[Megathread] StarCraft 2

[Blackdecker]

Played SC2 all weekend, improved a lot on ZvT and ZvZ. Didn't get out of Gold yet, but i'm looking foward to get in Plat before HOTS.
I'm happy with my ling/baneling control, infestor play and creep spread, much better than last week.

Cannon Rush is still a problem, don't really know how to defend it. Any tips ?

[Lunareste]

Depends on what you used to open.

If Hatch before Pool: Drone scout your natural, second overlord parked over your 3rd. If his cannons complete before your hatcheries do, cancel hatch.

If Pool before Hatch: Your first overlord should arrive in his natural in time to see whether his forge has completed. If it has completed and his Nexus is up, you're safe. If there is no Nexus you are being Cannon rushed. Cancel Hatch and throw down a Roach Warren. Alternatively you can try to save your natural Hatch by using multiple Queens and zerglings to target down his Pylon; but this is map dependent and there are certain maps that will stop you from doing this with the layout of the minerals.

[cudomix]

Grab a third base (especially powerful on maps with acessible/easily defendable thirds as antiga, daybreak etc), even if you lose your natural you're still even/ahead, proper cannon rush needs atleast 2 pylons for block, which brings the investment to 350 minerals (cannon+2 pylons, if there are 2 cannons even better), so you lose equal funds, but cannon rushing sets protoss back a lot. Any potential follow-ups or all-ins will be severely delayed, you should have enough time to establish complete map control and have enough of stuff to stop anything, just don't forget to scout.

[Wass]

I agree with the above two posts. You should also start dronescouting more overall, as it will be needed on higher levels. Dronescouting at your natural halfway through the hatch buildingtime is advisable.

[Deleted]

In Gold league: ignore cannon rush+natural, get pool asap, take 3rd and 3 queens. roach up to ~10 and push. transition to midgame and be prepared for standard DTs afterwards.

Cannon Rush can be deadly, but in Gold League no one can execute it good enough. Just don't panik.

[Blackdecker]

Thanks for the replys. I really need to drone scouting more and don't panic vs the cannons.

Sunday, I played the qualifiers for an unnoficial brazilian championship(Link Here), my first match was vs a master(yeah lucky!) and he cannon rushed me. Im gonna post the replay below so you guys can see the match.

Link to replay: http://drop.sc/305688

After reading what you guys said and watching the replay again I noticied so many wrong things. I took so long to take a third, didn't make a Roach Haren, no drone scout, spent so many minerals trying to destroy the cannons and mostly, put the spawning pool in the worst position ever.

Thanks again and gonna let you guys updated about the cannons

[Millennía]

With the patch coming very soon - does the new units come with the patch or is that an expansion only thing?

Was looking a lot at Swarm Hosts and they look really powerful in decent numbers. I was just wondering - against what army comp would you use Swarm Hosts over Infestors? Or would you include a mix of both in your army?

[kel]

I just got back into sc2, won my first game to stay diamond. Anyone around diamond want to play some 1v1s? I want to get back into the flow of things

[Shinzai]

With the patch coming very soon - does the new units come with the patch or is that an expansion only thing?

Was looking a lot at Swarm Hosts and they look really powerful in decent numbers. I was just wondering - against what army comp would you use Swarm Hosts over Infestors? Or would you include a mix of both in your army?

Swarm Host is really effective against a number of ground army types, but is hugely dependant on being defended. Infestors work well with swarm hosts - pinning units in place while the swarm attacks from further back. The alternative to using Infestors is using Vipers for the whole death-grip deal, into the middle of your own army. However, a lot of pro players just suddenly stopped using Infestors after seeing just how nerfed they are, but they remain almost an essential control unit, for say breaking up a MMM(Or MMHBM) by keeping Medivacs out of range, or whatever need be.

For an example of how the pressure has swapped in early game between Zerg and other races and how Swarm Hosts can help contain opponents, check out this ZvT, LiquidTLO vs a barcode name player of pretty high quality.



Also, I'd recommend checking out ROOTCatZ, he's pretty much insane and one of the most innovative Zerg players out there.

[cudomix]

Check Ret vs Feast (http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list...2n5GxFoeG83kFe), Ret shows some decent Swarm Host potential vs protoss at least. They will continue to be of limited utility vs terran I fear, scans and mobility of bio, or cloaked banshees with couple vikings to kill overseers shut them down pretty hard.

Axslav does make a good point when he says that there's no point in keeping swarm hosts buried, they should be treated as siege weapons with 22 seconds firing time and 60 range, so some burrow micro will be needed to get the most of them.

