Can the President Kill Indiscriminately?

[Komati]

#tinfoilhat

no, but really... zealot followers? are you for real?

Anyways, there's this thing called investigative journalism... and this other thing called a GOP dominated House, and this other thing called democracy... and this other thing called....

Ah democracy, such a nice word. Makes a country really nice when it's a "democracy". Kongo is also offically a democracy, did you know that?

Since when the fudge have journalism stopped a gorvernment from doing horrible things? Earlier this year a high standing politician from my country was caught giving undoccumented founding to a lots of organizations, he got elected head of his party.
Bush admitted he allowed the CIA to use torture, and break several other human rights, I haven't heard of any sanctions against him.

If Obama decides to have a couple thousand people killed in the name of freedom, no one is gonna do more than protest.

[Bakis]

Indiscriminately - no
Arbitrary - yes, since the definition is vague and noone are able to check if it was accurate or not apart from the ones who conveniently make the call to assassinate.

This is why we need Wikileaks and heroes like Mannings.

[seta-san]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yjqZJveJb2Q

[Ragnarocket]

Its just because it gives a Democrat president the power to do it. If the president was a Republican they would be fine with it. Basically feigned opposition.

Umm...no. As someone who leans toward the right I'd be just as opposed to something like this if a Republican in office was doing this just as much as I am opposed that a Democrat in office is doing it. Fun fact, you can be a Republican and disagree with things Republicans do...same as not all Democrats don't support everything that Democratic officials do.

[N-7]

When this is used to kill an actual American then you may have a case.

It has been used to kill a US citizen.

---------- Post added 2013-02-06 at 04:59 PM ----------

Certain criteria must be met, per the memo:

1) Target must be outside the United States.
2) Target must be a senior, operational member of al Qaeda or affiliated groups.
3) Is an imminent threat to the United States
4) Capturing individual is not possible.

So no, not indiscriminately.

However, the language in this memo is incredibly vague. Their definition of "imminent threat" is frightening at best. No evidence of an active plot required? That's not imminent.

Not really too pleased with the administration over this one, but I do realize we are not privy to a great deal of information.

These 3 points have been broken countless times now...

[Kasierith]

The lack of outrage is astounding. Coupled with a firearms ban, I don't even.

Tinfoil hat or not, a government that wants to ban all firarms while trying to justify its assassination of its own citizens is both scary and disgusting.

If you say that the government wants to ban all guns, than yes, your tinfoil hat is firmly attached and working properly.

---------- Post added 2013-02-06 at 06:01 PM ----------

These 3 points have been broken countless times now...

I thought that in the case of the citizens who were killed, they met those criteria?

[Badpaladin]

I'm not worried by the implication that it can be used on US citizens so much as the insanely vague literature used to describe their limitations in using it. To me, it reads they can use them on whoever they feel like.

[Naxere]

I would expect the same level of outrage that people that were against waterboarding felt back then...unfortunately, I'm not seeing it. I guess due process means nothing to this administration.

[Kasierith]

I'm not worried by the implication that it can be used on US citizens so much as the insanely vague literature used to describe their limitations in using it. To me, it reads they can use them on whoever they feel like.

Ya, that is very worrisome overall... but when you look at the security of the country overall and the ability of the government to fulfill its prime duty of protecting the nation from outside forces, it can sometimes be justifiable to bend the law. "Governing a country is a tough choice between doing the right thing, and doing the right thing. And the two don't always get along."

[killerlee]

The lack of outrage is astounding. Coupled with a firearms ban, I don't even.

Tinfoil hat or not, a government that wants to ban all firarms while trying to justify its assassination of its own citizens is both scary and disgusting.

People don't care anymore until it directly affects them. To many sheep tbh. People will freak the fuck out if the government uses the new drone programs to start killing people. All it takes is the government killing the wrong person in the wrong place for everyone to freak out.

But oh sorry we are called Conspiracy Theorists because HEAVEN FORBID we think outside the box and are not spoon feed by the media and there bullshit.

The world is gone to shit and no one seems to notice or care.

[Beazy]

I highly doubt the president would order the death of an American for anything other than the eminent threat of terrorism. His political opponents would eat him alive if he was caught "just killin` peeps" because he could.


LoL Could you imagine the headlines at FauxNews?

[Daelak]

I highly doubt the president would order the death of an American for anything other than the eminent threat of terrorism. His political opponents would eat him alive if he was caught "just killin` peeps" because he could.


LoL Could you imagine the headlines at FauxNews?

Any president could order the execution of any person, and get away with it, even in times of extreme incompetence by his subordinates, he/she can defer blame onto someone farther down the chain of command.

---------- Post added 2013-02-06 at 05:29 PM ----------

People don't care anymore until it directly affects them. To many sheep tbh. People will freak the fuck out if the government uses the new drone programs to start killing people. All it takes is the government killing the wrong person in the wrong place for everyone to freak out.

But oh sorry we are called Conspiracy Theorists because HEAVEN FORBID we think outside the box and are not spoon feed by the media and there bullshit.

The world is gone to shit and no one seems to notice or care.

People have been saying this for over 100 years.

[Xargoth6634]

Not sure how I feel about it, although I know this isn't a "do you agree with this?" style thread. I'm opposed to capitol punishment in general so I guess I'd lean more towards being against this type of thing, but in a situation with well-known anti-American enemy combatants I suppose it's just war.

[GreatOak]

Roundtable discussion on Morning Joe earlier about this topic

[ScottsdaleHokie]

Apparently King Barry thinks he can.

Remember when liberals were all up in arms about water boarding? Now we just kill them.

[Bakis]

Apparently King Barry thinks he can.

Remember when liberals were all up in arms about water boarding? Now we just kill them.

Actually the US still do both, torture and assassinations.

[Deleted]

Grow up. You know exactly what I mean. If you dont, dont comment.

No, actually, I don't. You're okay with Pakistani or Afghan or Iraqi civilians getting killed, but once it's POSSIBLE that someone from your country MAY be killed you get your panties in a bunch? If that isn't hypocrisy, I don't know what is.

[Deleted]

I don't mind the U.S. government killing terrorist, what I don't get is that this debate somehow includes the nationality of the person. If you think it's OK to kill someone with a drone strike as long as it's not a U.S. citizen, but cry your eyes out when he is, you deserve a missile in your own bedroom.

[Leonard McCoy]

[/COLOR]

Good thing about the terrorists is they live together, so killing their whole family line is not as hard as one thinks... and who cares about their cousin/friends, they live in a different terrorist village and will be next. This bullcrap about spreading terrorism cause you are killing a terrorist is bs and anybody with a half a brain knows it. These people are already terrorists, its not something you just turn into one day at 17 cause a family member was in the wrong place and got themselves blown up with the KNOWN enemy. You have to remember they know who is terrorist better than we do, why are they around these people (terrorists) if so "innocent".

Actually Wolfowitz knew it to and said as much. When you kill one terrorist and make a dozen more it really doesn't add up. Let's put the shoe on the other foot. If someone blew up your house and killed your family and friends what would you do about it?

[Deleted]

Apparently King Barry thinks he can.

Remember when liberals were all up in arms about water boarding? Now we just kill them.

It's the same difference as shooting an enemy soldier on the battlefield and killing/torturing him after he's been captured. I don't get your outrage.