which can always be tuned. If it's only 5 seconds (which I mentioned) it should be OP, especially since so many people think we're underpowered.

It was just an idea anyway, it's not like it's going to happen.

edit- Just wanted to add, you should never play a mesmer if you think randomness in pvp is terrible.

[Larynx]

It's not extremely random, you'll always lock someone out of an ability and it will always be one of their 2-5 abilities. If you know the class and what weapon they're using, you'll know what abilities you can get.

I mentioned it may be overpowered which can always be tuned. If it's only 5 seconds (which I mentioned) it should be OP, especially since so many people think we're underpowered.

It was just an idea anyway, it's not like it's going to happen.

edit- Just wanted to add, you should never play a mesmer if you think randomness in pvp is terrible.

Yeah, extremely random and having an extreme impact on the fight.

You lock out the Staff Elementalist #5 ability. Okay, not a big deal. You lock out the Warrior shielld #4 (or even #5), suddenly a huge disadvantage and they might lose the fight because of RNG.

This is worse than any other problem I might have with RNG, be it Mesmer, Engineer, the current form of steal, what have you. The impact is huge, and it's all down to luck. A random condition, not really. Swiftness or Protection? Well, that might influence the fight. Locked out of one important ability? You'll probably lose if the other person is good.

This is the equivalent of getting 3 or 4 scorch crits on a non-shattered player as a fire mage. But even more likely. (3 scorch crits in a row is ~3%. Four is less than 1%. This would be 25%)

If you shorten it to any decent amount, it'll become useless because daze is far superior. If you keep it as is, it's incredible overpowered and down to luck. Both of which are bad.

As it is right now, steal's primary function is more or less it's secondary purpose. This is why the spell can't have any large degree of RNG to it.

[Purple]

Stealing is an interesting mechanic.. but part of me wishes they'd stuck with the Assassin and gone with a 4 or 5 charge system that could spend them on mechanics evolved from the GW1 Assassin's Mark, Shadowstep and Shroud mechanics. My two cents. Still I don't feel bad having Steal. It has plenty of potential, though it does, in my mind, require some further tweaking. Which we'll likely see some of come this next BWE.

[Lurker87]

Yeah, extremely random and having an extreme impact on the fight.

You lock out the Staff Elementalist #5 ability. Okay, not a big deal. You lock out the Warrior shielld #4 (or even #5), suddenly a huge disadvantage and they might lose the fight because of RNG.

This is worse than any other problem I might have with RNG, be it Mesmer, Engineer, the current form of steal, what have you. The impact is huge, and it's all down to luck. A random condition, not really. Swiftness or Protection? Well, that might influence the fight. Locked out of one important ability? You'll probably lose if the other person is good.

This is the equivalent of getting 3 or 4 scorch crits on a non-shattered player as a fire mage. But even more likely. (3 scorch crits in a row is ~3%. Four is less than 1%. This would be 25%)

If you shorten it to any decent amount, it'll become useless because daze is far superior. If you keep it as is, it's incredible overpowered and down to luck. Both of which are bad.

As it is right now, steal's primary function is more or less it's secondary purpose. This is why the spell can't have any large degree of RNG to it.

I honestly think you're exaggerating quite a bit here. It would affect one ability from one player for 5 seconds once maybe 30-60 seconds (whatever the CD is). Plus it's just an idea I came up with to add something a little more fun to our class ability.

[Larynx]

I honestly think you're exaggerating quite a bit here. It would affect one ability from one player for 5 seconds once maybe 30-60 seconds (whatever the CD is). Plus it's just an idea I came up with to add something a little more fun to our class ability.

When you only have five abilities, removing one has a much larger impact than you think.

http://gw2.luna-atra.fr/skills_tool/

[Lurker87]

Yes but it will only be for a few seconds. If 5 seconds is too much, they could always lower it you know. It seems like you just want to tear it apart because you don't like the idea of randomness.

[Larynx]

Yes but it will only be for a few seconds. If 5 seconds is too much, they could always lower it you know. It seems like you just want to tear it apart because you don't like the idea of randomness.

I've already explained why lowering it is redundant. I'm fine with the idea of randomness. There's a trade-off that needs to be made, however, and that is with the impact. You can not have high luck, high impact.

[Lurker87]

I've already explained why lowering it is redundant. I'm fine with the idea of randomness. There's a trade-off that needs to be made, however, and that is with the impact. You can not have high luck, high impact.

Thanks for implementing it into the game and testing all the possibilities.

[Larynx]

Thanks for implementing it into the game and testing all the possibilities.

I guess this means I win.

[Lurker87]

Nope, but we both know that without testing there's no way to tell if it would be OP. You just want to think you're right because you believe you are. I think it sounds fun, you don't. That's all there is to it really.

If you feel like you've won, good for you. I hope you're happy.

