[PTR] Proving Grounds Gear Scaling is Retarded

[fierydemise]

Rogues are pretty shitty in it. You don't have enough Haste as Combat to pull off many abilities and even then they hit like wet flowers and Assassination suffers with no energy regen too.

Saying that, I've only done Gold mode, I haven't tested out endless due to my terrible lag in there.

Assassination will probably be fine but you may have to regem toward mastery. Maybe this would be a good time to give ShadowCraft a challenge mode mode.

[SinisterAU]

Rogues , Balance Druids and Some other specs get fucked but it's still doable if you know how to play. I wouldn't worry about it.

[Deleted]

noxxic for dps meters, joke of the day.

[Reyzzz]

Rogues , Balance Druids and Some other specs get fucked but it's still doable if you know how to play. I wouldn't worry about it.

Then again, it doesn't matter because you only compete against the players of your spec.

[Deleted]

every class has some sort of spec that does well at lower gear levels. also using noxxic, not sure if serious or just troll.

Thats funny because last I checked, Priests only have 1 DPS spec, just like Monks, Paladins.
Balance druids can't just go feral unless they have gear vice versa, same with shamans.

Not sure if stupid or just troll.

[artem123]

Then again, it doesn't matter because you only compete against the players of your spec.

It actually DOES matter. Some people care about points, and obv the title. it ruins the point if you can have a easier time on something else

[JesseGoesHam]

Do you have actual experience from the PTR to back this up, or are you just worried?

I do have experience from the PTR, but it seriously takes away some of your spec choices. Lets take a look at the warrior for the dps challenge, the only choice you've got is arms since fury is practically a bag of bullshit when ur gear is bad. And thus forcing you to take a spec you dont want(unless you plays arms endgame (which is bad))

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There will be, same for every class. You know EVERYONE gets downscaled to 463 right?

You know that anyone with a brain knows that different specs scale differently with gear right?

[Jensxo]

i find it hilarious that blizz have implemented a system into the game to "teach people how to play their rotation" , correct me if im wrong , BUT i think most classes now have a 5-7 button rotation , some even have 3 buttons , its not TERRIBLY hard.

[Twilight Cultist]

i find it hilarious that blizz have implemented a system into the game to "teach people how to play their rotation" , correct me if im wrong , BUT i think most classes now have a 5-7 button rotation , some even have 3 buttons , its not TERRIBLY hard.

I find it hilarious that there are so many people who are so quick to comment on things they know nothing about. Proving Grounds is a feature meant to teach people how to perform in dungeons/raids in a controlled environment. The tasks are different depending on what role you are. For example, if you are a healer you have to heal a group of NPCs through waves of mobs that throw out debuffs, put fire on the ground, etc. The purpose is to teach new players the skills they need to perform well in a group without having to inconvenience other players by having to learn these skills when in a group with other people.

[mistahwilshire]

Honestly, I don't think it will be a big deal anyway. Even specs that don't scale real well should be able to beat Gold as long as the player knows what they are doing, and if you're testing yourself on Endless to get as far as possible, that's a legitimate avenue to expect people to swap specs/talents/glyphs/etc to try maximise how far they can push.

It's really not a big deal. I've hit Endless Wave 30 on 4 classes now (Feral/Fury/Blood DK/Fire Mage).

I know for a fact Feral scales horribly and it wasn't really that bad still. The encounters are much more about using your utility skills than it is about DPS checks (though that is a part of it at times but it's actually tuned quite nicely to what you should be pulling assuming a proper rotation and it's definitely not super tight).

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I do have experience from the PTR, but it seriously takes away some of your spec choices. Lets take a look at the warrior for the dps challenge, the only choice you've got is arms since fury is practically a bag of bullshit when ur gear is bad. And thus forcing you to take a spec you dont want(unless you plays arms endgame (which is bad))

I hit Endless 30 with Fury on my first run without much issue and Warrior is like my 4th alt on live. Real Warrior players should have no issues.

[Reyzzz]

It actually DOES matter. Some people care about points, and obv the title. it ruins the point if you can have a easier time on something else

Then just complete it with your alt.

[moveth]

I can tell you right now that being scaled to 463 as a boomkin will be a living hell. I probably wont even attempt it past Gold because the difference in damage and playstyle from my current ilvl to that is just drastically bad.

[Deleted]

Considering the classes were way more balanced back in 463 gear than in current gear, a simple "no" will suffice I guess.

That being said, it's somewhat true that going back to low ratings suck, but I'd rather take class balance over that.

Class balance at 463? You need to get out of the sun, you're starting to talk gibberish.

Specs like Fire Mage and Fury Warrior are penalized with this scaling down content. Fire only start to pull even at 510-520, and only surpass the alternative specs at 525+. The same goes for Balance Druid, due to lack of relevant stats they are almost unplayable at that level.

If Proving Grounds is about teaching people, then it should not force them to spec one particular spec to actually finish the Gold timer.

[Inthislzon]

You know that anyone with a brain knows that different specs scale differently with gear right?

Let's check what specs scale "so poorly it can't be done".

Fury warriors -> hello arms!
Balance druids -> hello feral!
Elemental shaman -> hello Enh! Also hello FUCKING BLOODLUST
Fire mages -> hello frost! Did i mention bloodlust already?

