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  1. #321
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    Quote Originally Posted by sandmoth12 View Post
    State rather you believe this or not and why.

    Personally, I do believe it. A person can have a brilliant mind or superior athletic prowess but still be held back their entire lives because they lack money.
    Maybe that is true. But most of the rich people have worked hard and earned their money. If you work/study enough you can change your lifestyle. That is my opinion.

  2. #322
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kerdoz View Post
    Maybe that is true. But most of the rich people have worked hard and earned their money. If you work/study enough you can change your lifestyle. That is my opinion.
    That's the big thing people don't realize sadly, they just see a rich guy and get jealous... It's just that they believe they deserve something they haven't worked for, typical human behavior, it's the smart ones that realize in the US anyone can "make it" with the right amount of effort.
    Hey everyone

  3. #323
    Quote Originally Posted by Aang View Post
    That's the big thing people don't realize sadly, they just see a rich guy and get jealous... It's just that they believe they deserve something they haven't worked for, typical human behavior, it's the smart ones that realize in the US anyone can "make it" with the right amount of effort.
    Except income elasticity is increasing in the US and it is already the worst in the western world. But hey, ignore stuff like reality because 'anyone can make it!', and 'Land of opportunity!', right?
    Quote Originally Posted by xanzul View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by obdigore View Post
    So if the states get together and work with the Legislative Branch to write an amendment to the federal constitution, you think the Judiciary (SCOTUS) could strike it down for being 'unconstitutional'?
    Uh...yes. Absolutely.

  4. #324
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    Quote Originally Posted by obdigore View Post
    Except income elasticity is increasing in the US and it is already the worst in the western world. But hey, ignore stuff like reality because 'anyone can make it!', and 'Land of opportunity!', right?
    But it really is, I went to a school (graduated this year) that had poor and rich kids. Our school is kind of in the middle of the rich areas and poor areas so we get a lot of kids from different parts. I saw quite a few poor kids go to college on scholarships, let me tell you something, anyone can make it if they put the effort in. Stop saying scienice mumbo jumbo because this isn't statistics, you want to know the real problem? The problem is motivating enough of these kids, regardless of social status, to want to work for their grades and get into a college. High school isn't even that hard, it's the kids who slack off and don't do anything are the ones that fail and drop out, not because of a lack money but because they don't care.

    High school is free, take advantage of it. Military is never a bad option afterwards, they pay for any form of schooling you want, hell there is ROTC in many colleges.

    EDIT: To clarify, I'm not saying science is stupid but when you pull out statistics, it doesn't always explain what the actual root of the problem is.
    Last edited by Duronos; 2013-07-22 at 05:07 AM.
    Hey everyone

  5. #325
    Quote Originally Posted by Aang View Post
    But it really is, I went to a school (graduated this year) that had poor and rich kids. Our school is kind of in the middle of the rich areas and poor areas so we get a lot of kids from different parts. I saw quite a few poor kids go to college on scholarships, let me tell you something, anyone can make it if they put the effort in. Stop saying scienice mumbo jumbo because this isn't statistics, you want to know the real problem? The problem is motivating enough of these kids, regardless of social status, to want to work for their grades and get into a college. High school isn't even that hard, it's the kids who slack off and don't do anything are the ones that fail and drop out, not because of a lack money but because they don't care.

    High school is free, take advantage of it. Military is never a bad option afterwards, they pay for any form of schooling you want, hell there is ROTC in many colleges.
    You really said 'science mumbo jumbo'? Really?

    Protip, Aang: 'science mumbo jumbo' > personal anecdotes.
    Quote Originally Posted by xanzul View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by obdigore View Post
    So if the states get together and work with the Legislative Branch to write an amendment to the federal constitution, you think the Judiciary (SCOTUS) could strike it down for being 'unconstitutional'?
    Uh...yes. Absolutely.

  6. #326
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    Quote Originally Posted by obdigore View Post
    You really said 'science mumbo jumbo'? Really?

    Protip, Aang: 'science mumbo jumbo' > personal anecdotes.
    Read the edit...

    Also personal anecdotes? I mean, do I really have to go and get a pen, study this for years? It doesn't take a smart person to realize that the kids that fail out just don't care about their future in the first place.

    To add on even more, much of science is done via observing (it's part of the scientific method right eh?).
    Hey everyone

  7. #327
    Quote Originally Posted by Cattaclysmic View Post
    What drugs are you taking. They seem potent...
    They aren't drugs man. They're self-discipline.

  8. #328
    Quote Originally Posted by Aang View Post
    Read the edit...

    Also personal anecdotes? I mean, do I really have to go and get a pen, study this for years? It doesn't take a smart person to realize that the kids that fail out just don't care about their future in the first place.

    To add on even more, much of science is done via observing (it's part of the scientific method right eh?).
    Yes, everyone who fails or doesn't succeed clearly just doesn't care about their future. Ignore actual identified causes of a lack of social mobility, and ignore all (actually measurable) data regarding it, and just assume, because it is easier that way, that the people who don't get 'rich' are just because they didn't care enough, right?
    Quote Originally Posted by xanzul View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by obdigore View Post
    So if the states get together and work with the Legislative Branch to write an amendment to the federal constitution, you think the Judiciary (SCOTUS) could strike it down for being 'unconstitutional'?
    Uh...yes. Absolutely.

  9. #329
    Elemental Lord Duronos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by obdigore View Post
    Yes, everyone who fails or doesn't succeed clearly just doesn't care about their future. Ignore actual identified causes of a lack of social mobility, and ignore all (actually measurable) data regarding it, and just assume, because it is easier that way, that the people who don't get 'rich' are just because they didn't care enough, right?
    I'm not trying to be rude but I have poor friends who in essence, "made it" because they saw opportunity and took it.

