Nazgrim

[alexday14]

Maybe he's pulling a Severus Snape on us all, and is a sleeper agent within the New Horde, working on Vol'jin or Thrall's behalf. That'd actually be pretty cool, imo, but I don't have the lore knowledge to back this up and make it sound feasible.

Could this happen? Could he only be infiltrating the New Horde to help us get to Garrosh in those final moments where it will count the most?

This isn't the case, no. He's a raid boss, we're not going to kill him for working with us, are we?

[Deleted]

The fallen protectors dungeon journal entry states that at 1% hp they snap out of it, Nazgrim's doesn't mention anything like that. Looks like we are killing him, not gonna enjoy this

[furriusmurrius]

This isn't the case, no. He's a raid boss, we're not going to kill him for working with us, are we?

Maybe you are unfamiliar with the Harry Potter franchise; Severus Snape literally has to kill the greatest good at Hogwarts to assure the rest of the world that he is, in fact, a bad guy, and at the final stretch of the series he dies at the hand of his supposed leader, giving Harry the information he needed to press on with his task.

So him being a raid boss does not exclude my theory, no.

[Gorefiend 1]

Nazgrim is a loyal Orc, loyal to the Horde he protected and served with his blood and tears. He is not a filthy traitor like Vol'jin or his Trolls. He will fall in battle, protecting the one he sworn his oath to.

This makes you think: An Orc with honor and dignity siding with Hellscream. Maybe he isn't that bad.
I hope it makes the traitors and backstabbers feel guilty of their actions. The Horde, Garrosh's Horde, are not monsters.

[Sesto]

Nazgrim is basically like the Kingsguard during Robert's Rebellion in ASOIAF. The Kingsguard swore an oath to protect the King, and even when he turned insane and the lords rebelled against him, they continued to serve the King until death. (excluding Jaime, who betrayed his oath and was forever hated for it, and Barristan, who did not die).

Nazgrim swore an oath, and he is not going to break that oath. I am sure he does not condone what Garrosh has done, but his honor is obviously the most important thing to him.

[Trassk]

Don't blame Gweenz. All we've seen from big bads in the past 5 years is that they can't be held accountable for their own actions, because, corrupted. This is a new and novel concept for many WoW players - that an enemy can be bad simply because hes bad and doesn't like the color of your skin.

Not just that, but it being a character people thought they knew, but showing they didn't know the character at all and its a shock when they reveal there true colors.

---------- Post added 2013-06-13 at 01:39 AM ----------

Nazgrim is basically like the Kingsguard during Robert's Rebellion in ASOIAF. The Kingsguard swore an oath to protect the King, and even when he turned insane and the lords rebelled against him, they continued to serve the King until death. (excluding Jaime, who betrayed his oath and was forever hated for it, and Barristan, who did not die).

Nazgrim swore an oath, and he is not going to break that oath. I am sure he does not condone what Garrosh has done, but his honor is obviously the most important thing to him.

Really, that just makes him into a tool. You think about the first horde and how it was formed, and how blackhand was the puppet warchief all were meant to serve. And yet, characters like Durotan, Draka and Orgrim opposed him, Orgrim even taking the title from him.
They knew blackhand was corrupt and his actions spelled ill for the horde, and they acted upon it. Simply being loyal all the time when what your are loyal too goes against everything you stand for doesn't make you a good soldier, if Nazgrim was to act as a true warrior of the horde, he would know what the true horde really means, not following his current corrupt leader.

[alexday14]

Maybe you are unfamiliar with the Harry Potter franchise; Severus Snape literally has to kill the greatest good at Hogwarts to assure the rest of the world that he is, in fact, a bad guy, and at the final stretch of the series he dies at the hand of his supposed leader, giving Harry the information he needed to press on with his task.

So him being a raid boss does not exclude my theory, no.

Well, Nazgrim hasn't done anything to prove that he's either a 'good or bad' character. He's simply a man following orders, he has a good sense of honour and he will fight for the Orc sat in Grommash Hold until he dies.

So the idea that he's undercover itself would be a stretch at best, though the fact that he's a raid boss is telling us that there's nothing going on behind the scenes with him. He's going to serve as the last line of defence and will die doing so.

It's painful, irritating and upsetting. But in all honesty, if Nazgrim is going out, this is the way to do it.

[CrittenMitten]

I am not looking forward killing him...man this is sad

[Netherspark]

Do you think theres any hope that after we fight him, he'll come around and realize his warchiefs a monster?

He probably knows it already, but he's too loyal to the horde to disobey his warchief.

I imagine his dying words (or defeated words) will be something like telling us to stop Garrosh.

[Orkwuzhere]

He treats you like a soldier? Big shocker there, considering you are in fact a soldier.

You'd think you'd be seen as some kind of epic hero with you stopping a bug invasion, an emo elf that became a demon, an undead manchild who tried to raise an undead army in the north pole, and a fuck off dragon in Azeroth.

Nope, you're just a soldier even to Orc Jesus and friends. I guess everybody has amnesia with each expansion.

