British liberals attack family for being conservatives

[Shadowmelded]

This coordinated group has an Islamist ideology and came to power with the intent of implementing Islamist policies. Granted, the same thing could happen with just about any group of people. It should be of great concern that this has happened.

As Grokan already pointed out, you're 'conflating Islamic extremists with the Muslim population as a whole.' (Grokan, 2012, p11) (Writing tons of essays, this amused me for some reason, stupid Harvard referencing system)

The issue at hand here is corruption and tampering with the electoral process. That's not something exclusive to muslims or sharia law. This whole line of argument started because of the claim that Sharia law is taking over Britain which was patently false, and remains false. Nothing you have posted has backed up your case, it merely demonstrates an underlying fear or hatred of Muslims.

[Nakura Chambers]

Then you're conflating Islamic extremists with the Muslim population as a whole. I could make the argument that we need to be worried about Christianity because of the efforts by the Discovery Institute to impose their views on Intelligent Design upon our schools.

I don't, however, because I know that the few don't represent the whole.

The difference is that Islamism isn't some obscure minority. And most moderate Muslims are too afraid to stand up to extremists.

[IIamaKing]

Yeh I can't agree with this title purely for clicks about an event that hardly constitutes an attack.

You don't even have to look hard for actual attacks.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/1...n_2007232.html

[Shadowmelded]

The difference is that Islamism isn't some obscure minority. And most moderate Muslims are too afraid to stand up to extremists.

Anything to base this on other than 'take my word for it' ?

[Nakura Chambers]

Anything to base this on other than 'take my word for it' ?

History. It's pretty common knowledge that Islamism is no small movement within Islam.

[Kronik85]

Wow I can't believe I'm going to do this but....I'm going to defend UKIP, or at least put people in the right about it. UKIP are not an inherently racist party, they are just anti multiculture and anti EU. That's it though....no nazi affiliations and no racist policies.

I think people are confused because they don't actually know what multiculturalism actually is in Britan. Multiculturalism is simply a political idea that means people shouldn't have to give up their own culture in order to become British leading to a more integrated population. What this has led to over the past decade or 2 is the perception that British law now protects other cultures more than it protects our own indigenous culture.

Obviously this perception is wrong but when you get sensationalist journalism like we have in the UK people think it's true. UKIP at it's core is about protecting British sovereignty which is why it wants us out of the EU, not because they hate the idea of foreigners but because they think it's a corrupt waste of cash that erodes British law.

I'm sure UKIP may have racists in it but the party does not support racism. It's not to be lumped in with the BNP who on one hand pretend to be legitimate party but behind closed doors are relatively evil bastards who think they are getting away with it. Nigel Farage is a bit of a clown but I'm pretty sure if you met the guy behind closed doors and said "I fucking hate <insert racially denigrating slur here>" he would tell you to leave, where as Nick Griffin would shake your hand and say "welcome to the club".

Pretty confident UKIP aren't even close to being the third party in the UK, they do all right at Council elections and the EU elections but that's more to do with the fact that only motivated people take part in either, for the most part no one really cares and bothers to vote. If you thought voter apathy in the general election was bad you aint seen nothing yet.

/edit: On topic, the couple's political beliefs shouldn't have had any bearing on whether they are fit to adopt, it's a very scary notion. In fairness to the civil servant behind the decision the whole situation is a square peg in a round hole....but we know very little about the actual couple who I'm sure are actually very decent people, whether they would deny the foster children a proper education of their own cultural heritage we will never know. I know if I was the social worker looking at the situation with my future in mind then I might be tempted to do exactly what they have done. Can you imagine the headlines if domestic abuse did take place? "Council muppets leave immigrant children with racists!" springs to mind.

In the end the whole affair just makes us all look bad, regardless of political affiliation. Councils shouldn't be looking at peoples party memberships, foster children shouldn't be taken from stable homes and a couple shouldn't be considered racist for being in a legitimate political party. I guess these are the times we live in though.

[Shadowmelded]

History. It's pretty common knowledge that Islamism is no small movement within Islam.

