Warrior viability in 5.1

[Demetrion]

It's terrifying how some other classes are in the shadow of warriors and hunters just because of those videos being shared around the WoW community atm.

Mages - Can do INSANE, INSANE damage WITHOUT even casting! I thought mages was casters?
DKs - Can do INSANE crits without using any big cds really, stun everyone within a particular radius (not sure how big it is), unless people using anti-movement imparing cds.
Shadow priests - Can do INSANE crits with Devouring plague + Mind Blast, also insanely good off healers atm, just turtle until 3 orbs and one shot something, YEAH I SAID IT.
Feral druids - With cds, can do same damage as warriors with cds, a little easier to stop in some scenarios, and then again, they cant be rooted, disarmed nor polymorphed.

This is just a few, but atm the hybrid classes are so fucking strong turtelers atm that its really sad seeing people still whining about warriors even though they are getting HUGE nerfs. I mean a warrior is really easy to stop atm and in 5.1 when they cant range silence (which was stupid indeed, but please keep the pummel silence, stupid to remove that one) and can be rooted with their strongest CD.

You forgot to put your own class (judging by your avatar) which can do INSANE damage with cooldowns with amazing off heals.

[Strah]

The problem with warriors is Dragons Roar, TFB, and immunity to all CCs. Dragons roar is critting for 200k+ with all CDs up, 5 stacks of TFB, regardless how rare it is, can 1shot anyone on command, and Avatar insures they can do whatever the hell they want.

Are we playing the same game?

Warriors using dragon's roar over shockwave?
Immunity to CC?

Oh,wow.

[akon]

Hybrids are getting a nerf, pvp power no longer effects your healing if you are in a dps spec, this change makes a HUGE difference. before on my shadow priest i could heal with a flash heal for 170k on a crit, without the pvp power scaling on pts i heal for around 40k on a crit. i agree that other classes are hiding in the warriors shadow and being UN-noticed, but once warriors receive their nerfs, people will start on the next class and call for nerfs on them too, its a viscous cycle.

So classes like retri paladins or shamans will loose their "all time classic" advandage on pvp, the fact that they could heal, they should let a bit increase heal for hybrids cause either ill go full str gems to do a decent heal (lower dmg thought) or ill go pvp power and since im a hybrid mellee fighter my dmg will be "kinda" ok but my heal will suck AND then i should not use it AND then ill become just melee dps AND then ill ask for the same dmg that classic mellee dps can do (warriors dk etc) i dont disagree with the OP that pvp power offers im just asking for A TOTAL remover cause its TOTAL unbalanced-uncontrollable

P.S ofc pvp power remove requires decent str-inte-agi gems and not these pathetic

---------- Post added 2012-11-08 at 03:51 PM ----------

It's terrifying how some other classes are in the shadow of warriors and hunters just because of those videos being shared around the WoW community atm.

Mages - Can do INSANE, INSANE damage WITHOUT even casting! I thought mages was casters?
DKs - Can do INSANE crits without using any big cds really, stun everyone within a particular radius (not sure how big it is), unless people using anti-movement imparing cds.
Shadow priests - Can do INSANE crits with Devouring plague + Mind Blast, also insanely good off healers atm, just turtle until 3 orbs and one shot something, YEAH I SAID IT.
Feral druids - With cds, can do same damage as warriors with cds, a little easier to stop in some scenarios, and then again, they cant be rooted, disarmed nor polymorphed.

This is just a few, but atm the hybrid classes are so fucking strong turtelers atm that its really sad seeing people still whining about warriors even though they are getting HUGE nerfs. I mean a warrior is really easy to stop atm and in 5.1 when they cant range silence (which was stupid indeed, but please keep the pummel silence, stupid to remove that one) and can be rooted with their strongest CD.