"Great Laser Chicken, you saved Azeroth fro-Go to Panda Land, and take over shit for me. What was I talking about again?" - Garrosh/Wrynn

[Gorefiend 1]

Thinking he won't die is just silly. This Orc is loyal to the core. Civil war isn't pretty, and even your friends may be enemies. He's supporting the right side, Hellscream's side, and not the treasonous, rebellion idiots. He will die as a true Orc, bound by honor and loyalty.

[Dybia]

Nazgrim is a loyal Orc, loyal to the Horde he protected and served with his blood and tears. He is not a filthy traitor like Vol'jin or his Trolls. He will fall in battle, protecting the one he sworn his oath to.

This makes you think: An Orc with honor and dignity siding with Hellscream. Maybe he isn't that bad.
I hope it makes the traitors and backstabbers feel guilty of their actions. The Horde, Garrosh's Horde, are not monsters.

http://media.mmo-champion.com/images...roshHulked.jpg

Looks like a monster to me. Hey, if it looks like a monster, talks like a monster, and acts like a monster...it's a monster. Honor and dignity don't mean much when you're fighting for a cause you don't understand in the service of a genocidal monster that's shown less and less remorse as things have progressed. A soldier of the warchief or not, he had a choice to make with every order he was given. Only blind fools put that much value into oaths sworn to whoever happens to be seated in a rank instead of the group itself. If his 'honor' is that important to him, he can just die for it. Because it's either leave Garrosh or die for him at this point. Garrosh has shown if you so much as question his tactics him or his little sycophant will blow up the inn you're staying at. There's no honor in being the blindly obedient idiot OR the maniacal piece of trash Garrosh requires in members of his horde.

[Bashok]

Thinking he won't die is just silly. This Orc is loyal to the core. Civil war isn't pretty, and even your friends may be enemies. He's supporting the right side, Hellscream's side, and not the treasonous, rebellion idiots. He will die as a true Orc, bound by honor and loyalty.

... an orc LOYAL to the HORDE is a orc LOYAL to the principles that the HORDE stands for... the Horde of garrosh its not the HORDE... he swore loyalty to...

[iamthedevil]

... an orc LOYAL to the HORDE is a orc LOYAL to the principles that the HORDE stands for... the Horde of garrosh its not the HORDE... he swore loyalty to...

He is loyal to the Warchief.

[Bashok]

He is loyal to the Warchief.

So its an slave then? a mindless puppy... thats nice... i hope he dies in a horrible way then for being a brainless orc

[leaks]

If he does die I have to applaud Blizzard. There's not a much better way they could show the results of war, especially civil war. Killing someone who refers to you as "old friend" is exactly the type of heartache you're going to have to deal with in a civil war. I'm glad to see bosses we know and have a connection to instead of another generic collection of black and white bad guys no has ever heard of before. I've always wanted Nazgrim to make it, he's a favorite of mine. Having reservations about killing him is exactly why this is great to me, I actually care.

[alexday14]

... an orc LOYAL to the HORDE is a orc LOYAL to the principles that the HORDE stands for... the Horde of garrosh its not the HORDE... he swore loyalty to...

The principles of an Orc at heart is loyalty and honour. Betraying your warchief and your people isn't honourable, or loyal. Gorefiend 1 has a damn good point, even if Nazgrim doesn't agree with Garrosh, he swore loyalty to him and he'll fight by his side.

[Bashok]

If he does die I have to applaud Blizzard. There's not a much better way they could show the results of war, especially civil war. Killing someone who refers to you as "old friend" is exactly the type of heartache you're going to have to deal with in a civil war. I'm glad to see bosses we know and have a connection to instead of another generic collection of black and white bad guys no has ever heard of before. I've always wanted Nazgrim to make it, he's a favorite of mine. Having reservations about killing him is exactly why this is great to me, I actually care.

I dont think he will die... i think it will fight us just for show to then helping us getting to thrall to release him and beating up garrosh

If he does die I have to applaud Blizzard. There's not a much better way they could show the results of war, especially civil war. Killing someone who refers to you as "old friend" is exactly the type of heartache you're going to have to deal with in a civil war. I'm glad to see bosses we know and have a connection to instead of another generic collection of black and white bad guys no has ever heard of before. I've always wanted Nazgrim to make it, he's a favorite of mine. Having reservations about killing him is exactly why this is great to me, I actually care.

There is no honor in doing things which you are against to... only because the warchief went mad... its like calling Jaime Lannister a honorless man for betraying the mad king and saving king´s landing...

Part of the Honor is being loyalty but a bigger part is doing what you think is right and dont do honorless things... how so following a honorless orc ( garrosh ) is a honorable duty and a decent way to die... I JUST DONT SEE IT

[leaks]

I dont think he will die... i think it will fight us just for show to then helping us getting to thrall to release him and beating up garrosh

Maybe, and I kind of hope you're right. I just can't complain if he does because I can see the benefit of it story wise and I think that kind of emotional investment in boss fights is lacking in a lot of cases. It's nice to have bosses that aren't clearly evil loot pinatas bent on destroying the world.

[kinderfield]

Damn you blizzard damn you to hell