Poll: Opinion Game Store

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  1. #161
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cybran View Post
    Serious players pay constantly to keep their characters geared and ready for the new content. The casuals sub once or twice a year when a new raid/dungeon comes out and move on to other games in between patches.

    The raider pays around 3-4 more in sub fees than the casual yearly. Gearing the game towards the casuals is a huge mistake.
    As I said, money is money. There isn't enough content for casuals, that's why they are bailing between patches. They got bored.

    Spending time and resources on mini games, because the notion that "leveling isn't enough" left the game with a bugged UI and tedious grind fest quest.
    I take it you are talking about pet battles. That was created over a few weeks by the UI team. Nothing compared to the 5-man and raid dungeons which take months and months of full time work by the entire production staff.

    In my time playing wow we have helped dozens of returning players to gear up and be part of our team. When someone is actually serious and has friends in the game getting back on top of his game is not a problem. One of our tanks for example had 495-ish ilvl when he returned and now he clears tot heroic with us.
    Not everyone is as generous as you. There are many other there who rather not "waste time" on "old content".

  2. #162
    The Unstoppable Force Jessicka's Avatar
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    I'm going to say yes, because there's things like pets, mounts etc that would be just more convenient to buy in-game.

    I'm also not fussed about the XP bonus thing; a lot of players are already using Recruit a Friend for this purpose, so I really don't see any harm in removing a wall to an already existing paid service.

    They mentioned Lesser Charms being purchasable too. This is borderline with me. So long as there's a limit to how many Big Charms you can obtain each week, then it's not quite pay to win. Makes me a little uneasy though that player can skip 'grind', i.e. play less, do less, but still get a chance of greater reward. I think that's actually bordering on gambling and wonder what the legalities are with this. If it turned out to be legal in some countries and not others, it's not something that should be applied to that region as it's just flat out unfair.
    Last edited by Jessicka; 2013-07-11 at 08:57 AM.

  3. #163
    Quote Originally Posted by SodiumChloride View Post
    As I said, money is money. There isn't enough content for casuals, that's why they are bailing between patches. They got bored.
    There is more content for them than ever before, but it is just too accessible. They do LFR a couple of times, kill the last boss of the patch in "Coma mode" and quit. The game was dumbed down far too much already. They are not encouraged to do better and earn the best rewards in game. Blizzard created a whole under class of consumers and now they want to use the sense of entitlement of these players to make them PAY to skip effort and eventually the best rewards.

    Quote Originally Posted by SodiumChloride View Post
    I take it you are talking about pet battles. That was created over a few weeks by the UI team. Nothing compared to the 5-man and raid dungeons which take months and months of full time work by the entire production staff.
    There are loads of bugs with the UI. When i type /reload I get a "Release spirit" message. This has been going since last year and nothing is being done about it. At the same time we get PvP pet battles, new pets and other crap. You have to be extremely naive to believe that Pet battles don't bleed resources from the UI and Art teams.

    Quote Originally Posted by SodiumChloride View Post
    Not everyone is as generous as you. There are many other there who rather not "waste time" on "old content".
    We didn't do old content. We just took him on the farm bosses and force fed him gear, because people were confident that he was the reliable person we need.
    Last edited by Cybran; 2013-07-11 at 09:01 AM.

  4. #164
    Herald of the Titans Klingers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jessicka View Post
    I'm going to say yes, because there's things like pets, mounts etc that would be just more convenient to buy in-game.

    I'm also not fussed about the XP bonus thing; a lot of players are already using Recruit a Friend for this purpose, so I really don't see any harm in removing a wall to an already existing paid service.

    They mentioned Lesser Charms being purchasable too. This is borderline with me. So long as there's a limit to how many Big Charms you can obtain each week, then it's not quite pay to win. Makes me a little uneasy though that player can skip 'grind', i.e. play less, do less, but still get a chance of greater reward. I think that's actually bordering on gambling and wonder what the legalities are with this.
    I'm not worried about the store being there per se. I'm worried about the precident it'll set.

    I'll give you an example: Blizzard's devs get ready to roll out the next expansion. It's in early beta, most of the content's done, the XP curve has been designed and scaled to match the quest progression of the new zones.

    Then, a Activision Blizzard VP sees an opportunity to syphon back some of the 400-odd million Vivendi yanked out of ActiBlizzard to cover their failbusiness. He goes to the dev team, a month out from release, and utters these words:

    "Scale up the XP curve by 200%. Players will purchase our $10 per-character XP buff potions!"