If u consider BIG-HUGE-OP nerf the fact that u will need ( since u dont have 2ble charge leap slow right? oh u have ) 1 blessing of freedom and not just the FOTM healer then u are either new to the game or u just dont know wow at all.And since u dont have reflect ( oh u have) u want 1 interupt or silence mechanic, dunno if u have any......DO U????? "Hide in the shadows of warrior" i spit to warriors since my 1st day of wow and warriors like urself.

[skrump]

Hybrids are getting a nerf, pvp power no longer effects your healing if you are in a dps spec, this change makes a HUGE difference. before on my shadow priest i could heal with a flash heal for 170k on a crit, without the pvp power scaling on pts i heal for around 40k on a crit. i agree that other classes are hiding in the warriors shadow and being UN-noticed, but once warriors receive their nerfs, people will start on the next class and call for nerfs on them too, its a viscous cycle.

No actually the funny thing about that is that no matter how much warriors get beaten with the nerf bat people still find a reason to complain about us, hell people once complained about hamstring to the point that blizzard ended up nerfing the duration and then gave better versions to nearly every class in the very next expansion.

Though I do agree that being able to chain 3 offensive damage increasing cooldowns together for 10-15 seconds of god mode might be a little overboard and maybe blizz should consider nerfing the damage output of those abilities and then increase their durations as compensation.

[akon]

No actually the funny thing about that is that no matter how much warriors get beaten with the nerf bat people still find a reason to complain about us, hell people once complained about hamstring to the point that blizzard ended up nerfing the duration and then gave better versions to nearly every class in the very next expansion.

Though I do agree that being able to chain 3 offensive damage increasing cooldowns together for 10-15 seconds of god mode might be a little overboard and maybe blizz should consider nerfing the damage output of those abilities and then increase their durations as compensation.

I agrre that blizzard kinda messed up with nerfs but as far the slow yes when there are DKs u cant be pleased with ur slows (joke i love my pallys slow+rogues got slow nerf too),i have retri pally and i got boost speed and slow like permant and still i need something more in some situations but i dont deserve it!Avatar was a total bad talent since u cant just copy a CD like avatar (wings for warriors) to a class that already had his pvp mechanics imagine if suddenly let paladins use bladestorm cd,i know it will be op (pop all cds holystorm for example with the same immunity to cc ).
This unbalanced situation was just the result of ppl asking-demanding-whining for their class to have all the "BIS" skills (we saw all classes to have interupt,we saw all classes to have selfheal mechanics, we saw all classes have slow etc etc, and dont be missdirected my retris boost of speed is like a charge copy).One more example that this tactic can lead into bad situation are warlocks their 87 lvl spells is this pathetic demon gate which is 1st something useless since they have the demonic portal 2nd too low skill considering others (ascedance,the execute skill for DKs etc), but i bet blizzard doesnt want to give them mages-blink (something that ppl demand long time now) that it would be either OP or true copy of another spell .Finally since i mentioned execute for DKs this is another example for ALL SPELLS IN ALL CLASSES.

P.S Dont ask for mage nerf caues he can kill warriors, ask for a rogue boost to kill the mage.And if this happen then lets see what warriors can do to a rogue. BALANCED!

[ati87]

No actually the funny thing about that is that no matter how much warriors get beaten with the nerf bat people still find a reason to complain about us, hell people once complained about hamstring to the point that blizzard ended up nerfing the duration and then gave better versions to nearly every class in the very next expansion.

Though I do agree that being able to chain 3 offensive damage increasing cooldowns together for 10-15 seconds of god mode might be a little overboard and maybe blizz should consider nerfing the damage output of those abilities and then increase their durations as compensation.

Please warriors may have been weak for a total of 2 season since the introduction of arena.

Blizzard has the bad habit of over buffing warriors even if warriors are balanced (which warriors aren't often balanced).

And warriors should even have hamstring during a time when they could move around the field like a ping pong ball.

