A Death Knight's veiw of classes this season.

[Propainn]

Ive been using this: http://www.arenamate.net/
as it seems to have a pretty accurate representation and is constantly changing to match what people are saying which makes sense.

- There are nearly no holy paladins ANYWHERE over 2200. Its nearly all ret.
- I include hunters in melee because they play like a 40 yrd range melee more than a caster and they don't cast. Are we just sitting them out for any melee vs. caster discussion?
- Warriors are by far the lowest melee (outside monks which is to be expected since its still pretty new), rogues are doing ok in comparison.
- Priests are really dominant, can't really argue that, but I wonder how many of those spriests are actually disc on rating sites. Either way, looking at arenamate the dps specs go: Hunter (melee imo) > spriest > Mage = ele = ret = feral > dk. IMO its pretty balanced.
- I won't lie, the pure dps melee are pretty weak right now, melee hybrids and caster hybrids are both dominating. Its world of hybrid and hunter craft right now.
- Why is everyone so obsessed with the word meta to describe pvp?

My #s were right from the same site which does not show spec, so idk where you pulled that paladin stat from. In fact, go back to the exact site you just linked me and look at the ladders. At higher ratings, it's almost dead even, if not slightly favoring H Paladins. I'm not going to go down the entire ladder, but out of the top 50 teams containing a Paladin, 28 had an H Pal and 24 had Ret. This is between 2434-2708. At lower ratings it may change, but not by much. Please do not make things up when you link evidence that debunks your claims.

I'm going to just ignore your hunter comment because it's just ignorance. "Play like a 40yd range melee". I'll sit here quietly until you understand why that's an oxymoron.

Gotta love people with agendas.

Edit: Because the meta is the over-arching play style at the time (strategies, comp/class balance and popularity, etc) . TBC had a slow-paced, melee/caster/healer meta. WotLK had a fast-paced, caster/cleave dominated meta. Do you get it now?

[Hand Banana]

My #s were right from the same site which does not show spec, so idk where you pulled that paladin stat from. In fact, go back to the exact site you just linked me and look at the ladders. At higher ratings, it's almost dead even, if not slightly favoring H Paladins. I'm not going to go down the entire ladder, but out of the top 50 teams containing a Paladin, 28 had an H Pal and 24 had Ret. This is between 2434-2708. At lower ratings it may change, but not by much. Please do not make things up when you link evidence that debunks your claims.

I'm going to just ignore your hunter comment because it's just ignorance. "Play like a 40yd range melee". I'll sit here quietly until you understand why that's an oxymoron.

Gotta love people with agendas.

So what is a hunter then? Ive said what I think it is, what do you think it is? A caster? Ask a mage how they feel about hunters; they are essentially an unkitable melee with 100% uptime if you look at it from a caster perspective. They deal physical damage and autoattack, just like melee do. The only difference between all the melee specs and hunters is all of hunters abilities have range to them (look at dks and rets, half of their stuff is ranged already too), they much more resemble melee than casters.

And what are you talking about in the paladin specs? In both above 2200 and above 2400, US and Worldwide rets have a higher spec representation than holy. You say you don't know where I'm pulling my stats yet I'm reading them straight off of the top specs list.

Either way, we have gotten way off-topic since we aren't even talking about dks anymore. Dks really don't have anything to complain about except that lack of a solid burst defensive cd.

[Propainn]

So what is a hunter then? Ive said what I think it is, what do you think it is? A caster? Ask a mage how they feel about hunters; they are essentially an unkitable melee with 100% uptime if you look at it from a caster perspective. They deal physical damage and autoattack, just like melee do. The only difference between all the melee specs and hunters is all of hunters abilities have range to them (look at dks and rets, half of their stuff is ranged already too), they much more resemble melee than casters.

And what are you talking about in the paladin specs? In both above 2200 and above 2400, US and Worldwide rets have a higher spec representation than holy. You say you don't know where I'm pulling my stats yet I'm reading them straight off of the top specs list.

Either way, we have gotten way off-topic since we aren't even talking about dks anymore. Dks really don't have anything to complain about except that lack of a solid burst defensive cd.

Like I said, the top teams (2400+) are slightly favoring Holy (There are no graphs for 2400+ on the site, I checked. You have to count and it ends up 43 Holy 40 Ret 3 Prot, which are obviously PvE specs so at worst it's 50/50 even). Just like 2200 teams are slightly favoring ret. It's not "There are nearly no holy paladins ANYWHERE over 2200. Its nearly all ret" is the point I am trying to make. Ret isn't a "dominant spec" at 5% rep with holy at 3%. if Ret rep lowers 1% or holy rep rises 1% it's dead even. That's pretty balanced.

Hunters are a bastard class. They're not melee by definition, but they deal physical dmg and barely have to worry about a resource (focus management is lols) which is why they feel like a melee to an extent. BM feels so unpeelable because of how heavy the pets damage is. They are neither a caster nor a melee, why must they be bottlenecked into one of the two when they are neither?

[Hand Banana]

Like I said, the top teams (2400+) are slightly favoring Holy (There are no graphs for 2400+ on the site, I checked. You have to count and it ends up 43 Holy 40 Ret 3 Prot, which are obviously PvE specs so at worst it's 50/50 even). Just like 2200 teams are slightly favoring ret. It's not "There are nearly no holy paladins ANYWHERE over 2200. Its nearly all ret" is the point I am trying to make. Ret isn't a "dominant spec" at 5% rep with holy at 3%. if Ret rep lowers 1% or holy rep rises 1% it's dead even. That's pretty balanced.

This is true now that I look a bit more in depth into it, however I have to wonder how accurate rating sites are. I highly doubt a double hpally dk team is r1 on emberstorm US and rank 11 overall in the US. It looks more like hpally/dk/lock on the official bliz site with 2 diff hpallys playing so it skews the numbers, but I guess its good enough.

[achromatickang]

This is true now that I look a bit more in depth into it, however I have to wonder how accurate rating sites are. I highly doubt a double hpally dk team is r1 on emberstorm US and rank 11 overall in the US. It looks more like hpally/dk/lock on the official bliz site with 2 diff hpallys playing so it skews the numbers, but I guess its good enough.

Usually the Rank 1 on Emberstorm is piloted anyways. I actually knew the guy who bought Rank 1 on that Battle Group last season.

[Propainn]

This is true now that I look a bit more in depth into it, however I have to wonder how accurate rating sites are. I highly doubt a double hpally dk team is r1 on emberstorm US and rank 11 overall in the US. It looks more like hpally/dk/lock on the official bliz site with 2 diff hpallys playing so it skews the numbers, but I guess its good enough.

They're the best we've got. People logging out in PvE specs skews things, as you said the 2 diff H pallys skews things, but they give us a rough estimate, and that estimate is favoring ze wizards regardless. WE'RE ALL IN THIS TOGETHER MELEE