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  1. #561
    I hope for a huge sub drop that'll make Blizzard reconsider dropping 5-mans and adding too many dailys.

  2. #562
    Quote Originally Posted by Florena View Post
    I'm fine with this. I'm always bored with the new dungeons within a week of them coming out anyway. And with lfr, they're no longer neccisary for catching up people for the new raid tier.

    ---------- Post added 2013-03-10 at 01:17 PM ----------



    Speaking as a prot paladin tank, back in bc much of the 5 mans were indeed reduced to aoe grinds once I had gear. =P
    I was a protection warrior, and up until I was forced to do shattered halls with no cc I sucked at aoe tanking. Loved being replaced by prot pallies for heroics lol.

  3. #563
    I am Murloc! Seefer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Theendgamelv3 View Post
    Since WOTLK? So you are saying most raids since LK where bad? I disagree with this and not only that, it isn't even comparable. What if Blizzard said no new raids til next expansion? That is comparable. I agree people race through the instances, but if given a choice I bet people would want new instances to race through.



    This isn't any different then what it is now. You run LFR over and over again. You run dailies over and over again. Some people run dungeons over and over again to help with getting VP capped. People get unlucky in drops with LFR, it is by far the biggest complaint LFR has. Release dungeons that are a little lower in ilvl than LFR so people don't gear up so quickly, to make those people who aren't getting gear in LFR happy and since they still need LFR, they would run that too. After they get gear from the new dungeons, they will have more variation in dungeon queue if they want to run dungeons for VP. I don't know about you, I don't mind having more different dungeons in queue and for me personally after running the same 3 instances over and over again, it will make me miss the older ones and wouldn't mind getting those again for VP.
    Wtf are you talking about? I LOVED that they didn't drop welfare epics, I loathed that about WOTLK! What I was saying was the person wanted days like BC and Vanilla, and then on another note say he wanted epics from 5 mans so his time felt rewarded and stated he was contradicting himself.

  4. #564
    I just recently came back for the patch, but I will tell you all what has kept me quitting and never sticking to the game lately.

    I've been playing a monk since beta, and on live... and I can't seem to get an alt geared. I literally try and I just can't. I'm sorry but extra rep doesn't mean shit when you get 200 rep for a daily and then an extra 100. I'm sorry but 625 valor for an item as opposed to 1250 still only nets you 1 item a week as opposed to one item every two weeks, etc. Not to mention I'm sitting on a valor cap because I don't have the rep. And what? Instead of new dungeons to catch people up with gear, you STILL make it tedious as all hell to obtain PAST PATCH rep gear? No increase in LFR drop gear? Not even getting into waiting 40 minutes to a raid only for it to a) fail or b) only get you one boss and have to wait ANOTHER 40 minutes for the same raid. You can't find pug raids because you don't have the gear, you can't find pug raids because you don't have the boss kills, you can't find a guild because you have no experience. All in all, until they make it easier to gear up alts, I'm done with this game. They've admitted it's a problem, so I'm hopeful someday I'll play again.
    Last edited by chocobo606; 2013-03-10 at 06:58 PM.

  5. #565
    Quote Originally Posted by Seefer View Post
    Wtf are you talking about? I LOVED that they didn't drop welfare epics, I loathed that about WOTLK! What I was saying was the person wanted days like BC and Vanilla, and then on another note say he wanted epics from 5 mans so his time felt rewarded and stated he was contradicting himself.
    5 mans dropped epics in BC.

  6. #566
    Quote Originally Posted by chocobo606 View Post
    I just recently came back for the patch, but I will tell you all what has kept me quitting and never sticking to the game lately.

