[Megathread] DotA 2

[Hermanni]

I agree with the Silencer changes,they're fine, but the new skill they put in there ... bit OP I think

It might be, but the old Last Word was basically the reason he was ever being picked. The new Last Word, however, adds more to him from gameplay perspective and actually synergizes quite well with both Curse of the Silent and Global Silence. CotS/LW could be a really good build now instead of the old Glaive/stats carry build. Still, losing the old Last Word is a pretty big hit, but since it was changed to not trigger from items Silencer had already lost most of his relevance.

[PizzaSHARK]

It might be, but the old Last Word was basically the reason he was ever being picked. The new Last Word, however, adds more to him from gameplay perspective and actually synergizes quite well with both Curse of the Silent and Global Silence. CotS/LW could be a really good build now instead of the old Glaive/stats carry build. Still, losing the old Last Word is a pretty big hit, but since it was changed to not trigger from items Silencer had already lost most of his relevance.

Yeah. I like the changes overall and I like that new LW will involve some decision-making on the player's part, but I don't like that it's a lose-lose situation for the person it's put on. I'd much rather the penalties be different for casting and for letting it run out. Maybe the damage+silence for casting or no damage and disarm for letting it run out?

[Lysah]

Most changes won't change much. A couple of heroes got unneeded buffs but are never picked anyway. A couple of heroes that were picked all the time got nerfed but will still be picked all the time.

Item changes, however, were nice.

[Hermanni]

The only heroes in the changelog I haven't seen picked in the past few weeks are pretty much just Razor, Silencer and Meepo, so I'm not sure if I agree on the "never picked" part. Unless, of course, those were the ones you meant.

[Lysah]

I just won a game as razor! Though I randomed, he's not a hero I would ever pick myself (because he's so damned boring). Static link is, to be fair, absolutely hilarious against hard carries. BKB/basher/bfury/HoD PA and she has to run from me with nothing but scepter and hood because static link is geegee.

I mean heroes like Weaver, who did not need 5 base damage at all, was probably buffed because he is never seen in the pro circles (was picked like 6 times during TI2? I actually looked at that information a while back). He used to be extremely popular and has not changed since, his early game is absurdly strong and he can either afk farm like antifun and emerge to get the instant rampage or he can roam and be a very powerful ganker. Feels like the buff was aimed to get people to play him more, which makes it more of an attempt by mister Frog to shake up the meta than to balance the game.

I could be wrong, of course, since his balance tweaks tend to be buffs, rather than nerfs. Maybe he decided the changes to heroes like PA made them too good and he needed to make Weaver better as well /shrug




As a side note, the meepo change actually really interests me. I never get scepter on him because he needs to grow real stats to stay alive, I pretty much go straight for skadi after vlads/mek, this definitely makes scepter a much stronger choice for him. I really don't think he's a bad carry at all.

[Hermanni]

Probably had something to do with him being a bit clunky to lasthit with, especially if you have to invest in regen for lane. Also gives him a bit more prevalence in the early-mid game even if he hasn't had time to invest in damage items yet. Black^ just played weaver like twice or thrice in 2 days in Starladder where he was completely 6-slotted in one game without having boots.

[Faldric]

and everyone underestimate her, pick ulti at lvl6 and you can really surprise enemies

You mean suprising them as in: "OMG I cant believe a squishy CM is really walking into my attack range to cast an ultimate with lousy range that sucks up her whole mana pool. I am so lucky."

[PizzaSHARK]

Most changes won't change much. A couple of heroes got unneeded buffs but are never picked anyway. A couple of heroes that were picked all the time got nerfed but will still be picked all the time.

Item changes, however, were nice.

Force Staff change is interesting. Minor nerf for heroes with good auto like WR and SD, but an overall buff for everyone else. Will make going for a fast Force Staff on a hard support less painful since you can get the regen instead of having to deal without it.

Boots change... meh. Why are they reducing move speed by 5 across the board?