[Dristereau]

For some of the points here:
- TFB 5 Stacks is almost impossible to get, especially in an Arena Environment. If you get 5 Stack TFB good for you, because I've only seen once or twice on my warrior since hitting 90.
- Avatar will last four seconds longer in 5.1 but you are no longer immune to snare/slows and such. It just breaks them when cast, so you can keep a warrior CC'd to prevent their damage during this.
- Heroic Throw and Pummel are loosing their glyphed silence for PVP, meaning they can no longer silence, only interrupt at immediate (pummel) or mid range (disrupting shout)
- Shockwave is the only choice out of Bladestorm and Dragon's Roar due to its control element and cooldown for arena, so no insane DR Damage.

The removal of Gag Order is extremely painful, mainly for Heroic Throw, and the removal of Avatar giving freedom makes us bait for a Frost Mage.The main issue Warriors have is cooldown stacking. Avatar (20% Increased Damage) + Recklessness (50% Increased Crit Chance) + Skull Banner (20% Increased Crit Damage) + Berserker Rage (10% Increased Damage) + Trinket (4042 Strength Dreadful Version) = A Pile of Death and Destruction. Warrior's control may have needed a slight nerf, but the main area of focus should have been and still should be to stop a player from doing all this at once for quick kills.

[Deleted]

The pvp power change will hurt warrior a lot too.

No more switching to d-stance, shieldwall and turtle with insane second wind heals.

Had a one on one with another warrior in the arena after our teammates dies. We both fought until we were both close to execute range then both us d-stanced and started to turtle. We couldn't kill each other.

[Dristereau]

Warrior's don't benefit from PVP Power healing as far as I'm aware, it's a flat percentage and just hybrids who are being nerfed (e.g. Ret Paladins, Shadow Priests, Boomkins and such). Warrior's will probably still turtle up and go defensive at low HP. Just use trinkets or cooldowns when you get them near execute range.

[iamthedevil]

The pvp power change will hurt warrior a lot too.

No more switching to d-stance, shieldwall and turtle with insane second wind heals.

Had a one on one with another warrior in the arena after our teammates dies. We both fought until we were both close to execute range then both us d-stanced and started to turtle. We couldn't kill each other.

i don't think that works the way you think it works.

[Deleted]

- TFB 5 Stacks is almost impossible to get, especially in an Arena Environment. If you get 5 Stack TFB good for you, because I've only seen once or twice on my warrior since hitting 90.

Even if it's hard to get 5 stacks, it still shouldn't be possible to oneshot anyone, ever. Already 3-4 stacks do way too much damage, but at least blizzard said that they will try to make it cap to 3 stacks on ptr. A better change would've been keeping the same amount of stacks but making a hc strike consume only 1 stack at time, which would reduce the burst but increase the sustained damage. Anyway, it's good that they are doing something to it (maybe).

[iamthedevil]

Blizz posted they will be trying a max of 3 stacks of TFB in the next ptr patch.

[Dristereau]

I agree that it should not be able to one-shot someone, but the reason it does do so is generally because of Cooldown Stacking. With the Cooldowns I listed, you can easily get an almost 100% chance of a Critical Strike (Crit Chance plus Recklessness), then buff the damage by at least 30% (Avatar and Berserker Rage) and then 20% increased Critical Strike Damage (Banner), then trinket on top, this is why we are seeing major issues.

Also have TFB being a slightly increased chance but only stacking to three would be nice I think. Then again the buff only lasts 15 seconds max,so use of CC in 3's and 5's is possible to stop it from being unleashed.

[ati87]

Even if the change to burst and control it won't be enough to actually bring down warriors to the level of the more balanced classes right now (which are dk, warlocks, monks and rogues who are overshadowed by mages and warriors).

Warriors will still have more control and better mobility then any other melee class
Warriors will still have high burst even with Avatar change because teammates will/should allow the warrior to stay on target

The current changes on PTR won't really effect warriors, since they will still have high control/mobility and high burst.

[jeremynative]

i hope they dont get nerfed, me and many other people abandonded their lackluster class to faceroll with a new warrior. mine is level 41 =)

[John2894]

warrior's for sure need a major nerf they have to much utilty and there damage is outrageously high in comparison to other classes. blizzard confirmed recently that pretty soon warriors are heading for a huge nerf.