    I'm with you on that last point 100%, but I'm also far more cynical. I fully expect our favourite game's parent company to think they can have their cake (paid subscriptions) and eat it too (F2P-style, gouge-for-everything cash shop). They won't just be selling you those charms, they'll be tweaking LFR drop rates to incentivize purchase, and they'll be sticking more time-sink mechanics on other aspects of the game "That the player can elect to bypass with an RMT purchase from their battle.net wallet".
    Last edited by Klingers; 2013-07-11 at 09:04 AM.
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  5. #165
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    I have made myself very clear in other threads, i just woke up, so i do this one without anger.
    I see it as a slippery slide, and i do not belive blizzard will do it well, if they add lesser charm boost, why would they not add honor or justice boost? Why would the buff the justice and honor gained later on, when they can just laugh at you and tell you to buy a 1 hour bonus potion, it would just be bad buiness, for them that is, since if it was not needed why would people do it.

  6. #166
    Quote Originally Posted by Zellviren View Post
    That's not what I said - please read my comment again.
    My question was aimed this part of your post " In fact, from a longer-term view, consider that the extra money generated from a convenient in-game shop is reinvested in development for the game. That's a win for everyone, really, assuming that's how said revenue is used (rather than just greedily pocketed)."

    Do you believe that based on past behaviour the money will be reinvested or greedily pocketed?

    Quote Originally Posted by ragemv View Post
    I have made myself very clear in other threads, i just woke up, so i do this one without anger.
    I see it as a slippery slide, and i do not belive blizzard will do it well, if they add lesser charm boost, why would they not add honor or justice boost? Why would the buff the justice and honor gained later on, when they can just laugh at you and tell you to buy a 1 hour bonus potion, it would just be bad buiness, for them that is, since if it was not needed why would people do it.
    I don't think that they will add honour or justice points to the cash shop however I would expect lesser charms to become more useful.

  7. #167
    Legendary! MasterHamster's Avatar
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    How many years have people speculated about p2w in WoW by now? Hm, when was That Retarded Horse™ released...

    There won't be any time when Blizzard directly sells something that directly, right then, makes your character stronger.
    I think people should check some actual P2W games (usually undeservedly popular flash/iOS/Android games) to see the extent P2W can go.
    Right now we have people arguing that buying charms is p2w, their logic eludes me.

    I'll gladly pay for +100% experience though. I like to level as fast as I can. Sue me.
    Last edited by MasterHamster; 2013-07-11 at 09:58 AM.
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  8. #168
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cybran View Post
    There is more content for them than ever before, but it is just too accessible. They do LFR a couple of times, kill the last boss of the patch in "Coma mode" and quit. The game was dumbed down far too much already. They are not encouraged to do better and earn the best rewards in game. Blizzard created a whole under class of consumers and now they want to use the sense of entitlement of these players to make them PAY to skip effort and eventually the best rewards.
    https://twitter.com/Ghostcrawler/sta...93830291095553

    You either provide content people are comfortable doing and want to do, or they leave.

    There are loads of bugs with the UI. When i type /reload I get a "Release spirit" message. This has been going since last year and nothing is being done about it. At the same time we get PvP pet battles, new pets and other crap. You have to be extremely naive to believe that Pet battles don't bleed resources from the UI and Art teams.
    It's a minor bug. Not exactly a high priority. They will have to dig through the code and figure out the problem, then make sure the solution doesn't create new problems. How do you know the fix isn't already in the works?

    Not to mention, the people responsible for the base UI code, hence the bug, might not even be the same people who made the pet battle system - UI programmer vs UI designer.

    We didn't do old content. We just took him on the farm bosses and force fed him gear, because people were confident that he was the reliable person we need.
    Farm bosses ... If you are stuck on the first few bosses? If other members of your raid still aren't fully geared?

  9. #169
    Quote Originally Posted by SodiumChloride View Post
    https://twitter.com/Ghostcrawler/sta...93830291095553

    You either provide content people are comfortable doing and want to do, or they leave.
    He will vigorously defend each of his bad decisions to the bitter end. All of this goes back to the sense of entitlement Blizzard devs crated when they told people that they "deserve to see content while it's current, because they pay as much as people that put effort". This kind of rhetoric has been poisoning the discussion and fueling the baseless claims of the casuals that they should get as much as everyone else, just because.
    Last edited by Cybran; 2013-07-11 at 10:00 AM.

