CEO's blame layoffs and reduced hours on Obama re-election

[MasterHamster]

It's despicable that employers are fighting healthcare for their employees, in a country where such a system is used.

[Deleted]

This is only an actual rule of thumb if we believe that publicly listed companies are always rational actors with perfect information. The biggest contribution to economics that came from Hayek was a better understanding and emphasis on imperfect information; it confounds me that libertarians seem to forget it at times.

The problem (or in my opinion benefit) with publically listed companies is that irrational action is immediately punished by the market. The CEO's can't "get away with it".

[expectwar]

You know what I always say.... Blame it on the Bay!

[Xargoth6634]

Papa John's pizza tastes like poorly disguised cardboard, and you couldn't pay me to eat it. It's a little disingenuous of him to suggest that he "has" to cut workers to maintain his own incredibly lavish standard of living but I guess that's his prerogative as CEO if he owns enough stock. He's still a douchebag though.

[Spectral]

The problem (or in my opinion benefit) with publically listed companies is that irrational action is immediately punished by the market. The CEO's can't "get away with it".

We'd see a hell of a lot less market inefficiencies and corrections if this were the case. Investors aren't perfectly rational actors with perfect information either. I think you're greatly overstating the general ability of both executives and investors to predict things.

[Deleted]

We'd see a hell of a lot less market inefficiencies and corrections if this were the case. Investors aren't perfectly rational actors with perfect information either. I think you're greatly overstating the general ability of both executives and investors to predict things.

The financial markets are pretty effective, barring places where government disturbs it (e.g. bans on short sales or certain investment vehicles). The inefficiencies are usually due to different factors such as central bank policy or moral hazards inherent to the current financial system. It's highly likely that investors will choose to make a profit by shorting a company that makes decisions based on political ideology instead of shareholder value.

Either way, even you yourself should understand that the outlook for a coal company is much worse due to Obama's victory.

[Spectral]

The financial markets are pretty effective, barring places where government disturbs it (e.g. bans on short sales or certain investment vehicles). The inefficiencies are usually due to different factors such as central bank policy or moral hazards inherent to the current financial system. It's highly likely that investors will choose to make a profit by shorting a company that makes decisions based on political ideology instead of shareholder value.

We disagree regarding how rational and effective the markets are. That's fine. I think they do a fairly good job over time, but that any given snapshot is likely to be strongly effected by reactions to imperfect information.

Either way, even you yourself should understand that the outlook for a coal company is much worse due to Obama's victory.

Absolutely, this is one of the reasons I voted for him. Unlike the politicians that beat around the bush and use euphemisms, I make no bones about it - I want the coals companies crippled. Simply having to pay for the cost of their externalities will do that all its own.

[Deleted]

We disagree regarding how rational and effective the markets are. That's fine. I think they do a fairly good job over time, but that any given snapshot is likely to be strongly effected by reactions to imperfect information.

I'm not saying they're perfect, just that they're about as efficient as it gets. And the biggest inefficiencies are unrelated to pricing the stock based on a decision like this. I don't subscribe to the efficient market hypothesis, but it's an useful tool.

Absolutely, this is one of the reasons I voted for him. Unlike the politicians that beat around the bush and use euphemisms, I make no bones about it - I want the coals companies crippled. Simply having to pay for the cost of their externalities will do that all its own.

So, in other words what the Coal company CEO is doing is not some sort of rhetoric based on his own political bias, rather a sensible thing to do because these employees will be redundant.

[jmt]

Regarding the post about PJ's learning the same way Chick-Fil-A did, although they don't release their figures, most financial analysts estimate that they got a surge in business from the LGBT issue.

The fact is, $0.14 is a gross underestimate of the amount they would have to raise pizza prices to support themselves. Had it been a minor issue, they would have never said anything and passed the slight cost on to their consumers. It could've have been a stunt, a reason to streamline their workforce. But the fact that they are 1 company out of 100s across all industries utilizing the same maneuvers would suggest otherwise.

You can boycott PJs all you want, but until their customer service declines, their prices increase, or their product quality decreases, there will be little if any effect.

These companies aren't laying people off to increase their profits. They're laying people off (and increasing their prices) to maintain their current levels. The pros of having a larger workforce far outweigh the cons -- assuming the associated expenses remain the same across either level.

[One-Eyed Jack]

Meh... Behavior like that just further shows that just because you are a CEO, doesn't automatically mean that you are more intelligent or more ethical. Reminds me of the glass-steagall lobbying where the bankers claimed that "corporate ethics" would keep them from abusing changes to it. We saw how that turned out.

Breaking news bulletin... Greedy hypocritical assholes are greedy hypocritical assholes... Details at no shit sherlock...

They are the employers. If people are irresponsible spenders that's there problem. Personally, if I were I CEO I wouldn't want to pay extra for other people shit including healthcare. If you have a bunch of kids and had to cut the cost of your own personal healthcare because of it, then that's your problem.

[Cheatz]

Unfortunately there a lot of people in this thread that just don't have a clue and get all their info from what they read on the internet.

Take it from someone whose family owns a business and whose wife works in healthcare. Obamacare is bad. Companies will either fire people, push full time employees to part time, or raise costs significantly. Some larger businesses could get away with it but smaller or moderate size business just can't and won't handle the increased cost without having to do something about it.

I would love for everyone to have healthcare. I have always payed for my own and my families. I love the people that bitch they can't afford it then spend $300 a month on cigarettes or bear or other shit they just don't need but expect someone else to provide it for them. Welfare mentality.

[dokilar]

i live about 30 mins from a big mine that bob murray owns, know several friends who were laid off "due to obama"

im not a fan of obama but from what a lot of my friends say that work at that mine bob murray is a dickhead and the real reason they were laid off actually had little to do with obamas re-election. im fairly certain obama is "anti-coal" but i dont think he had an particular role in this round of lay offs at this particular terminal

[Cheatz]

On a side note to those who like Dominos pizza since the revamp. You do know who was responsible for that revamp right? Bain Capital...Romney.

[Lazy Gecko]

I'm sure it'll be worth alienating your customers just to spite the bogeyman president. That'll show him!

[Spectral]

I'm not saying they're perfect, just that they're about as efficient as it gets. And the biggest inefficiencies are unrelated to pricing the stock based on a decision like this. I don't subscribe to the efficient market hypothesis, but it's an useful tool.

Right, and we disagree here. That's fine, I don't think your position is completely invalid, but I do think trying to hash through this particular disagreement in the context of the thread is probably not a great idea.

So, in other words what the Coal company CEO is doing is not some sort of rhetoric based on his own political bias, rather a sensible thing to do because these employees will be redundant.

Yes, I think coal companies are reacting correctly. That does not mean all companies are.

[Deleted]

I'm gonna go ahead and quote this guys entire post because it seems that he's been ignored and I feel he has a point! so.. THERE!

I pretty much completely agree with him.

[Spectral]

people in this thread that just don't have a clue and get all their info from what they read on the internet.

Take it from someone whose family owns a business and whose wife works in healthcare.

So, don't read things on the internet, just take it from some guy on the internet.

[Wells]

Murray is a huge scum bag so fuck him anyway, he has blood on his hands.

[alturic]

What a bunch of children. If Romney got elected the same thing would be happening.

Actually, if republicans got in, it wouldn't have happened because they are smart enough to repeal the abomination that is Obamacare.

[Wells]

And its not like the coal industry has changed over the last 2 weeks. If it was profitable for Murray to employ those people before the election it was profitable to employ them now. He's just trying to make political hay.