Help my group's Combat Rogue against Elegon

[Deleted]

how do you screw up your macro so badly to spam RS instead of SS ? ^^

Shh, don't blow his cover. We all know that he just didn't want to admit that he had no idea he was doing it wrong ;O I mean I'd personally start to investigate why I never got a single extra combo point from my damn combopoint builder :P

[Deleted]

I mean I'd personally start to investigate why I never got a single extra combo point from my damn combopoint builder :P

Forget that, how about seeing your Revealing Strike debuff get refreshed over and over and over without it ever falling off. I mean if you aren't actively tracking your debuffs as a Rogue you are doing it wrong.

No but seriously, I'm not buying it. If said Rogue didn't figure this out after one pull he's not fit to raid in my eyes. Mistakes happen and all, and yesterday I blundered horribly after my pet macro broke and my pet was just chilling next to me for a minute on heroic Protectors. But there is a massive difference between spamming Sinister Strike and Revealing Strike.

[Myzou]

Don't get me wrong, I understand he's doing things wrong, but why is everyone saying he's the issue?

Their elemental shaman is doing less damage than the tank and almost 25k less dps than one of their healers. (who is still doing good healing)

On top of that, their shadow priest is doing less damage than the rogue in question.

Yes, his rotation is terribad. But he's not the problem in that group.

[Deleted]

Don't get me wrong, I understand he's doing things wrong, but why is everyone saying he's the issue?

Was already addressed. People pointed out more people in that group were making mistakes, but the OP only wanted to hear about the Rogue because he posted in the Rogue forums. Which is understandable.

[Myzou]

Was already addressed. People pointed out more people in that group were making mistakes, but the OP only wanted to hear about the Rogue because he posted in the Rogue forums. Which is understandable.

That is what bothers me.

He made threads asking for help for their top DPS.

He did not for their elemental shaman, who is the lowest by far.

Something is off there. I'm starting to think the OP is the elemental shaman doing a bad job and trying to get his guildies to pull the slack.

On top of that, this is 10N, the other DPS are doing normal DPS for that. Yes, as was stated, there's serious flaws with the rogue's rotation, but his dps is still reasonable for 10 man normal MgV.

[Static Transit]

This fight IS kinda hard compared to other fights before it. It's a pretty rough DPS and healing check if you only have gear from the bosses before this one.

Your rogue, however, is awful. The RvS instead of SS (which you said will be fixed), the low SnD uptime (which is supposed to be pretty close to 100%), etc. Come on, rogue is one of the easiest DPS specs in PvE.

Don't get me wrong, I understand he's doing things wrong, but why is everyone saying he's the issue?

Their elemental shaman is doing less damage than the tank and almost 25k less dps than one of their healers. (who is still doing good healing)

On top of that, their shadow priest is doing less damage than the rogue in question.

Yes, his rotation is terribad. But he's not the problem in that group.

If you'll notice, OP said that he's posting about the ROGUE in this thread because this is the ROGUE forum. I'm sure OP will ask about the other members in the other class forums.

The rogue, however, is doing everything wrong. It looks to me like he's just spamming RvS and Eviscerate. He should prioritize Slice and Dice, then Eviscerate. He SHOULD use Rupture, but he has bigger problems to fix tbh (adding rupture only adds a tiny bit of DPS).

He seems to have taken Subterfuge. However, I notice he only has one cast of Ambush in his logs. He should make sure to throw in as many Ambushes as he can, and make sure to use Vanish on cd (at which point he should spam Ambush again.

But the biggest change he should probably be making is his SnD uptime. This is his BIGGEST priority. He also doesn't seem to be using any t4 talents, so make sure he takes Preparation and uses it on cd to reset his Vanish (giving him more Ambushes). He should also probably take Anticipation for his t6 talent. His glyphs also seem to be weird, make sure he's taking Glyph of Poisons (minor). He also seems to have quite a low uptime on Adrenaline Rush.

Just from looking at his logs and armory, that's pretty much all I can tell you. However, everything I said could be found out just by looking at any rogue guide (e.g. Icy Veins). I advise you to tell him to look up how to play his class.

---------- Post added 2013-02-02 at 04:27 AM ----------

That is what bothers me.

He made threads asking for help for their top DPS.

He did not for their elemental shaman, who is the lowest by far.

Something is off there. I'm starting to think the OP is the elemental shaman doing a bad job and trying to get his guildies to pull the slack.