    Fuck I have one right now (a senior currently) who lives in one of the poorer parts of town who's in AP classes and the high school covers his AP tests (the fee). He saw the opportunity and took it like the smart kid he is. Here's the best part, he also learned who to make friends with, smart kid really, he knows the rich kids and uses that as leverage for himself.

    Please, just walk through your typical high school hallway and tell me you can't pick out the people who don't care, it's really easy trust me.
    Last edited by Duronos; 2013-07-22 at 05:14 AM.
    Hey everyone

  10. #330
    Quote Originally Posted by Aang View Post
    I'm not trying to be rude but I have poor friends who in essence, "made it" because they saw opportunity and took it.

    Fuck I have one right now (a senior currently) who lives in one of the poorer parts of town who's in AP classes and the high school covers his AP tests (the fee). He saw the opportunity and took it like the smart kid he is. Here's the best part, he also learned who to make friends with, smart kid really, he knows the rich kids and uses that as leverage for himself.

    Please, just walk through your typical high school hallway and tell me you can't pick out the people who don't care, it's really easy trust me.
    You realize that taking AP classes in high school isn't 'making it', right? We are talking about socio-economic changes, and you seem to be suggesting that finishing high school is a feat?
    Quote Originally Posted by xanzul View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by obdigore View Post
    So if the states get together and work with the Legislative Branch to write an amendment to the federal constitution, you think the Judiciary (SCOTUS) could strike it down for being 'unconstitutional'?
    Uh...yes. Absolutely.

  11. #331
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aang View Post
    Read the edit...

    Also personal anecdotes? I mean, do I really have to go and get a pen, study this for years? It doesn't take a smart person to realize that the kids that fail out just don't care about their future in the first place.

    To add on even more, much of science is done via observing (it's part of the scientific method right eh?).
    Not all observation is created equal. The problem with anecdotes is they do not meet the requirements for rigorous observation.

    Furthermore, yes; understanding the full depth and scale of a problem does require studying it for years.
    Quote Originally Posted by Marjane Satrapi
    The world is not divided between East and West. You are American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger than the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is much bigger than the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same.

  12. #332
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    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    Not all observation is created equal. The problem with anecdotes is they do not meet the requirements for rigorous observation.

    Furthermore, yes; understanding the full depth and scale of a problem does require studying it for years.
    My argument to that was me being in high school for 4 years watching this. Really, if you want me to document all of my observations I sure as hell will. Here's the problem, you guys are avoiding the root of the problem and that is kids growing up not caring about their future. You can say whatever you want about not having the right funds but honestly, high school is fucking free which makes that entire point moot. Not to mention it's much easier to get a scholarship at a college if you're not from a good social background.

    The facts are right in front of you, look at them.
    Hey everyone

  13. #333
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aang View Post
    My argument to that was me being in high school for 4 years watching this. Really, if you want me to document all of my observations I sure as hell will. Here's the problem, you guys are avoiding the root of the problem and that is kids growing up not caring about their future. You can say whatever you want about not having the right funds but honestly, high school is fucking free which makes that entire point moot. Not to mention it's much easier to get a scholarship at a college if you're not from a good social background.

    The facts are right in front of you, look at them.
    Four years. In a single school, in a single district, in a single state. It doesn't constitute statistically significant evidence.

    Furthermore, while education may be free for the students, the fact that the facilities and educators are so underfunded is what causes the root of many of the problems.
    Quote Originally Posted by Marjane Satrapi
    The world is not divided between East and West. You are American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger than the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is much bigger than the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same.

  14. #334
    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    Four years. In a single school, in a single district, in a single state. It doesn't constitute statistically significant evidence.

    Furthermore, while education may be free for the students, the fact that the facilities and educators are so underfunded is what causes the root of many of the problems.
    Ssshhh. He's in high school. He knows all the solutions to all the problems. We don't need studies or science.
    Quote Originally Posted by xanzul View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by obdigore View Post
    So if the states get together and work with the Legislative Branch to write an amendment to the federal constitution, you think the Judiciary (SCOTUS) could strike it down for being 'unconstitutional'?
    Uh...yes. Absolutely.

  15. #335
    Quote Originally Posted by Arcrin View Post
    Problem poor***?

    I don't believe it at all. just get off your arse and stop working at mc donalds and try to become something instead. the road to succes is fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail succes.

    and stop wanting it instant like winning in lotto.

    no offense meant.
    no for most it is fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail fail DIE.

  16. #336
    Legendary! The One Percent's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daelak View Post
    Yes they should. But we can't because they are all a part of the same power structure. If you rob a bank you can get 10 years. If you launder billions of dollars for Mexican drug cartels you get a paltry fine equivalent to 1-2 months company revenue and a letter.
    Give a man a gun and he can rob a bank, give a man a bank and he can rob the world.
    You're getting exactly what you deserve.

  17. #337
    The root of the problem is that to have Wealth one must have Poor and the fastest way to get cash is to take it form people that can not fight back.

  18. #338
    Elemental Lord Duronos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    Four years. In a single school, in a single district, in a single state. It doesn't constitute statistically significant evidence.

    Furthermore, while education may be free for the students, the fact that the facilities and educators are so underfunded is what causes the root of many of the problems.
    My school was heavily underfunded.

    It's not the schools as much as it is the kids themselves.
    Hey everyone

  19. #339
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    Quote Originally Posted by Melonemelo View Post
    relevant:

    lol its 2013 and he is force to use statistic from 1975 to 1997 to show his thesis that is 16 year old data.

  20. #340
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    Quote Originally Posted by a77 View Post
    lol its 2013 and he is force to use statistic from 1975 to 1997 to show his thesis that is 16 year old data.
    That is probably due to the fact that he wanted to display the development that happens within a span of one generation.
    It does not diminish anything he said.

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