[Arteous]

I made a warrior on the PTR, i have never gotten my warrior to level 80 on live,

i stopped reading there.

[NaRk]

For some of the points here:
- TFB 5 Stacks is almost impossible to get, especially in an Arena Environment. If you get 5 Stack TFB good for you, because I've only seen once or twice on my warrior since hitting 90.
- Avatar will last four seconds longer in 5.1 but you are no longer immune to snare/slows and such. It just breaks them when cast, so you can keep a warrior CC'd to prevent their damage during this.
- Heroic Throw and Pummel are loosing their glyphed silence for PVP, meaning they can no longer silence, only interrupt at immediate (pummel) or mid range (disrupting shout)
- Shockwave is the only choice out of Bladestorm and Dragon's Roar due to its control element and cooldown for arena, so no insane DR Damage.

The removal of Gag Order is extremely painful, mainly for Heroic Throw, and the removal of Avatar giving freedom makes us bait for a Frost Mage.

I can't believe that warriors are complaining about this removal or Gag Order...Warriors are already the class with most interrupts in the game.
1) You can Charge twice every 20 sec or once every 12 sec to interrupt any spell (ranged interrupt - 12 sec CD).
2) You can pummel to interrupt enemy and silence for 4 sec (melee range - 15 sec CD)
3) You can use disrupting shout at mid range to interrupt and silence for 4 sec (ranged - 40 sec CD)
4) You can use Shockwave to interrupt and stun/silence for 4 sec (ranged - 20 sec CD)
5) You can use Spell Reflection to reflect one cast every 25 sec (better than interrupting) (ranged - 25 sec CD)

So, between all those abilities, the caster has almost no time to cast against an warrior. The only time he is allowed to cast is when the warrior is Freezed, disoriented or feared.
The interruption of casts and control of the battlefield is surely the best thing a warrior already has, he doesn't need another Gag Order to do so.
Tell me any other class who has this amount of interrupts? Most melees just have 2 of them, warriors have 5!!

[Rorke]

I think Blizzard is nerfing Warriors in the right direction. Warriors should keep their defensive utility but lose their offensive control and immunities. Basically, Warriors should have high burst, high sustained, some control, high passive defense, low healing and average mobility.

The only thing Blizzard needs to do with Warriors is to put shockwave on a 40 second cooldown and to remove the glyph of heroic leap. They should also revert Heroic leap back to a 1 minute cooldown.

---------- Post added 2012-11-08 at 04:00 PM ----------

I can't believe that warriors are complaining about this removal or Gag Order...Warriors are already the class with most interrupts in the game.
1) You can Charge twice every 20 sec or once every 12 sec to interrupt any spell (ranged interrupt - 12 sec CD).
2) You can pummel to interrupt enemy and silence for 4 sec (melee range - 15 sec CD)
3) You can use disrupting shout at mid range to interrupt and silence for 4 sec (ranged - 40 sec CD)
4) You can use Shockwave to interrupt and stun/silence for 4 sec (ranged - 20 sec CD)
5) You can use Spell Reflection to reflect one cast every 25 sec (better than interrupting) (ranged - 25 sec CD)

So, between all those abilities, the caster has almost no time to cast against an warrior. The only time he is allowed to cast is when the warrior is Freezed, disoriented or feared.
The interruption of casts and control of the battlefield is surely the best thing a warrior already has, he doesn't need another Gag Order to do so.
Tell me any other class who has this amount of interrupts? Most melees just have 2 of them, warriors have 5!!

Any caster who gets interrupted by Disrupting Shout's 10 yard range should uninstall the game. Any Warrior who actually uses it should do the same.

[Sikend]

Lets put charge on a 30second cooldown and mortal strike only generate 5 rage and lets up all rage costs by 15rage, remove hamstring and piercing howl, and lets lower warrior movement speed by 8%