    I've been playing a monk since beta, and on live... and I can't seem to get an alt geared. I literally try and I just can't. I'm sorry but extra rep doesn't mean shit when you get 200 rep for a daily and then an extra 100. I'm sorry but 625 valor for an item as opposed to 1250 still only nets you 1 item a week as opposed to one item every two weeks, etc. Not to mention I'm sitting on a valor cap because I don't have the rep. And what? Instead of new dungeons to catch people up with gear, you STILL make it tedious as all hell to obtain PAST PATCH rep gear? No increase in LFR drop gear? Not even getting into waiting 40 minutes to a raid only for it to a) fail or b) only get you one boss and have to wait ANOTHER 40 minutes for the same raid. You can't find pug raids because you don't have the gear, you can't find pug raids because you don't have the boss kills, you can't find a guild because you have no experience. All in all, until they make it easier to gear up alts, I'm done with this game. They've admitted it's a problem, so I'm hopeful someday I'll play again.
    1) they significantly increased the chance to get loot from LFR in the 5.0 raids. I have gotten 10 or so items on two alts just on heart of fear/terrace LFR on alts.
    2)the only thing I agree with you on is the rep requirement for previous gear. That should have been stripped with the valor gear price reduction. I do dailys on two toons, I refuse to do it on my third toon and any other toon I get to 90.
    3)with #2 said, you haven't played much since 5.1 happened if you're complaining about the rep gains. At revered you have a bind on account 100% increase in rep with that specific rep. It works cross server. I got to revered with klaxxi by questing in dread wastes then exalted 3 days later on my alt. I got revered with Golden Lotus in a lot less time, and honored with shado pan just on quests. I hit revered with them two days after I hit revered with Golden Lotus. Rep is exceptionally easy to get now so while dailys suck It's a TON lesspainful to grind rep(which I am agreeing with you shouldnt be the case for 5.0 gear) Shieldwall/horde equivalent should still require rep however.
    4)I agree with the issues with LFR only on the queueing in and getting the final boss, then having to queue again to get the first two. There should be serious ramifications for quitting LFR early, It's beyond annoying to have to queue for a section potentially six times on my three toons because people leave for whatever reason.
    5) all your other reasons aren't anything new to this game. No experience = no go. You are expecting a 16/16 guild to take you when you have zero experience...With the way the game is migrating to 10s, every person knowing what they are doing is almost essential. 25s is a little more lenient to an extent. You need to find a guild that's not that far into the content, not expect a full clear guild to take you in. It's called progression. And hey you may enjoy this newer guild more than you ever would that full clear guild.

  7. #567
    Quote Originally Posted by happyzod View Post
    5 mans dropped epics in BC.
    5 man epics were about as rare as current ones are in BC and half of the BC heroics were actually hard(SH, Arc, SV, SL, Durn, BM etc).

  8. #568
    Quote Originally Posted by purebalance View Post
    5 man epics were about as rare as current ones are in BC and half of the BC heroics were actually hard(SH, Arc, SV, SL, Durn, BM etc).
    Each five man epic in BC had a 10-15% chance to drop. They were not rare.

  9. #569
    Quote Originally Posted by Daedelus View Post
    If you enjoy running 5-mans, you're in a tiny minority. For anyone that raids (and why would you run dungeons if you don't intend to raid?) then they are there purely for a fairly efficient way to get 80VP.
    See, i don't get it. Somehow everything up to raiding is apparently only good to prepare you for raiding but raiding itself is somehow perfectly ok on it's own. Is it so difficult to imagine that doesn't raid draws this ending line one level lower?
    Why do people in 5-mans better loot ? Why do raiders better loot ? If ToT is balanced for Ilvl 502 then what do you need Ilvl 522 loot for ? To get through there easier ? Same thing with the people who don't raid.

    ---------- Post added 2013-03-10 at 09:17 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by purebalance View Post
    5 man epics were about as rare as current ones are in BC and half of the BC heroics were actually hard(SH, Arc, SV, SL, Durn, BM etc).
    Ever been to Magister's Terrace ?

  10. #570
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    Quote Originally Posted by happyzod View Post
    5 mans dropped epics in BC.
    I thought only the last boss dropped epics. The rest was all rare though.

  11. #571
    new 5 mans that give out raid-level gear is just not right. you SHOULD have to progress throug previous tiers to reach the current one

  12. #572
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    Quote Originally Posted by b0sanac View Post
    Not like dungeons are remotely useful anyway. People level to 90, farm dungeons for gear and from then the dungeons just sorta sit there cause no-one besides new players need gear from them.
    At present, that definitely seems to be the case, but I think it's more of a problem with the gearing model than a problem with the idea of new dungeons per se.

