View Poll Results: Should Ghostcrawler be replaced as Lead Systems Designer?

Voters
2314. This poll is closed
  • Yes

    526 22.73%
  • No

    1,788 77.27%
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  1. #321
    Quote Originally Posted by Rhamses View Post
    MoP >> TBC.

    Yeah, I said it.
    You'd be the only one saying that.

  2. #322
    Quote Originally Posted by Robert3620 View Post
    Two flops in a row, pretty sure he's gone. It doesn't matter if it's his fault or not, he's the guy at the top and someone is going to have pay.
    But he's not at the top making all decisions. How that can be so fucking hard to understand?

    Next time you're in the login screen click the "credits" link. Greg Street's name is 13th from the top, not first or second. He's on second or third tier of the chain of command in WoW production, not the guy at the top.
    Never going to log into this garbage forum again as long as calling obvious troll obvious troll is the easiest way to get banned.
    Trolling should be.

  3. #323
    Quote Originally Posted by Robert3620 View Post
    Two flops in a row, pretty sure he's gone. It doesn't matter if it's his fault or not, he's the guy at the top and someone is going to have pay.
    He's not at the top. Morhaime has a better chance of losing his job than Street does...well, perhaps if they were both equally (un)likeable, that is. I've always liked Mike Morhaime for some reason.

  4. #324
    Quote Originally Posted by Robert3620 View Post
    Two flops in a row, pretty sure he's gone. It doesn't matter if it's his fault or not, he's the guy at the top and someone is going to have pay.
    Two flops? The only thing that can be universally agreed to be a flop was Cata.
    Goodbye-Forever-MMO-Champ
    Quote Originally Posted by HighlordJohnstone View Post
    Alleria's whispers start climaxing

  5. #325
    Quote Originally Posted by Pebrocks The Warlock View Post
    Two flops? The only thing that can be universally agreed to be a flop was Cata.
    MoP lost 600k subs last quarter and 1.3 mil subs the quarter before that...the only reason revenue was up last quarter was due to the end of quarter character services sale.

  6. #326
    Quote Originally Posted by Celista View Post
    MoP lost 600k subs last quarter and 1.3 mil subs the quarter before that...the only reason revenue was up last quarter was due to the end of quarter character services sale.
    I'm talking flop as in quality, sub lose (while could be for quality for some w/e) would have happened no matter what Blizzard did. It was going to happen one way or another.
    Goodbye-Forever-MMO-Champ
    Quote Originally Posted by HighlordJohnstone View Post
    Alleria's whispers start climaxing

  7. #327
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mormolyce View Post
    The delusion is strong in this one.

    P.S. GC isn't the King of Blizzard. He's just the only member of the Dev team whose name you know.
    That's what they want you to think. GC really is the King of Blizzard, but he hides in plain sight by gallivanting around as a mere systems designer.

  8. #328
    Quote Originally Posted by Pebrocks The Warlock View Post
    I'm talking flop as in quality, sub lose (while could be for quality for some w/e) would have happened no matter what Blizzard did. It was going to happen one way or another.
    I think there are some game direction issues w/MoP that in retrospect were possibly not a good idea. Playing other MMOs on the market now, there are games that are starting to outshine wow in certain areas (in my opinion)...dynamic questing, world events, dynamic pvp events, more group content, etc...wow feels behind the times in a lot of ways, and although they have made a lot of improvements to the game, they chose to focus on solo content this expansion (dailies, brawler's guild, proving grounds), and in an mmo I think doing that at the expense of group content proves to be a bad idea in the long run.

  9. #329
    Quote Originally Posted by Celista View Post
    Playing other MMOs on the market now, there are games that are starting to outshine wow in certain areas (in my opinion)...dynamic questing, world events, dynamic pvp events, more group content, etc...
    Dynamic events as such in games like GW2 and Rift are overrated. I don't mean those are bad, but those are essentially just quests with a respawn timer, nothing more, nothing less. And quests with respawn timer are really annoying in GW2 when you're trying to level and are waiting impatiently for the same event to start again that you missed last time, at least in Rift you have the standard questgivers in addition.

    But yes, grouping on the fly for the events is nice addition in those games over WoW in creating the feeling of multiplayer game even though it doesn't do shit for building communities per se.
    Never going to log into this garbage forum again as long as calling obvious troll obvious troll is the easiest way to get banned.
    Trolling should be.

  10. #330
    Quote Originally Posted by vesseblah View Post
    But he's not at the top making all decisions. How that can be so fucking hard to understand?

