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  1. #1

    [Frost] 2h Stats prio whats better Haste>mastery>crit or Haste>crit>mastery

    I have question what is better now to 2h death knight Haste>mastery>crit or Haste>crit>mastery

    On elitistjerks.com i read the better is Haste>crit>mastery but i read in another forum crit is not prio stats
    Last edited by Misiek; 2012-10-08 at 03:08 PM.

  2. #2
    It is Haste>Crit>Mastery.

  3. #3
    For 2h crit is more powerful due to OB hitting like a truck, FS is much weaker compared to DWs FS, and km procing slightly less for 2h then it does for DW.

  4. #4
    Mechagnome Mitak's Avatar
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    Actually, haste> all.

    For ease of use, i suggest checking out http://www.askmrrobot.com/wow/gear
    That is a gear optimizer, you upload your character and the system tells you how to reforge and gem to get the best of your gear. It priorities haste for Frost but if you so wish you can change the priorities, which i do not suggest you do though.

    ---------- Post added 2012-10-09 at 09:47 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Kaosbringer View Post
    For 2h crit is more powerful due to OB hitting like a truck, FS is much weaker compared to DWs FS, and km procing slightly less for 2h then it does for DW.
    If you prioritiese crit over haste you will have HUGE gaps in your rotation because of slower rune regen speed and you will sacrifice CRIT, because you will have less killing machine procs. In a way stacking crit works against getting more crit, funny i know but true.

    ---------- Post added 2012-10-09 at 09:50 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by sacredkhaos View Post
    It is Haste>Crit>Mastery.
    Yes, this, or Haste> Matery> Crit for DW Frost
    The truth may be out there, but the lies are inside your head.

  5. #5
    Ehm no-one ever said that crit>haste o.0

    2H, as said above, goes by haste>crit>mastery

    And for Nitak, DW frost uses mastery>haste>crit actually.

  6. #6
    I'm haing a hell of a time finding actual weights so I can figure out what gear is better. Mr. Robot, MaxDPS, ReforgeLite, Icy Veins, ELitist Jerks, Tankspot, MMOChamp, all the info seem to be different when it comes to the specific numbers.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by scorpious1109 View Post
    I'm haing a hell of a time finding actual weights so I can figure out what gear is better. Mr. Robot, MaxDPS, ReforgeLite, Icy Veins, ELitist Jerks, Tankspot, MMOChamp, all the info seem to be different when it comes to the specific numbers.
    Your stat weights depend on your gear, such sites only sim for a specific gearset (usually BiS or so)
    If you want your stat weights, sim yourself, and always keep in mind sims =/= live

  8. #8
    Based on my findings running quite a few sims with various gear levels - Str > haste > crit > mastery. Hybrid haste gems and straight up haste gems only start out performing their strength equivalents when you have at least 4pc T14N. I didn't sim LFR tier so I can't really speak to that.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by hunty View Post
    Ehm no-one ever said that crit>haste o.0

    2H, as said above, goes by haste>crit>mastery

    And for Nitak, DW frost uses mastery>haste>crit actually.
    Thanks Hunty, for make my post more clear (though in a thread about Crit v.s Mastery i dont see how saying crit is better could be confused as crit>haste)

  10. #10
    I haven't looked at it lately, but askmrrobot has never been particularly accurate in the past. I wouldn't rely on it.

  11. #11
    Deleted
    Almost accurate. Still it now insists that I should drop my expertise that is about +10-15 over the cap and go way under the hit cap (aprox. 0.2% under) just to get a few more haste. I am not willing to do that tbh (almost hit capped like 0.01% miss chance).

  12. #12
    AskMrRobot is terrible at the moment. All the stat weights are based on BIS numbers and are no where near accurate for entry level gear.

  13. #13
    AMR always used their own default stat weights, which you should of never used to begin with.

    Open up SimC, do a sim of your own character/gear with the option to evaluate the stats, get the weights and plug them into AMR.

    It's better to use it now than Cata since the way they changed secondary stat gems to be 2x as much as before. Expertise/hit gems actually are very viable if you're short.


    Basically all of these types of programs work the same. If your stats are worth 1.5, 1.7, 2 (arbitrary examples), then it's just a numbers game to get the most total points by adjusting the rest. Of course there's some variance when you raise one stat or another, but there's just some level of inefficiency that you have to except.
    Last edited by fangless; 2012-10-09 at 07:58 PM.

  14. #14
    I am loving these non KM critting obliterates I don't know it just makes me smile when it happens. Haste>crit> Mastery is so stronger than Haste>master>crit to me as I have reforged both ways and like crit better.

  15. #15
    Killing Machine gives 100% crit on next OB/FS, therefore Crit is useless [except for when you don't have KM].

    Since Crit isn't useful all the time, but Haste is AND it lessens empty Globals AND increases your KM procs, Haste > Crit.
    Mastery is the bastard child of 2H Frost. Kind of apt, Mastery Snow (Get it? Increases Frost damage, Jon Snow? xD)

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Seref View Post
    Killing Machine gives 100% crit on next OB/FS, therefore Crit is useless [except for when you don't have KM].
    Because naturally, only OB and FS can crit. It's not like white attacks, HB etc can crit. And your bracketed statement is also very relevant as a claer majority of your OB/FSs are affected by KM.

    Right.

  17. #17
    Herald of the Titans Varyk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seref View Post
    Killing Machine gives 100% crit on next OB/FS, therefore Crit is useless [except for when you don't have KM].

    Since Crit isn't useful all the time, but Haste is AND it lessens empty Globals AND increases your KM procs, Haste > Crit.
    Mastery is the bastard child of 2H Frost. Kind of apt, Mastery Snow (Get it? Increases Frost damage, Jon Snow? xD)
    I don't think anyone is suggesting crit is more valuable than haste (it isn't). Crit IS a dps increase over mastery tho.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Varyk View Post
    I don't think anyone is suggesting crit is more valuable than haste (it isn't). Crit IS a dps increase over mastery tho.
    ^this.

    And like I mention in my first post on this thread, Crit is better because A: our FS is weak compared to our OB, B: 2h procs less KM due to having one slower weapon v.s. two faster weapons (thus giving us less white hits to proc KM off of), C: Because 2h OB hits like a truck and does not benefit from mastery, mastery is not as sought after for 2h as it is for DW.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Wih View Post
    Because naturally, only OB and FS can crit. It's not like white attacks, HB etc can crit. And your bracketed statement is also very relevant as a claer majority of your OB/FSs are affected by KM.

    Right.
    I left that part in brackets to make it a more simpler rule of thumb. And white attacks are just those tiny, near inconsequential amounts of dps that proc Killing Machine. I hate how useless Mastery is for 2h Frost, if only Oblit did Frost damage like Scourge Strike does Shadow...

    But even though Haste>Crit, I still prefer Crit. Haste is such an unnoticeable increase, that even though intellectually you know it's a dps increase, it doesn't feel like it. But then again, I mostly PvP, and the burst from Crit is good for PvP.

  20. #20
    Deleted
    Guys sorry for offtopic but i am newly and want to know: does glyph of icy touch works with howling blast also? Does the howling blast dispels one magic from target?

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