[Wass]

I just got back into sc2, won my first game to stay diamond. Anyone around diamond want to play some 1v1s? I want to get back into the flow of things

If you have hots I'll oblige, but I'm not going back to wol for any reasons. Which race do you play?

I feel swarm hosts are a good way to buy time vs early terran mech. But later on you need hive tech (ultras/vipers) to counter it really well.

[cudomix]

Mutas are better imo, they force thors from terran which eat into tank numbers, couple tanks with hellion support (not hellbat, line attack is better for locusts) can minimize locust damage pretty well, worst case scenario terran just loses minerals which he has more than enough if going mech. No need to even commit to mutas too heavily, just 8-10 (Vortix style) will be enough to contain mech pretty well. Also, just watched MVP vs Curious where unsieged 3/3 tanks just rolled over anything zerg had, so I guess roach hydra with viper support while teching to broodlords would be better than ultras.

[Shinzai]

Mutas are better imo, they force thors from terran which eat into tank numbers, couple tanks with hellion support (not hellbat, line attack is better for locusts) can minimize locust damage pretty well, worst case scenario terran just loses minerals which he has more than enough if going mech. No need to even commit to mutas too heavily, just 8-10 (Vortix style) will be enough to contain mech pretty well. Also, just watched MVP vs Curious where unsieged 3/3 tanks just rolled over anything zerg had, so I guess roach hydra with viper support while teching to broodlords would be better than ultras.

I'll have to go ahead and say it just looked to me like Curious really isn't in the HotS mindset. Watching the games, he was simply destroyed by Hellbats with no swerving from the early speedling nonsense that's just so weak against Terran now. Most current HotS focused Zerg players make a handful of lings and immediately start switching over to roaches.

MVP on the other hand has been playing all the top players in HotS and it really shows. He has Curious under control from game one and never lets him take control of the following matches at any point onwards.

[-Zait-]

With the patch coming very soon - does the new units come with the patch or is that an expansion only thing?

Was looking a lot at Swarm Hosts and they look really powerful in decent numbers. I was just wondering - against what army comp would you use Swarm Hosts over Infestors? Or would you include a mix of both in your army?

Swarm Hosts are funny units. They're worthless if you have 5 or less, but very strong with 10+. Infestors are good at any time, but if you go swarm host+hydra in the mid game, before terran get a bunch of tanks or toss get a lot of colossi, they destroy.

[kel]

If you have hots I'll oblige, but I'm not going back to wol for any reasons. Which race do you play?

I feel swarm hosts are a good way to buy time vs early terran mech. But later on you need hive tech (ultras/vipers) to counter it really well.

I play protoss, Im not in the beta

[Shinzai]

Swarm Hosts are funny units. They're worthless if you have 5 or less, but very strong with 10+. Infestors are good at any time, but if you go swarm host+hydra in the mid game, before terran get a bunch of tanks or toss get a lot of colossi, they destroy.

Indeed, even after other races start stacking up their heavy hitters, Swarm Hosts in large amounts (around 10 or so) can create a defensive line that just cannot easily broken, with the added bonus of being free units getting tossed away, rather than actual supply. Combined with units such as Infestors or Vipers and using other Hive tech as the bulk of the army can create a truly formidable offence, which can be repositioned into a quick defense.

Not to mention their harass utility in just dumping say 3 or 4 near a distant expand and just keeping it under attack constantly.

We also have yet to see someone start using Spore Crawlers on a regular and deep basis. Spore Crawlers are probably the best detection unit the Zerg have now (as long as they're on creep) as they offer mobile drop defense, anti-air and detection, moving at 1.9 speed on creep, with way more HP than Overlords, not to mention they have no supply impact.

[Wass]

I play protoss, Im not in the beta

That's a shame. But toss is easy. Turtle and amove!

[Deleted]

That's a shame. But toss is easy. Turtle and amove!

By easy i guess you mean by far the most unforgiving micro race early to mid game. I guess with the A move comment ur just trolling ;D. Hope so.

[Noomz]

If anyone wants to play 3vAI you're welcome to add me, Creamyflames #2230
I'm an EU player by the way. Matchmaking is taking forever

But you better be up for Elite difficulty!

[Wass]

By easy i guess you mean by far the most unforgiving micro race early to mid game. I guess with the A move comment ur just trolling ;D. Hope so.

We all have different opinions. Yes, I was kidding around. But having played platinum on both Protoss and Terran I have no doubt which one I think is the hardest. Ofc varies from person to person.

(Don't bash on races, that's not the intention of this post as I want to keep the thread clean, feel free to share your opinion though.)