Leveling Rogue in PvP, getting destroyed.

[PriestLuna]

UPDATE
So I hit level 30 and everything is great now. As many have mentioned here Rogues have it pretty tough until you get more abilities. Vanish was pretty huge for me. BGs are a blast, except for Hunters. Hunters can go die in a fire with their ridiculous CC and escapes.
END UPDATE

Ok, what am I doing wrong? I have hierlooms weapons, chest, legs, and cape and I'm getting absolutely wrecked in BGs. I'm only level 28 at the moment but it just doesn't feel right. I open on targets out of stealth and it feels like I have zero burst. At these levels people have around 2500 hp and I'm lucky to deal 500 on my opening burst, let alone hope to kill anyone. I'm combat right now, so I open with Ambush, Revealing Strikes then SS spam or finish with Eviscerate.

I can go into more with Armory or the like, but I'm just wondering if anyone has any tips for me without getting too detailed. I see other Rogues do well in BGs and it's gives me a sad. Help!

[Sarevoc]

It's completely unbalanced at those levels. I think shadowpriests are like gods at those levels, their shield absorbs incredible amounts.

It's a waste of time to PvP before lvl 90, unless it's big fun for you.

[PriestLuna]

Yep, I know it's way unbalanced but I wanted to make sure I'm not doing anything glaringly incorrect. Priests are stupid OP here, yes. PvP is huge fun for me while leveling, I've just never had so much uphill struggle with any other class until Rogue.

[Zach Baker]

Well, you should really be playing Sub for pvp at low levels. With Subterfuge you can get two ambushes off that do alot of damage.

[PriestLuna]

I'll give that a go. Was using Nightstalker and I like it. Although with Glyphs I could use the increased range on Ambush a lot.

[Saegno]

Well, you should really be playing Sub for pvp at low levels. With Subterfuge you can get two ambushes off that do alot of damage.

This. So much of this.

Also, I'm to figure you are using the swords or maces since you are combat, which would explain the poor ambush hits. You def want double daggers as pvp sub. With Subterfuge, by the time your stealth breaks you should of been able to Ambush, Ambush, Eviscerate and nearly everyone will be dead by then. You want to aim for targets, besides the obvious FC's in WSG, like warriors and paladins. They don't have much defense at that level and don't expect you to do as much damage as you will since you ignore 70% of there armor on the second ambush and evis.

[ej33t]

Without Adren Rush or Killing Spree combat would be severally bad choise for PVP.

[Phurox]

It's completely unbalanced at those levels. I think shadowpriests are like gods at those levels, their shield absorbs incredible amounts.

It's a waste of time to PvP before lvl 90, unless it's big fun for you.

And even then it is a waste of time...

[loki504]

And even then it is a waste of time...

how can having fun be a waste of time?

isn't playing a video game all about having fun?

[forwards1ca]

how can having fun be a waste of time?

isn't playing a video game all about having fun?

How can playing combat, even at max level, be construed as any type of fun?

[loki504]

How can playing combat, even at max level, be construed as any type of fun?

dunno. but he queted "It's completely unbalanced at those levels. I think shadowpriests are like gods at those levels, their shield absorbs incredible amounts.

It's a waste of time to PvP before lvl 90, unless it's big fun for you."

he didn't say combat or anyting. but low lvl bg can be alot of fun if you got the right class.
atleast for me. probebly not the other person:P

[smokii]

i levelled my rogue purely through bg's, but only in cata... so this help might not help at all.

i went sub, full heirlooms and dual heirloom daggers, i was always stealthed and tried to pick opportune moments where i could assist in taking a flag, CC'ing a healer or being the annoying rogue you can never find.

always had lots of fun running around just sapping random players, it's hilarious how many panic and spam aoe to find you when you're long gone. also, if you time it right, you can actually steal a flag with a player sapped and rogues are awesome at ninja capping.

essentially, in my opinion, if you're running around a BG as a rogue out of stealth, you're doing it wrong.

**clause** i am in no way a battleground pro, feel free to completely ignore my comments and or show me where i am going wrong, but trying to always be in stealth was a good start for me - it was the foundation of my pvp experience. but as i said at the top, i levelled in cata, that seems like a very long time ago now, things have probably changed quite drastically.

[ej33t]

How can playing combat, even at max level, be construed as any type of fun?

What makes it any less fun then the other two specs?