    Next time you're in the login screen click the "credits" link. Greg Street's name is 13th from the top, not first or second. He's on second or third tier of the chain of command in WoW production, not the guy at the top.
    I do not need to check the credits, he puts himself out front and is the best know face of the game. Is all the things wrong he's fault? Is he in charge? Of course not but he is the face of the game and therefore the guy that is going to be the fall guy. Do you think the CEO of EA had anything to do with the launch of Sim City? Of course he didn't but none the less, he got fired. Ghostcrawler is going to be either moved in the company or replaced.

    As for is MoP a flop. Of course it is, it's losing subs. This game is based on subs and if your always going in one direction and it's down, then the game is a flop. This is the second expansion in a row now where your going to end up with less people playing it at the start of then the end of it. Is there reasons outside of GC's control? Of course but it doesn't matter. It's time for the game to get a new direction and for a different spokesmen (GC's Real Job) maybe this time they can get a real pr guy because GC is not very good at it.

  11. #331
    Anyone who thinks subscription numbers is the only metric for success is just wrong and is intentionally over simplifying people gaming habits/lives if you truly think that. I also happen to think overall the game has improved dramatically with EVERY expansion. While raiding in burning crusade was very good, it is in my opinion better now. A great deal of the "game was best when" statements really are "i had the most fun when" (which incidentally is a good metric of a good game) and people seem to forget a large portion of that was socially the game ebbs and flow as well and often those times when it was best for that individual socially, eg you were in a raid with people you actually liked or had groups to PvP with etc. All those things are still possible it just depends what you want to get out of your time online.

  12. #332
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    I think he should be, but I know he won't be. It's not because I think he's solely responsible for the game's direction or sub loss or anything, I just despise his snotty attitude towards players, lack of knowledge on class balance and overall unwillingness to give ground on any issue that is brought up by the playerbase. Most of the suggestions and posts made by players ARE stupid and generally just terrible, but even the best ideas get no traction with him and if they do, it usually takes at least an entire expansion before blizzard decides they were good ideas and they should start working on implementing them. He DOES have an extremely difficult and stressful job, no doubt, but this game has gone downhill since WoTLK ended and some of the beginnings of that decline started in WoTLK (although it was still a very good expansion overall).

  13. #333
    Quote Originally Posted by Robert3620 View Post
    Of course not but he is the face of the game and therefore the guy that is going to be the fall guy. Do you think the CEO of EA had anything to do with the launch of Sim City? Of course he didn't but none the less, he got fired. Ghostcrawler is going to be either moved in the company or replaced. It's time for the game to get a new direction and for a different spokesmen (GC's Real Job) maybe this time they can get a real pr guy because GC is not very good at it.
    You really should look into what CEOs do in most companies and what their job security is like. They're getting paid so much because they usually have zero job security and can be hired or fired at the whim of the board to do some specific job. That kind of job description has got nothing to do with game developers who are several steps down the corporate ladders.

    Only in internet twit logic somebody who's not actually responsible for bad things will get sacked. Fortunately in real life it's actually almost always the people who are actually incompetent that get fired. Most likely GC has one of the most secure jobs at Blizzard for voluteering to work with random internet assholes in addition to his real job.

    Quote Originally Posted by Uoyredrum View Post
    I just despise his snotty attitude towards players, lack of knowledge on class balance and overall unwillingness to give ground on any issue that is brought up by the playerbase. Most of the suggestions and posts made by players ARE stupid and generally just terrible, but even the best ideas get no traction with him
    Playerbase as an entity is incredibly selfish and stupid collection of people who are only interested about their own favourite class, while somebody like GC who actually has to make sure they're all more or less balanced knows better than the average internet randoms. GC started working on the class balance at the end of TBC (that is his main job nothing more, nothing less), and can anybody with a honest face say that class balance today is worse than in TBC when you look into all 34 specs?
    Never going to log into this garbage forum again as long as calling obvious troll obvious troll is the easiest way to get banned.
    Trolling should be.

  14. #334
    Stood in the Fire
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    This is one of the most unfounded polls.
    Life moves pretty fast. If you don't stop and look around once in a while, you could miss it.

  15. #335
    Quote Originally Posted by xanzul View Post
    I don't get this argument. People don't pay for "shit" games and they certainly don't keep playing them. It may be "shit" for you but it isn't for many others.
    Yes, people pay for shit. There is routinely bad movies at the top of the charts, same with music. Some people even pay to see Uwe Boll movies.