On top of that, this is 10N, the other DPS are doing normal DPS for that. Yes, as was stated, there's serious flaws with the rogue's rotation, but his dps is still reasonable for 10 man normal MgV.

This is kinda irrelevant. He's asking about the rogue, and we should answer his questions about the rogue, not try to derail the thread because of curiosity. Maybe he just hasn't gotten around to asking about the ele shaman yet? It could be any number of things, but there's really no point in asking. Let the guy lead his own raid. We're just here to give help to any rogues that need it, and discuss other rogue-related things.

[Breccia]

Maybe he just hasn't gotten around to asking about the ele shaman yet?

No, it's because the elemental shaman is fired.

[Femoris]

But the biggest change he should probably be making is his SnD uptime. This is his BIGGEST priority. He also doesn't seem to be using any t4 talents, so make sure he takes Preparation and uses it on cd to reset his Vanish (giving him more Ambushes). He should also probably take Anticipation for his t6 talent. His glyphs also seem to be weird, make sure he's taking Glyph of Poisons (minor). He also seems to have quite a low uptime on Adrenaline Rush.

I would not take prep in this fight over shadowstep. Getting a couple more ambushes off in this fight will not outweigh being able to shadowstep back to the boss at phase transitions for more up time on the boss leading to more rupture uptime more snd uptime more energy gained and more damage overall.

[Static Transit]

No, it's because the elemental shaman is fired.

Well there you go.

I would not take prep in this fight over shadowstep. Getting a couple more ambushes off in this fight will not outweigh being able to shadowstep back to the boss at phase transitions for more up time on the boss leading to more rupture uptime more snd uptime more energy gained and more damage overall.

Perhaps. I don't raid on my rogue, so I can only give the basics of combat rogue (when I do play, it's usually assassination anyway). If anything though, this rogue probably shouldn't worry about Rupture for now, and worry about fixing those other things. Once he gets comfotable with his rotation, he could try throwing in Rupture, but it won't be that big of a dps loss if he ignores it completely (about 1-2% iirc).

[AceofHarts]

given the subtleties of using Revealing strike, i dont know why anyone would use it in a macro other then an Alt Function Macro (ie hit alt + button to use RvS instead of SS).

[Breccia]

I went into a fresh MV with the rogue and we killed the first four bosses. The rogue was the #1 dps over the four kills, with Sinister Strike as his #1 damage-dealing abiilty. He also had a much higher SnD uptime and even tried the Vanish-Ambush-Ambush trick a few times to see how it felt.

Thanks you all for your help in the matter, you made a big difference.

[Deleted]

Thanks you all for your help in the matter, you made a big difference.

Not that I was one of the people who helped, but I'm glad he's doing well now. That really is fantastic news.

Do you know if he uses an addon like NeedToKnow?
An addon that tracks buffs and debuffs is extremely important as a Rogue. He could have prevented that Revealing Strike problem with it as well as accurately track when he should refresh Slice and Dice.

[Breccia]

Addendum: last night, Elegon hit the floor. Rogue did over 100k dps, including a higher SnD uptime, more uses of both Rupture and Evicerate, and about 150 Sinister Strikes.

Thanks you all for your help, there are at least 10 people who greatly appreciate it. I hope you all enjoy getting Prep as baseline in 5.2

[Deleted]

That is what bothers me.
He did not for their elemental shaman, who is the lowest by far.
Something is off there. I'm starting to think the OP is the elemental shaman doing a bad job and trying to get his guildies to pull the slack.

Read the name of the warrior in the logs, and the name of the poster in this thread, before you jump to conclusions...

[Zhira]

From the logs it seems he tries to use /castsequence macros for button smashing. This rarely delivers satisfactory DPS. Just a guess!

He should switch to Assassination for Elegon. Given how bad his Combat rotation is (sorry, harsh but true), Assasination is a more forgiving spec.

Also, for some good pointers he should look at http://www.icy-veins.com/classes-wow

Z.

[Kael]

Addendum: last night, Elegon hit the floor. Rogue did over 100k dps, including a higher SnD uptime, more uses of both Rupture and Evicerate, and about 150 Sinister Strikes.

Thanks you all for your help, there are at least 10 people who greatly appreciate it. I hope you all enjoy getting Prep as baseline in 5.2

Glad we could help, but seeing as people are still posting with advice, I'm going to go ahead and close this. If you have future issues with Elegon, feel free to PM me to reopen it, or post a new thread for another topic (or have your rogue stop by personally).