TFB nerfed

[Aeluron Lightsong]

I don't really mind this change but I really hate TFB as a mechanic.

[bongchoof]

Am I correct in making the unfortunate assumption that this will affect both PvP and PvE?

[Aeluron Lightsong]

It will but the thing is TFB 5 stacks is so rare. I've been getting TFB procs often lately but at one point it was HORRIBLE. I really hate the mechanic. I mean the strategy is if a Warrior has TFB 5 stacks run away or don't even let him get that many.

[bongchoof]

Sure, I guess it's rare but it's still a nerf that Arms doesn't need and they still do, indeed, occur. I find huge numbers on the screen pretty fun and Arms doesn't have that except for Execute and I don't care about PvP so you'll have to forgive me for being a little annoyed.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

I don't PVP anymore *Shows the Crowd Control Scars*

I'd rather they move Sustained or at least push the burst into Sustained. >.>

[Hypnozis]

I think this is a justified nerf, however they should increase the damage at 3 stacks compared to what it is at now so that it can still do decent damage. Cause at the moment 2 tfb stacks is equiv to slam anyway. So that 1 extra stack it better do a decent amount of more damage

[Yoshimiko]

Warrior defenses are fine. Compare our defensive toolset to that of locks and we break even. Compare to almost any other classes' and it's perfectly fine. Just because YOU suck and can't dps through second wind and can't fel flame the reflects doesn't mean warriors need nerfs in that department. I love QQ especially from locks. On PTR (everyone in maximal PvP gear outside of t2 weapons) and was bursted from 100-0 in 6 seconds through shield wall, die by the sword, defensive stance AND second wind by an AFFLICTION lock.

I..don't play warlock. Not really sure why people assume I do. Warlocks are setting sub-5% for a reason, They aren't as good as 6 of the other classes - and their representation is showing this.

Also, I'm calling bull shit. 100-0 in 6 seconds? No. Just no. That means (including dot setup, which is 1.5 seconds) he's pulling 67k DPS, from nothing. With a warrior on him. Through shield wall, and 62% resilience. On a PVE mob that'd be 293,800 DPS. I'm just not buying it. It's even more due to Die by the sword, as well as second wind - but I think this more than hammers in the point you're just lying, are doing this naked, or are severely undergeared... Like fighting in quest greens...from burning crusade...

I'm thinking these changes will do a lot to balance warriors, I just worry that 3 stacks of TFB is still going to be powerful. My warrior bud tells me on full resil targets with his T2 weapon, he's critting in the area of ~150-180k with 3 stacks(generally what they swap on). I'm hopeing he's hitting lower resil targets..but time will tell.

[Deleted]

Ask your warrior buddy why he bothers with 3 stacks of TfB. 150k-180k with 3 stacks means he's autoattacking for 50-60k and slamming for 120k. He should pop CDs and kill all by himself whatever he wishes within 3 seconds without caring for TfB.

[purebalance]

and thats half my point,they will just move on and nerf something else.they are asking for 2ed wind and shock wave to be nerfed now.do i think avatar should ahve been nerfed,no not when its a 3 min cd.our fear nope, silence on pummel yes but not on heroic throw.the nerf to tfb just makes us weaker "even though rare" in both pvp and pve.

what i was trying to say is warriors get the wrong abilities nerfed and then they nerf our damage making us useless.

---------- Post added 2012-11-09 at 12:03 PM ----------



whats more rare a 5 stack of tfb or a lock blasting you for 150k+ with chaos bolt?did they nerf chaos bolt,didnt think so.

They did. It's 100% undocumented too. If you use GoSaC with chaos bolt now, the GoSaC component is a dot.

[MrHappy]

glad you posted that screen shot-it just shows you warrior damage outside of cd stacking sucks.14k sw,9k op's 20 ms,like i said damage is not that good outside of cds.

do you not see this -> Stun (shockwave) => MS => Overpower, Overpower =>MS => HS => Dead......4 globals and you are dead....HS is off the GCD and if you charge/leap in and you MS 1st and stun after the person is perma stunned untill death even with a trinket you would still be dead because even if a mage blinks 2x charge would still close the gap and that person would be dead in 4...FOUR... globals.