So no sources, other than a prejudicial glance at 'history' and 'common knowledge'. Real strong arguments right there.

[Grizzly Willy]

The difference is that Islamism isn't some obscure minority. And most moderate Muslims are too afraid to stand up to extremists.

Hardcore Christians aren't, either. The Discovery Institute isn't some obscure group.

[Nakura Chambers]

So no sources, other than a prejudicial glance at 'history' and 'common knowledge'. Real strong arguments right there.

That explains why the Islamists control just about every single Muslim country, even the supposedly "democratic" Egypt (post-Arab Spring).

---------- Post added 2012-11-25 at 06:02 PM ----------

UKIP are not an inherently racist party, they are just anti multiculture and anti Europe.

I'm going to stop you right there, UKIP isn't anti-Europe.

[Kronik85]

I'm going to stop you right there, UKIP isn't anti-Europe.

Semantics, I meant EU. Will rectify. Considering my whole point was in the context of the EU I thought that would of been obvious. May I suggest reading posts fully next time before jumping in to score cheap points?

[Nakura Chambers]

Semantics, I meant EU. Will rectify. Considering my whole point was in the context of the EU I thought that would of been obvious. May I suggest reading posts fully next time before jumping in to score cheap points?

I wasn't trying to score cheap shots and I apologize if I offended you. In context, I do not believe that is correct either. UKIP is opposed to British membership within the EU, but supports economic cooperation with the European Union (such as free trade agreements).

If you go by the last general election results, UKIP was in fourth place. However, since then they have continued to gain considerable support and for nearly two years now, has been destroying the Liberal Democrats and replaced them as the third largest party.

Don't just take my word for it, feel free to look at the data yourself:

Source: http://cdn.yougov.com/cumulus_upload...lts-211112.pdf

[Kronik85]

*SNIP*

I don't have to look at the data. You can't look at data for local council elections and apply it to the general elections, it just doesn't work that way. I don't know why you keep putting words in my mouth either, I've made no comments about UKIP's economic policies just that UKIP wants us out of the EU....which they do.....as it says right here.....from the UKIP website.

UKIP alone holds that the rescue of the British people depends on withdrawal from the EU to regain our self-governing democracy so allowing the relief of business from crushing regulation and the less well off from the burden of taxes, shutting off the flood of immigrants and freeing enterprise.

Props to manning up though, I'm also sorry for being a douche and needlessly over sensitive.

[Nakura Chambers]

I don't have to look at the data. You can't look at data for local council elections and apply it to the general elections, it just doesn't work that way. I don't know why you keep putting words in my mouth either, I've made no comments about UKIP's economic policies just that UKIP wants us out of the EU....which they do.....as it says right here.....from the UKIP website.

That isn't local council election data, it's nation-wide opinion polling for the next general election. I didn't mean to put words in your mouth, you said that in the context of the European Union, UKIP is 'anti-Europe,' and I pointed out UKIP's support for agreements with the European communities, but not for the institution itself. But you're right, it is semantics and largely irrelevant to the discussion.

[Bakis]

That isn't local council election data, it's nation-wide opinion polling for the next general election. I didn't mean to put words in your mouth, you said that in the context of the European Union, UKIP is 'anti-Europe,' and I pointed out UKIP's support for agreements with the European communities, but not for the institution itself. But you're right, it is semantics and largely irrelevant to the discussion.

The next election 2015?

[Kronik85]

That isn't local council election data, it's nation-wide opinion polling for the next general election. I didn't mean to put words in your mouth, you said that in the context of the European Union, UKIP is 'anti-Europe,' and I pointed out UKIP's support for agreements with the European communities, but not for the institution itself. But you're right, it is semantics and largely irrelevant to the discussion.

Fair nuff. Got nothing to counter with aside from data being data and it was compiled by The Sun....paragon of investigative journalism. Both are slippery slopes though so I'll leave you to get on with it lol.

GL HF .

[Nakura Chambers]

The next election 2015?

Yes, that is correct.

[Cows For Life]

A nativist is not the same thing as a racist but in most cases there's a lot of overlap.