  13. #573
    Why should Blizzard make actual content? They consider dailies "content".

  14. #574
    Quote Originally Posted by Hardstyler01 View Post
    I thought only the last boss dropped epics. The rest was all rare though.
    In normal yes, in heroic all drops are epic.

  15. #575
    The one thing which would make me play again was 5 mans. Good job blizz.

  16. #576
    Quote Originally Posted by alturic View Post
    Just out of curiosity why exactly do people feel new 5-mans are needed?
    Because people are still 'forced' into those dungeons to cap valor and we're getting SO tired of them.

    Even people in 500+ gear are doing them still. It's a completely fucked up system as it stands. I'd love new 5mans just for some fresh air.

  17. #577
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    This should have been expected. LFR has replaced the need for Five-mans to fill in a gear gap between major patches. Next month we'll have 8 separate LFR queues. 5.4 hits and we may see up to 12. It's unsurprising that 5-mans are not being planned.

  18. #578
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Daedelus View Post
    How many new 5 mans were added in TBC? One. The model now is closer to TBC than it has ever been.
    If you don't like LFR, don't do it. The progression then is identical to TBC: 5 man normals -> 5 man heroics -> tier 14 raids -> tier 15 raids -> tier 16 raids
    I was talking about the expansion as a whole

    Burning Crusade 5 mans:
    Hellfire Ramparts, Blood Furnace, Slave Pens, Underbog, Mana Tombs, Auchenai Crypts, Sethekk Halls, The Streamvault, Shattered Halls, Durnholde, Mechanar, Botanica, Arcatraz, Black Morass & later added Magisters Terrace. That's 15 in total. Compare that with MoP's 8, 3 of which are re-vamps.

    And the point I was really making that the gear from the MoP 5 mans suck balls. The best gear pre-raiding comes from those terribly dailies, and scenarios in their current state offer no challenge and are just plain boring. They feel like extended quests to me. 5 mans have been the back bone of WoW since it's inception I see no reason to de-value them or to throw them away all together.

  19. #579
    Quote Originally Posted by Hardstyler01 View Post
    I thought only the last boss dropped epics. The rest was all rare though.
    Yes, the last boss dropped epics, it was fairly common to have an epic drop from the last boss in TBC. It is entirely different from the current model. I believe the drop rate for current epics mirrors vanilla drop rates for epics in 5 mans, not tbc drop rates.

    ---------- Post added 2013-03-10 at 10:27 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Bulletnips View Post
    I was talking about the expansion as a whole

    Burning Crusade 5 mans:
    Hellfire Ramparts, Blood Furnace, Slave Pens, Underbog, Mana Tombs, Auchenai Crypts, Sethekk Halls, The Streamvault, Shattered Halls, Durnholde, Mechanar, Botanica, Arcatraz, Black Morass & later added Magisters Terrace. That's 15 in total. Compare that with MoP's 8, 3 of which are re-vamps.

    And the point I was really making that the gear from the MoP 5 mans suck balls. The best gear pre-raiding comes from those terribly dailies, and scenarios in their current state offer no challenge and are just plain boring. They feel like extended quests to me. 5 mans have been the back bone of WoW since it's inception I see no reason to de-value them or to throw them away all together.
    Not to mention that much of the MOP 5mans reuse content. Gate of the setting sun, jade serpent, and nuizio temple reuse content already in the game.

  20. #580
    Quote Originally Posted by happyzod View Post
    Yes, the last boss dropped epics, it was fairly common to have an epic drop from the last boss in TBC. It is entirely different from the current model. I believe the drop rate for current epics mirrors vanilla drop rates for epics in 5 mans, not tbc drop rates.

    ---------- Post added 2013-03-10 at 10:27 PM ----------



    Not to mention that much of the MOP 5mans reuse content. Gate of the setting sun, jade serpent, and nuizio temple reuse content already in the game.
    They did that so you could actually get a feel for the architecture and feel for the instance. They don't reuse them in the slightest.

    If people actually payed attention to the level of detail in the Mists dungeons, they'd see how more fleshed out and original the are than most dungeons in WoW's history, with nothing reused within them.
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