[Larynx]

Nope, but we both know that without testing there's no way to tell if it would be OP. You just want to think you're right because you believe you are. I think it sounds fun, you don't. That's all there is to it really.

If you feel like you've won, good for you. I hope you're happy.

Do you not possess the capacity to read and comprehend what I've said?

[Lurker87]

Yes actually, I just don't agree with all of your assumptions. There's no need to get nasty now.

[Valek]

lol guys I think we need to chill a bit. OT I think the steal ability needs work. I know when I was playing my Thief I got to the point where the action was so intense that I had little time to look down and see what item I had stolen, let alone have the reaction time to use it when needed. I know some of you say that this will change the more you play the game, but at the same time doesn't that seem like once people learn how to play the class correctly then the ability will be overpowered?

The steal mechanic is tough to balance because, just like any ability, you have to make sure it can be used by noobs, as well as pros. Right now new players are just clicking it right as they steal it, which is not how it is intended. Or they are forgetting the click it at all. They have a lot of work to do with Steal and I honestly think it will be completely different a year from now. Just my 2 cents.

[Glytch]

lol guys I think we need to chill a bit. OT I think the steal ability needs work. I know when I was playing my Thief I got to the point where the action was so intense that I had little time to look down and see what item I had stolen

this is why theres a list of useful stuff. all the non impressive steal just memorize

[Durzlla]

Idk why all you thieves hate steal/think it's underpowered/broken, i personally got a kick out of it and i will stand by my absolute LOVE of relying on randomness, why? Because it's chaotic and makes you unpredictable!! And don't even give me that shit of "Oh well even the thief wont know what they're going to do!" because all that says is that you're god awful at coming up with any strat on the fly and would lose to anyone who swaps strategy halfway through a battle...

PS: Rifle stolen from eng/warrior is like my favorite item to steal in pvp!

[Nelthamus]

Thieves are devilish in pvp with all their leave combat moves

[DrakeWurrum]

Idk why all you thieves hate steal/think it's underpowered/broken, i personally got a kick out of it and i will stand by my absolute LOVE of relying on randomness, why? Because it's chaotic and makes you unpredictable!! And don't even give me that shit of "Oh well even the thief wont know what they're going to do!" because all that says is that you're god awful at coming up with any strat on the fly and would lose to anyone who swaps strategy halfway through a battle...

PS: Rifle stolen from eng/warrior is like my favorite item to steal in pvp!

Not really about the randomness for me, so much as it doesn't really seem to have any strategy to it to begin with, and doesn't really have all that much power to it, in my experience.

I would use Steal just because I had nothing else to do besides auto-attack, and then if the mob wasn't already near-death, I'd instantly blow it, not caring what happens.

I should care what happens, but I don't.

[Glytch]

for those that didnt realize it, the downed 2 skill is now ground targeted

[Osprey39]

Yeah, extremely random and having an extreme impact on the fight.

You lock out the Staff Elementalist #5 ability. Okay, not a big deal. You lock out the Warrior shielld #4 (or even #5), suddenly a huge disadvantage and they might lose the fight because of RNG.

This is worse than any other problem I might have with RNG, be it Mesmer, Engineer, the current form of steal, what have you. The impact is huge, and it's all down to luck. A random condition, not really. Swiftness or Protection? Well, that might influence the fight. Locked out of one important ability? You'll probably lose if the other person is good.

This is the equivalent of getting 3 or 4 scorch crits on a non-shattered player as a fire mage. But even more likely. (3 scorch crits in a row is ~3%. Four is less than 1%. This would be 25%)

If you shorten it to any decent amount, it'll become useless because daze is far superior. If you keep it as is, it's incredible overpowered and down to luck. Both of which are bad.

As it is right now, steal's primary function is more or less it's secondary purpose. This is why the spell can't have any large degree of RNG to it.

You know they had something very similar in GW1 right? It lasted a whole lot longer than 5 seconds too. http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Arcane_Thievery

Want one that's even more powerful because it isn't random? http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Simple_Thievery

I don't see what lurker87 is suggesting as OP. I would also point out that although A-net may be interested in the game being played as an E-sport, most people don't participate in that nor do they care much about it. Designing the game with 'how will this effect us as an e-sport?' as your primary arbiter for making decisions probably isn't a great idea.

[Durzlla]

You know they had something very similar in GW1 right? It lasted a whole lot longer than 5 seconds too. http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Arcane_Thievery

Want one that's even more powerful because it isn't random? http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Simple_Thievery

I don't see what lurker87 is suggesting as OP. I would also point out that although A-net may be interested in the game being played as an E-sport, most people don't participate in that nor do they care much about it. Designing the game with 'how will this effect us as an e-sport?' as your primary arbiter for making decisions probably isn't a great idea.

1) that 20 second one is an interrupt 2) arcane thievery was random, 3) Diversion was SIGNIFICANTLY better then that 4) only works on spells 5) it's the god damn Mesmer 6) different game, different rules.