By comparison a destro lock needs 5-6 globals to kill someone assuming that person is letting us stand and cast a 3sec CB cast.

Nefr warriors kktnxbye

[Hypnozis]

do you not see this -> Stun (shockwave) => MS => Overpower, Overpower =>MS => HS => Dead......4 globals and you are dead....HS is off the GCD and if you charge/leap in and you MS 1st and stun after the person is perma stunned untill death even with a trinket you would still be dead because even if a mage blinks 2x charge would still close the gap and that person would be dead in 4...FOUR... globals.

By comparison a destro lock needs 5-6 globals to kill someone assuming that person is letting us stand and cast a 3sec CB cast.

Nefr warriors kktnxbye

This is completely not true at all, 2 overpowers does not = 2 stacks of tfb, and even if u did get 2 stacks off the bat, 2 stacks of tfb hit about the same as a normal slam does. And complaining about HS being off global CD, does not make any sense, a warrior will not use HS unless they are either close to rage cap or they have high tfb stacks because the amount of rage it takes to use would be a waste and then you cant do anything if you rage starve yourself. Outside of CD's MS and OP don't hit that hard. Most of the time people complaining about these abilities are being beaten down within the 12 sec window of CDs. I have seen and been killed just as fast by a warrior as a lock, in addition stampede still does stupid damage in arenas.

Outside of the 12 sec window a warrior is not going to be doing much damage, until CDs are back again.

Any smart arena team will know to keep an eye out for warrior CDs / 5 stacks of tfb, and they can sheep, disarm, cyclone, fear, blind, and if they didnt take avatar than u can freeze in place, roots, etc during the 12 sec window and then its easy city against a warrior. Half of the arenas in wow have pillars of some sort, all you have to do is kite the warrior until the stacks wear off even if he gets at 2-3 stacks. A warrior cant charge you through a pillar, and a lot of time shock wave will miss a target if you are just out of los.

So there are plenty of ways to counter a warrior.

On a side note, I'm a bit annoyed that warriors keep getting nerfs but the one true nerf to mages with not being able to chain instant pyros got undone. Seems a bit unfair.

[Flaks]

do you not see this -> Stun (shockwave) => MS => Overpower, Overpower =>MS => HS => Dead......4 globals and you are dead....HS is off the GCD and if you charge/leap in and you MS 1st and stun after the person is perma stunned untill death even with a trinket you would still be dead because even if a mage blinks 2x charge would still close the gap and that person would be dead in 4...FOUR... globals.

By comparison a destro lock needs 5-6 globals to kill someone assuming that person is letting us stand and cast a 3sec CB cast.

Nefr warriors kktnxbye

The only time that rotation will kill you is if the warrior is level 90 with all cds popped and if you're a level 85.

---------- Post added 2012-11-12 at 08:41 PM ----------

I..don't play warlock. Not really sure why people assume I do. Warlocks are setting sub-5% for a reason, They aren't as good as 6 of the other classes - and their representation is showing this.

Also, I'm calling bull shit. 100-0 in 6 seconds? No. Just no. That means (including dot setup, which is 1.5 seconds) he's pulling 67k DPS, from nothing. With a warrior on him. Through shield wall, and 62% resilience. On a PVE mob that'd be 293,800 DPS. I'm just not buying it. It's even more due to Die by the sword, as well as second wind - but I think this more than hammers in the point you're just lying, are doing this naked, or are severely undergeared... Like fighting in quest greens...from burning crusade...

I'm thinking these changes will do a lot to balance warriors, I just worry that 3 stacks of TFB is still going to be powerful. My warrior bud tells me on full resil targets with his T2 weapon, he's critting in the area of ~150-180k with 3 stacks(generally what they swap on). I'm hopeing he's hitting lower resil targets..but time will tell.

Log on to the PTR and I'll show you. For the last part. Yes, TfB as a mechanic is all around broken so even with 3 stacks it's going to be the hardest hitting melee attack in the game. That said, the reason he's hitting so hard isn't just cause of TfB but also the fact that pvp power is insanely overpowered all around and is the main culprit for retarded burst. With his T2 weapon he's effectively able to have 50% pvp power while his opponents are probably barely breaking 65% pvp resilience. Compare that to players without pvp gear who have 40% damage reduction through resilience baseline and no pvp power to bypass that.