[Lysah]

Force Staff change is interesting. Minor nerf for heroes with good auto like WR and SD, but an overall buff for everyone else. Will make going for a fast Force Staff on a hard support less painful since you can get the regen instead of having to deal without it.

Boots change... meh. Why are they reducing move speed by 5 across the board?

Make BoT more powerful, make lower speed heroes less weak. Currently, going tranq/euls/jango is too powerful for supports, and going treads/phase/manta is too powerful for carries. Since stacking movespeed is the common build on almost any hero these days, it makes sense to nerf movespeed so that stacking multiple modifiers together isn't such a huge gain. 5ms might not seem like much, but it's the difference in the base movespeed of a lot of heroes already.


Also, I don't see Weaver having a problem last hitting. He can push almost any hero out of his lane once he gets level 2 and has shukuchi + geminate. The combo of being able to constantly harass your enemy and ignore his retaliation at the same time is great, especially once you can dump the swarm on them. I commonly first blood in the first 3/4 levels in my lanes as Weaver, most people vastly underestimate how much pressure he can build up even at level 2.

[PizzaSHARK]

Also, I don't see Weaver having a problem last hitting. He can push almost any hero out of his lane once he gets level 2 and has shukuchi + geminate. The combo of being able to constantly harass your enemy and ignore his retaliation at the same time is great, especially once you can dump the swarm on them. I commonly first blood in the first 3/4 levels in my lanes as Weaver, most people vastly underestimate how much pressure he can build up even at level 2.

Weaver with a DD rune can get a pretty much guaranteed kill at level 2 on just about anyone. So much burst.

What's with that weird "girls only" crap that was in SL3? Just seemed like this completely random game in between semifinals and finals between two teams composed purely of women who weren't even particularly skilled at the game. Was it just a publicity stunt to draw more viewers in?

[Lysah]

Sounds like something I'd watch.

[Hermanni]

Sounds like something I'd watch.

I'm sure you'd enjoy it enormously.

On the topic of Weaver, I didn't mean to say he was bad at lasthitting, but there are a lot of heroes that can outlasthit him. Sure he is a beast playing 1v1 on either side lane, but as a Weaver you often find yourself soloing and often against more than one enemy. Against bad players that's not a problem, but when your enemy is prepared you can be shut down pretty hard and then your success can be largely up to how well you can snatch lasthits against their pressure.

[Lysah]

Snick-snack!

[Deleted]

Lysah why are you pretending to be Swedish.

[Lysah]

Pretty sure that's what weaver says when he gets a last hit brewski

[PizzaSHARK]

Sounds like something I'd watch.

I... guess? When I watch a game in a professional tournament, I'm looking towards seeing things that the very skilled teams do, not really what I could see for free by watching a game from the first few pages of the live games menu. Hell, even their picks weren't anything unusual compared to what I've seen in a lot of other SL3 games; Navi and GD-B have both been picking unusual heroes (compared to TI2) in the games I watched.

I guess you would enjoy watching it because someone picked Crystal Maiden.

[Deleted]

Pretty sure that's what weaver says when he gets a last hit brewski

Clearly he's more Swedish than Sven.

[Lysah]

SooOOOoooO the hall of fame is just going to be the same exact heroes every week, half of which don't take much skill to play? How does that help anybody? Clearly being good with Chen is easy and not worth mention, and no one needs to see what a good Chen looks like. Same for Weaver, SD, clock, beast, or panda amirite. I'm trying really hard to see the point of this new feature, really I am, but it's just not there.

[Deleted]

SooOOOoooO the hall of fame is just going to be the same exact heroes every week, half of which don't take much skill to play? How does that help anybody? Clearly being good with Chen is easy and not worth mention, and no one needs to see what a good Chen looks like. Same for Weaver, SD, clock, beast, or panda amirite. I'm trying really hard to see the point of this new feature, really I am, but it's just not there.

How could the hall of fame help in any way? What exactly did you expect it to do?

[Deleted]

I don't always come to MMO Champion. But when I do I come bearing a DOTA 2 beta gift.

Who wants it?