    Popularity has little correlation with quality.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by xanzul View Post
    Games don't last forever. Wow could have been in TBC mode all this time and there would still be significant subscriber loss.
    You don't know it.
    NOBODY knows it. Maybe it would. Maybe it would not.
    SOMEDAY any game is bound to lose consumers, but NOBODY (including Blizzard) can pretend to know that the losses were bound to happen at the time they happened or not.

    This is just a justification for people who like the design of today to pretend it's a good one. If it was a design they didn't like, they would just as easily use the losses as "proof" the design was bad.
    Last edited by Akka; 2013-08-10 at 11:39 AM.

  16. #336
    Quote Originally Posted by Akka View Post
    You don't know it.
    NOBODY knows it. Maybe it would. Maybe it would not.
    We can't know for sure, but we can make educated inferences from the evidence. For example, a very BC-like competitor to WoW came out in 2011, Rift. It did not sustain its subscriber levels. The devs admitted the end game tuning was a mistake, particularly Hammerknell (the main Tier 2 raid).
    "There is a pervasive myth that making content hard will induce players to rise to the occasion. We find the opposite. " -- Ghostcrawler
    "The bit about hardcore players not always caring about the long term interests of the game is spot on." -- Ghostcrawler
    "Do you want a game with no casuals so about 500 players?"

  17. #337
    Quote Originally Posted by Osmeric View Post
    We can't know for sure, but we can make educated inferences from the evidence.
    No we can't. People are just going to take the parts that agree with them and ignore the one that don't.

    Case in point :
    Quote Originally Posted by Osmeric
    For example, a very BC-like competitor to WoW came out in 2011, Rift. It did not sustain its subscriber levels. The devs admitted the end game tuning was a mistake, particularly Hammerknell (the main Tier 2 raid).
    I can contradict your evidence by pointing that Rift is a different game, so it has in itself a lot more reason why to people wouldn't like to play it (I didn't, and I'm sold on TBC design for example).
    I can provide my own take on "educated guess" and point that subscriptions were growing RIGHT UNTIL they changed the design to the casualfest (WotLK saw next to no growth, and after that it went crashing down).

    Samely you can contradict my evidence about subscriptions growing until TBC by saying that it's more due to the fact that the market wasn't saturated at the time, yadda yadda, to which I can answer back that we don't know if the market is actually saturated, etc., etc.

    Conclusion : no, we can't know. We all think we're the ones reasonables and that the facts prove us right and so on.
    Blizzard itself, having the numbers and details in hand, can obviously not know, considering how they DID lose so many subscribers and are frantically trying to stop the flow and are failing.

  18. #338
    Quote Originally Posted by Akka View Post
    Samely you can contradict my evidence about subscriptions growing until TBC by saying that it's more due to the fact that the market wasn't saturated at the time, yadda yadda, to which I can answer back that we don't know if the market is actually saturated, etc., etc.

    Conclusion : no, we can't know. We all think we're the ones reasonables and that the facts prove us right and so on.
    You never can know for sure but there is one big compelling piece of evidence you're ignoring.

    SWToR

    Star Wars is a franchise almost every adult and most kids in the whole western world knows, hundred times bigger than Warcraft. Considering their incredibly poor results and not being profitable in the long run it's really easy to draw the conclusion that the time of subscription based MMORPGs is simply over and done. The whole genre started it's decline somewhere around 2010, possibly with the assistance of very high profile failures of Aion and FFXIV. Since then all subscription based games have gone downhill, WoW included, and the F2P games pioneered by Zynga have picked up the pieces and the players.
    Last edited by vesseblah; 2013-08-10 at 12:03 PM.
    Never going to log into this garbage forum again as long as calling obvious troll obvious troll is the easiest way to get banned.
    Trolling should be.

  19. #339
    >vesseblah SWToR failed cause they just did CTRL+C CTRL+V WoW & SWKoToR.

  20. #340
    Quote Originally Posted by mmokri View Post
    >vesseblah SWToR failed cause they just did CTRL+C CTRL+V WoW & SWKoToR.
    Gaming companies used to believe that people play any crap that is launched just because it comes from some respected franchise, recent example would be SWToR, FFXIV or Duke Nukem 3D for example. The thing is that it's no longer true. The rules have changed forever which means there's never going to be another success like WoW, and throwback ideas like vanilla WoW servers would never work for the players of today and tomorrow.

    And thinking even for a second that something like TBC would work today as an viable business is epic stupidity.
    Last edited by vesseblah; 2013-08-10 at 01:17 PM.
    Never going to log into this garbage forum again as long as calling obvious troll obvious troll is the easiest way to get banned.
    Trolling should be.

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