[Yoshimiko]

The only time that rotation will kill you is if the warrior is level 90 with all cds popped and if you're a level 85.

---------- Post added 2012-11-12 at 08:41 PM ----------



Log on to the PTR and I'll show you. For the last part. Yes, TfB as a mechanic is all around broken so even with 3 stacks it's going to be the hardest hitting melee attack in the game. That said, the reason he's hitting so hard isn't just cause of TfB but also the fact that pvp power is insanely overpowered all around and is the main culprit for retarded burst. With his T2 weapon he's effectively able to have 50% pvp power while his opponents are probably barely breaking 65% pvp resilience. Compare that to players without pvp gear who have 40% damage reduction through resilience baseline and no pvp power to bypass that.

I have to admit, I keep forgetting about PVP power, and how batshit overpowered it is.

[Deleted]

I am really afraid of 5.1. I have a feeling that we only see heavy nerfs coming and not even a single little buff. People probably just dont reckonize how hard these nerfs are, especially the gag order nerf is game changing.


Btw here is a good read http://www.arenajunkies.com/topic/23.../#entry3803955

[meathead]

do you not see this -> Stun (shockwave) => MS => Overpower, Overpower =>MS => HS => Dead......4 globals and you are dead....HS is off the GCD and if you charge/leap in and you MS 1st and stun after the person is perma stunned untill death even with a trinket you would still be dead because even if a mage blinks 2x charge would still close the gap and that person would be dead in 4...FOUR... globals.

By comparison a destro lock needs 5-6 globals to kill someone assuming that person is letting us stand and cast a 3sec CB cast.

Nefr warriors kktnxbye

so you are saying nerf warriors because "you claim" they killed another player in 4 global. but then say warlocks are ok because it takes them 5 gloabals to kill someone?lol.

did you miss the 8k OP; and the 20k ms's?your not going to global anyone with that kind of damage.the warrior got a lucky proc of tfb,thats how he killed the other player.ty bye.

[Yoshimiko]

so you are saying nerf warriors because "you claim" they killed another player in 4 global. but then say warlocks are ok because it takes them 5 gloabals to kill someone?lol.

did you miss the 8k OP; and the 20k ms's?your not going to global anyone with that kind of damage.the warrior got a lucky proc of tfb,thats how he killed the other player.ty bye.

The argument is Warlocks are counterable, Warriors are not.

[meathead]

The argument is Warlocks are counterable, Warriors are not.

yeah you got me there!warriors can not and will not ever be cc'ed period!warriors can not be slowed,sheeped,disarmed, feared, cycloned, frost ring,blinded,hexed,hunter traps,ice trap,the new pally stuns,rooted or kited at all.thank you for the info and your great post.

since you know all about warriors please tell me this. before i quit wow,any time i poped my cd's in arena "GOOD TEAMS" would just cc me.how can they counter me/warrior when you say warriors are not counterable

[Dumbro]

TfB nerf is not needed. Yesterday i was doing 2's with my brother, (healer), i got several high stacks of TfB, and not any one of them did more than 100k dmg, even with every single CD warrior's have. The team we were facing, same comp as us, they're warrior did not get any high stacks. Even tho he/she had a 3 stack at the end that critted me for all my hp.
It is not needed!

[kenshiro]

TFB nerf is the right way to deal with warriors. If I am the designer, I would remove TFB and heroic strike completely, and make slam off GCD. But since Blizzard nerfed warriors in the wrong way in the beginning, and now back to the right way without fixing their mistakes, so ... /sigh.

BTW, I am working on my feral druid now. It seems no complaint on feral at all (that's good). So my warrior fellows, if you have a druid go and try feral, simply smash those warrior haters. Feral is really fun and powerful at moment.

[Jaedeklol]

our 100k+ burst is rng while mages can set up frost bomb bursts every couple of seconds with a higher rng crit then ours. I know warrior vs mage is never balanced but that consistent pressure versus our 2 min burst set up is kind of bullshit. Blizzard is backed into a corner, they keep adding massive HP to try a counter against burst but only makes burst viable without ruining pve. They've strayed away from good balanced, skillful pvp and a lot of the good players have quit (besides all the ones making $ for playing).