  10. #170
    Quote Originally Posted by Cybran View Post
    He will vigorously defend each of his bad decisions to the bitter end. All of this goes back to the sense of entitlement Blizzard devs crated when they told people that they "deserve to see content while it's current, because they pay as much as people that put effort". This kind of rhetoric has been poisoning the discussion and fueling the baseless claims of the casuals that they should get as much as everyone else, just because.
    Here's an idea: Since the subscription is not optional, when you ding a certain number of toons to max level...you get an achievement. From there on out, any future toons you make will have the buff until you reach max level. There. No additional money spent beyond the monthly fee. But they won't do this...because of GREED. And I can see right now the store will eventually have the stuff that people right now don't want.

  11. #171
    I don't think it should come the US/EU realms yet. Let them try it in Asia and see how it does for them. I agree that it can quickly become a slippery slope if they start 'encouraging' use of cash shop items to give you what your sub should already be giving you. That's one thing if the game stops being sub-based and goes to the micro-transaction model, especially if you pay a sub and it basically compensates you what you'd be buying a'la carte anyways. But to do that while still expecting a sub to be paid is just...no.

  12. #172
    The Unstoppable Force Jessicka's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Klingers View Post
    I'm not worried about the store being there per se. I'm worried about the precident it'll set.

    I'll give you an example: Blizzard's devs get ready to roll out the next expansion. It's in early beta, most of the content's done, the XP curve has been designed and scaled to match the quest progression of the new zones.

    Then, a Activision Blizzard VP sees an opportunity to syphon back some of the 400-odd million Vivendi yanked out of ActiBlizzard to cover their failbusiness. He goes to the dev team, a month out from release, and utters these words:

    "Scale up the XP curve by 200%. Players will purchase our $10 per-character XP buff potions!"

    I'm with you on that last point 100%, but I'm also far more cynical. I fully expect our favourite game's parent company to think they can have their cake (paid subscriptions) and eat it too (F2P-style, gouge-for-everything cash shop). They won't just be selling you those charms, they'll be tweaking LFR drop rates to incentivize purchase, and they'll be sticking more time-sink mechanics on other aspects of the game "That the player can elect to bypass with an RMT purchase from their battle.net wallet".
    Well the XP bonus pot doesn't count in the new content, so it's a non-issue. It's actually a smaller bonus than the existing RaF promotion, and you don't get a mount either, so I'm just not seeing a slippery slope.

    Also, please don't talk like something bad must be "Activision Blizzard" as if anything good must be Blizzard alone; it's intrinsic and obvious bias that seriously undermines everything else you say :\

  13. #173
    Quote Originally Posted by MasterHamster View Post
    How many years have people speculated about p2w in WoW by now? Hm, when was That Retarded Horse™ released...

    There won't be any time when Blizzard directly sells something that directly, right then, makes your character stronger.
    I think people should check some actual P2W games (usually undeservedly popular flash/iOS/Android games) to see the extent P2W can go.
    Right now we have people arguing that buying charms is p2w, their logic eludes me.

    I'll gladly pay for +100% experience though. I like to level as fast as I can. Sue me.
    Yep, and now they stepped it up again. First a mount which is cosmetic (it was instantly useable on all your characters so not completely cosmetic) then a pet which you could sell on the AH so you were basically buying gold legally and now this. Besides that you have RaF, transfers and whatnot.
    Access to the store is now through the website but they want you to have access to it ingame so they are able to advertise more and lure more people into buying a pet.
    Slippery slope? NAAAAAHHHHHH! The more you accept the more they will push but that's how it works. If they can influence people to pay more then that is not their fault. This discussion will only help people to see a different side but you can also leave and ignore it and just take all the bs advertisement Blizzard is throwing at you and hand in your money if you like.

    If a 100% xp buff isn't an advantage then why would people buy it? It's not cosmetic and paying for seeing your character drink a potion (if it works like that) doesn't make sense either. So it must be an advantage to level faster. This means you are faster at level 90 than someone who does not spend real money. This means you will be able to obtain ingame currency and gear faster than the other person which makes you stronger.

    It doesn't matter how small the advantage is. Next time it's a 200% buff for the people who want to get rid of more money. Slight difference so who cares right?

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