Harder Content = Better?

[judgementofantonidas]

He thinks everyone feels the same in that

Working harder = more rewarding.

When in fact many people feel differently about it.

Just because there are many people who would rather be pregnant with multiple father's children, on wellfare, and foodstamps for their entire adult life does not mean that this is inherantly human nature for the majority.

[Crashdummy]

I can't believe how many people in these threads willingly ignore the idea that any goal that takes effort / determination to achieve is almost always more inherently rewarding on a psychological level.

Maybe because many of us know that what you say its not always true?

Yes, many people find more challenging stuff to be more rewarding.

No, not ALL THE PEOPLE find more challenging stuff to be more rewarding.

Its in the human nature to take the easy path to achieve the goals that person wants, which should tell you something.

Anyway, different people enjoy and get their entertainment reward with different things. Maybe you should open your mind and understand that other people enjoy different things than you.

---------- Post added 2013-02-27 at 03:32 PM ----------

Just because there are many people who would rather be pregnant with multiple father's children, on wellfare, and foodstamps for their entire adult life does not mean that this is inherantly human nature for the majority.

Which has nothing to do with what is being discussed here...

[judgementofantonidas]

Maybe because many of us know that what you say its not always true?

Yes, many people find more challenging stuff to be more rewarding.

No, not ALL THE PEOPLE find more challenging stuff to be more rewarding.

Its in the human nature to take the easy path to achieve the goals that person wants, which should tell you something.

Anyway, different people enjoy and get their entertainment reward with different things. Maybe you should open your mind and understand that other people enjoy different things than you.

---------- Post added 2013-02-27 at 03:32 PM ----------




Which has nothing to do with what is being discussed here...

I have had an epiphone. You have converted me. I DO take the easy path. I surround myself by other skilled players.

[Orange Joe]

Well, it is common sense and what our life is based off of. If something is extremely simple to do, everyone can do it easily and does it...that cannot be rewarding in itself. Hiow could it be? ( IE - I did one sit up for one day...now give me my flashy abs..doesnt work that way)

---------- Post added 2013-02-27 at 06:30 PM ----------



Are you fucking serious? You meant that? Ok, have a great day looks like we are done. Later.

Funny I find it rewarding to make a job as easy as possible. Maybe I'm alone in this but I know I have heard this saying from many people growwing up


Work smarter not harder.


And I guess bye.

---------- Post added 2013-02-27 at 01:35 PM ----------

Just because there are many people who would rather be pregnant with multiple father's children, on wellfare, and foodstamps for their entire adult life does not mean that this is inherantly human nature for the majority.

Not sure where you are going with this or what it has to do with wow so I'm not even going to bother with it.

[Osmeric]

I can't believe how many people in these threads willingly ignore the idea that any goal that takes effort / determination to achieve is almost always more inherently rewarding on a psychological level.

This argument leaves out the obvious: that the difficult challenges are inherently more rewarding... IF they are completed.

But the more difficult they are, the fewer people will complete them. So, for many people (increasing in number as the challenge increases), making the content more difficult doesn't increase the reward, it reduces it.

This kind of "cater to the elite" game design is superficially attractive, but only because most people wrongly overestimate their own competence, and so wrongly think they'll be in that elite.

[Orange Joe]

Where is that definition written? I was not aware that Blizzard has come out and defined what raiding is in black and white. With that definition, me going back to MC farming pets can be counted as raiding as well. Please post a link.

http://www.wowwiki.com/Raid


If you are in a raid instance killing raid bosses you are raiding.

[judgementofantonidas]

Funny I find it rewarding to make a job as easy as possible. Maybe I'm alone in this but I know I have heard this saying from many people growwing up


Work smarter not harder.


And I guess bye.

---------- Post added 2013-02-27 at 01:35 PM ----------




Not sure where you are going with this or what it has to do with wow so I'm not even going to bother with it.

exactly. you claim that because you support easier content because the will make you happy tha it must be the majority view. much like my analogy of people abusing the public welfare system.

[Orange Joe]

exactly. you claim that because you support easier content because the will make you happy tha it must be the majority view. much like my analogy of people abusing the public welfare system.

Where did I say any of this?

[Crashdummy]

I have had an epiphone. You have converted me. I DO take the easy path. I surround myself by other skilled players.

Not everyone does though. Humans have the will to do things that are against their instincst and their own nature. Its one of the things that make us unique as a specie.

But when you try to do Generalizations you end up making mistakes like the one the guy i quoted did.

I will give you a better example, when you go to see the Machu Pichu ruins in Peru, you can follow the Inca Path, which is going up the mountaing following a path that goes up for miles OR you can get up there with one of those electrical chairs than hang on steel wires used to go up in mountains (sorry, the name escapes my mind right now).

Some people choose the Inca path, others chooce the chairs because they dont enjoy walking for miles and miles. Both get to enjoy the ruins.

[judgementofantonidas]

originally posed by you a few responses above this one


Funny I find it rewarding to make a job as easy as possible. Maybe I'm alone in this but I know I have heard this saying from many people growwing up


Work smarter not harder.