Class /= spec, unless you happen to play monk/priest/paladin.

As a monk I'm actually hoping for arena rules, so no "carried by bloodlust/doomguard/LoH/AotD" bullshit.

Also lol @ "unplayable spec" QQ. Feels like when challenge modes were introduced.

"I want to be carried by my gear! I suck at playing my class!"

I can't be the only one seeing the similarities.

[moveth]

Let's check what specs scale "so poorly it can't be done".
Balance druids -> hello feral!
.

You're a funny guy. I like you. Tell me more jokes, please.

[Inthislzon]

You're a funny guy. I like you. Tell me more jokes, please.

If you can't get a 463 set for an offspec...

That takes what, 5 minutes? 10 tops? Just grab whatever offspec loot your guild is currently DE'ing, set loot spec to your offspec and maybe run a couple RF. That's all it takes.

Also that's part of the reason it's scaled to 463, so you can gear offspecs if you wish to without effort.

[Deleted]

If you can't get a 463 set for an offspec...

That takes what, 5 minutes? 10 tops? Just grab whatever offspec loot your guild is currently DE'ing, set loot spec to your offspec and maybe run a couple RF. That's all it takes.

Also that's part of the reason it's scaled to 463, so you can gear offspecs if you wish to without effort.

The point is in another zip code from you at this moment.

You want Proving Grounds to help people learn how to play, and you force them to spec something they are, possibly, not interested in playing? If I want to be a Balance Druid and I want to learn to DPS as a Balance Druid in the Proving Grounds, working my way to a gold medal, then the solution is not to spec Feral.

[moveth]

If you can't get a 463 set for an offspec...

That takes what, 5 minutes? 10 tops? Just grab whatever offspec loot your guild is currently DE'ing, set loot spec to your offspec and maybe run a couple RF. That's all it takes.

Also that's part of the reason it's scaled to 463, so you can gear offspecs if you wish to without effort.

Dek went a bit into it, but Im gonna repeat.

Im a boomkin. I HAVE a feral set, a damn good one. I hate feral. Its not boomkin. If I go into a challenge to test my spec, I want to test my spec. I dont want to go Feral because its "Less shitty" at a certain Ilvl, because its not the spec that I play. What blizzard SHOULD do is have the shit SCALE to match YOUR ilvl.

Boomkins, Fire mages, and Fury warriors are completely fucked out of being able to properly do Proving Grounds because of the way their class is designed. In Challenge Modes, I get, literally, single digit amounts of procs on all bosses combined with my boomkin. However in a 5man dungeon, its the only spell I use besides DoTs a lot of the time. The difference in playstyle, damage output, and movement dps this allows is ridiculous. As a low level boomkin, you literally CANNOT move while DpSing. Its not possible. So with proving grounds, which not only have a set in stone DPS requirement, but also Interrupt mechanics (which boomkins, again, suck at. but thats a totally different argument) and shit you have to move out of. How are we expected to do the endless difficulty once it starts ramping up? We literally hit a roadblock of practical DPS output.

Sure. I can get lucky with my 14% crit and get 2 SS procs in a row. The chances of that are about as good as the second coming, but they are there. And that would ease the DPS requirement. But having a class that thrives on 100% pure luck at that ilvl and expecting them to be able to compete is absolutely stupid.

[zeropeorth]

I mean, you're not wrong about gear scaling but this change would mean you have to gear up for Proving Grounds which sorta defeats the point. A lot of people are going to want to use them to learn how to play particular classes and specs and requiring them to do LFR to do that excludes a huge portion of its demographic.

Honestly, I don't think it will be a big deal anyway. Even specs that don't scale real well should be able to beat Gold as long as the player knows what they are doing, and if you're testing yourself on Endless to get as far as possible, that's a legitimate avenue to expect people to swap specs/talents/glyphs/etc to try maximise how far they can push.

Exactly. It isn't meant as much for the heroic raiders as it is a training tool ... you know, the thing people kept asking for to help people L2P. This is it.

If you want the mobs to scale up ... they would need to scale up exponentially, not linearly. This 'disadvantage' people are speaking of is your non-linear scaling of stats like crit and haste (incl your rppm procs).

If it is too easy, then what is the point? Why even bother with it? What will people learn?

It almost just sounds like people are saying 'nerf this, I'm not doing as well I believe I should; I'm better than my results!!!' ...

Improve your game. Stop making excuses.

[Inthislzon]

Dek went a bit into it, but Im gonna repeat.

Im a boomkin. I HAVE a feral set, a damn good one. I hate feral. Its not boomkin. If I go into a challenge to test my spec, I want to test my spec. I dont want to go Feral because its "Less shitty" at a certain Ilvl, because its not the spec that I play. What blizzard SHOULD do is have the shit SCALE to match YOUR ilvl.

I'll repeat again.

Proving grounds WILL BE COMPLETABLE WITH EACH AND EVERY SPEC IN THE GAME.

Some will have it easier than others, that's for sure, but it will be possible in EVERY SINGLE SPEC.

EDIT: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y8zbUdIpAZs Done as balance. Guess it wasn't that hard after all. It took me ~10 seconds of Google