[forwards1ca]

dunno. but he queted "It's completely unbalanced at those levels. I think shadowpriests are like gods at those levels, their shield absorbs incredible amounts.

It's a waste of time to PvP before lvl 90, unless it's big fun for you."

he didn't say combat or anyting. but low lvl bg can be alot of fun if you got the right class.
atleast for me. probebly not the other person:P

you obviously missed the point of the post. he is playing a combat rogue, which, imo, is so brain dead boring that I'd honestly rather stab myself in the testicles with a spoon than play at any level.

---------- Post added 2013-02-19 at 11:22 AM ----------

What makes it any less fun then the other two specs?

THe mechanics of the spec.....is basically spamming 1 underpowered attack all day long. There's very little utility, survivability or fun with combat these days.

[loki504]

you obviously missed the point of the post. he is playing a combat rogue, which, imo, is so brain dead boring that I'd honestly rather stab myself in the testicles with a spoon than play at any level.

---------- Post added 2013-02-19 at 11:22 AM ----------



THe mechanics of the spec.....is basically spamming 1 underpowered attack all day long. There's very little utility, survivability or fun with combat these days.

no i didn't missed the point. you missed the point of my reply.
i know rogues suck at low lvl bg and there not fun. but that aside.
but he said low lvl bg are a waste of time even if your having fun.
but i play either high lvl bg or low lvl bg for fun. and doing 2600+ rbg or doing world first is a waste of time. because in the end they only give pixels. and feel like a job
i play to have fun. not to earn shinny pixels or ingame respect because i got glad title.

[Meejum]

Ok, what am I doing wrong? I have hierlooms weapons, chest, legs, and cape and I'm getting absolutely wrecked in BGs. I'm only level 28 at the moment but it just doesn't feel right. I open on targets out of stealth and it feels like I have zero burst. At these levels people have around 2500 hp and I'm lucky to deal 500 on my opening burst, let alone hope to kill anyone. I'm combat right now, so I open with Ambush, Revealing Strikes then SS spam or finish with Eviscerate.

I can go into more with Armory or the like, but I'm just wondering if anyone has any tips for me without getting too detailed. I see other Rogues do well in BGs and it's gives me a sad. Help!

I wouldn't play combat until you had cheap shot, at least, and kidney. There just isnt enough burst, and you will have to sit on target for a long time.

[Sesshou]

This. So much of this.

Also, I'm to figure you are using the swords or maces since you are combat, which would explain the poor ambush hits.

No, ambush hits pretty much the same with daggers and non daggers. The only real advantages of daggers are more poison procs and access to certain dagger only attacks.

@OP
Basically what ej33t said. You are pvping as combat before you have access to anything that lets you burst.

[forwards1ca]

No, ambush hits pretty much the same with daggers and non daggers. The only real advantages of daggers are more poison procs and access to certain dagger only attacks.

@OP
Basically what ej33t said. You are pvping as combat before you have access to anything that lets you burst.

Are you trolling? I sure hope you arent serious, because if you are, you, sir, are not the sharpest knife inthe drawer. "Ambush the target, causing 325% weapon damage plus 623 to the target (470.275% plus (623 * 1.447) if a dagger is equipped). Must be stealthed and behind the target. Awards 2 combo point." Copy and pasted right off of the spell itself. Blizzard has explicitly stated that ambush is supposed to be a dagger attack.

[Sesshou]

Are you trolling? I sure hope you arent serious, because if you are, you, sir, are not the sharpest knife inthe drawer. "Ambush the target, causing 325% weapon damage plus 623 to the target (470.275% plus (623 * 1.447) if a dagger is equipped). Must be stealthed and behind the target. Awards 2 combo point." Copy and pasted right off of the spell itself. Blizzard has explicitly stated that ambush is supposed to be a dagger attack.

Are YOU serious? It has a larger % multiplier on daggers because they are faster and thus have lower weapon damage and they are also normalized with an inferior coefficient. Stop blindly reading tooltips and go actually get a decent understanding of mechanics so you can actually interpret them correctly.

So yeah what I said before holds. If you want a tip, see what 1.447 number that the tooltip shows you that the flat damage bonus gets multiplied by? Go find a calculator and multiply 325% by that. Then find the ratio of weapon speed between a standard non dagger and a standard dagger.

[ej33t]

Although I wouldn't try Sub without daggers because they're a requirement of Backstab. Btw, I am a combat rogue. I've been one since TBC and my off-spec has always been assassination, and I'd like to see come combat buffs :/