And I guess bye.

[Orange Joe]

originally posed by you a few responses above this one


Funny I find it rewarding to make a job as easy as possible. Maybe I'm alone in this but I know I have heard this saying from many people growwing up


Work smarter not harder.


And I guess bye.

Where is the word majority in that post?

[judgementofantonidas]

Not everyone does though. Humans have the will to do things that are against their instincst and their own nature. Its one of the things that make us unique as a specie.

But when you try to do Generalizations you end up making mistakes like the one the guy i quoted did.

I will give you a better example, when you go to see the Machu Pichu ruins in Peru, you can follow the Inca Path, which is going up the mountaing following a path that goes up for miles OR you can get up there with one of those electrical chairs than hang on steel wires used to go up in mountains (sorry, the name escapes my mind right now).

Some people choose the Inca path, others chooce the chairs because they dont enjoy walking for miles and miles. Both get to enjoy the ruins.

Do they both get a gold coin or any kind of reward other than simply seeing the ruins?

---------- Post added 2013-02-27 at 01:44 PM ----------

Where is the word majority in that post?

it is a repetative theme in your recent posts.

"He thinks everyone feels the same in that

Working harder = more rewarding.

When in fact many people feel differently about it."

[Crashdummy]

Do they both get a gold coin or any kind of reward other than simply seeing the ruins?

Well, they both can buy things up there, the point is, both get the same "rewards", except some people find it more enjoyable to do it the "hard way" of getting up there by walking for miles, and others that dont enjoy that way have the other way and get the same rewards.

Hint: those walkign for miles dont ask the chairs to be removed nor they ask parts of the ruins to be innsaccesible for those going up by chairs.

[wow2011]

http://www.wowwiki.com/Raid


If you are in a raid instance killing raid bosses you are raiding.

I asked for a blue response where they stated Blizzard's stance on the definition of raiding because you claimed your definition is Blizzard's definition. If you got your definition from wowwiki then please don't dress it up as "Blizzard's definition". Blizzard doesn't maintain wowwiki.

I am also surprised to find out that you think soloing MC boss is raiding while getting 40+ people together killing an outdoor boss is not considered raiding.

[judgementofantonidas]

Well, they both can buy things up there, the point is, both get the same "rewards", except some people find it more enjoyable to do it the "hard way" of getting up there by walking for miles, and others that dont enjoy that way have the other way and get the same rewards.

Hint: those walkign for miles dont ask the chairs to be removed nor they ask parts of the ruins to be innsaccesible for those going up by chairs.

although I loved your analogy it really would not apply to the discussion of raiding in wow unless you included such things as the prep time to be fit enough to walk the stairs as opposed to the lack of doing so for the free ride, some form of equal recognition to both groups of people by their peers, and a reward that is earned by the one and not by the other.

sort of like the walkers earned thier raid boss kill.

the riders bought a carry by purchasing the ticket to the trolley ie bought a kill from a guild farming content.

[Tomana]

I have had an epiphone.

What does a musical instrument manufacturer have to do with WoW?
Unless you mean an epiphany. XD

[Orange Joe]

I asked for a blue response where they stated Blizzard's stance on the definition of raiding because you claimed your definition is Blizzard's definition. If you got your definition from wowwiki then please don't dress it up as "Blizzard's definition". Blizzard doesn't maintain wowwiki.

I am also surprised to find out that you think soloing MC boss is raiding while getting 40+ people together killing an outdoor boss is not considered raiding.

There isn't a blue response on that. Blizzard has not officially defined raiding themselves.


As to the second part. Where did I say it wasn't? I'm sure that would fall under killing raid bosses meaning yes it would be raiding.

[judgementofantonidas]

What does a musical instrument manufacturer have to do with WoW?
Unless you mean an epiphany. XD

you are correct. i misspelled. Although there is a lot of horn tooting going on here. Whoopsy!!

[Grogo]

Why not just go into a raid instance, push a button that kills boss, collect loot? Because it is fucking ridiculous.

[Crashdummy]

although I loved your analogy it really would not apply to the discussion of raiding in wow unless you included such things as the prep time to be fit enough to walk the stairs as opposed to the lack of doing so for the free ride, some form of equal recognition to both groups of people by their peers, and a reward that is earned by the one and not by the other.

sort of like the walkers earned thier raid boss kill.

the riders bought a carry by purchasing the ticket to the trolley ie bought a kill from a guild farming content.

The "boss kill" is getting to the ruins, and both do get equal recognition by all people around there.

About the extra rewards, thats kind of my point, there is no extra reward even when some people take the "hard" path and others the "easy" path, and everyone3 is ok with that. Those doing the "hard" way dont ask for extra recognition or reward, they do it just because they enjoy doing it that way, and the others dont do it the hard way because they dont enjoy doing it that way.

Not everyone enjoys doing things the hard way, nor all the hard ways to do things are more rewarding to everyone.

The point is, to each their own, and what the others do or how other people feel more rewarding should not care to you.