Prot pala 4 set

[celinamuna]

Now how do you guys think it stands up compared to all the other tanking 4 sets with most prot pally going haste

Not sure how it's relevant.
Regardless from what i remember dk's aren't too fond of 4p and go for 2 tank 2 dps one.

[Nairobi]

The DK set bonuses for tank t16 WERE amazing at the start of PTR, but have been beaten into submision with the nerf bats.
Monk tier in TOT was SO stronk, but it's pretty middling in t16 from what I've seen.
Rage tanks are dumb, so I don't pretend to know what's going on with those 2.

Our bonuses, like DK's were amazing on paper in first PTR iteration, but much less so now. I'll be using HC t15 4pc for quite a while unless we get some breakthrough in how our tier set works. Sad, really, as this is the first tier which is decent-to-well itemized for us, and the bonuses suck (comparatively). /sigh

[Riemu2k3]

The DK set bonuses for tank t16 WERE amazing at the start of PTR, but have been beaten into submision with the nerf bats.
Monk tier in TOT was SO stronk, but it's pretty middling in t16 from what I've seen.
Rage tanks are dumb, so I don't pretend to know what's going on with those 2.

Our bonuses, like DK's were amazing on paper in first PTR iteration, but much less so now. I'll be using HC t15 4pc for quite a while unless we get some breakthrough in how our tier set works. Sad, really, as this is the first tier which is decent-to-well itemized for us, and the bonuses suck (comparatively). /sigh

You planning on running with 4pt15 right from the start or just as you can reach the haste cap?

Was planning on using 4pt15 when I can reach the haste cap.

[Nairobi]

Planning on 4p from the start.

Reason being is that we've done fine without the haste cap so far, and going from 19k to 21250 will only net me ~2 more HoPo/min IIRC. Whereas 4pc currently accounts for ~3-6 HoPo per DivProt cast, depending on damage, so it'd be a big net loss to "step up" to t16 items from the start. And with the amount of damage in SoO AND the change to UbS (now we'll get maximum efficiency from DivProt finally) we should see some serious gains from 4pc over what we have currently, too. I'll use whatever gear I can pick up to augment my haste, but if I can grab an amplification trinket early, I'll be haste capped already.

[Promdates]

Just like with Nairobi, I will probably wear 4p heroic into t16 because the 4p is amazing (don't forget that t16 bosses will be hitting harder too). Now, if you don't have 4p heroic, and are sitting on 4p normal/lfr I would say to just pick up the t16 items (be it tier or not) as the item level difference will be considerably better. Normal Siege gear is what, 553 right, so heroic tier gear would only be 10 ilvls behind the normal gear.

Obviously, we're not advocating staying with t15 4p throughout the entire tier, I can't say for Nairobi, but I will eventually replace the t15 gear, but probably not until we reach heroics where ilvl is 566 (20+ ilvls should be the "gap" to replace the tier I think)

[Nelrock]

With the changes to SS and EF...it was looking like the T16 4 piece might be appealing.
I've not gotten on PTR. Figured I'd wait to see/decide when they're done tweaking.

[Nairobi]

Correct, for your assumptions of my plans.

Using t15 will allow me to pass items/tier to our other conq users that will benefit more from it, which is a huge boon in 10m raiding where loot is far more scarce. It will also allow us some time to jockey for the ideal gear setups, while still being propped up by the t15 4pc in the interim. Since HC/HCWF will be 566-572, the pure stat allocation will eventually surpass the tier set bonus, but it will be a few weeks/months for us to accumulate enough gear to "make the jump" so to speak.

Riding 4t15 means you can also build up a haste-cap gear set to make the "swap" a bit less painless. But, really, it's primarily just a bonus for the raid (10m speaking) to allow us to pass on new pieces that will further benefit the DPS/Healers during the most rigorous part of progression.

[Promdates]

With the changes to SS and EF...it was looking like the T16 4 piece might be appealing.
I've not gotten on PTR. Figured I'd wait to see/decide when they're done tweaking.

Probably still be using SS. It's better to mitigate the damage than heal it up.

[Nelrock]

Probably still be using SS. It's better to mitigate the damage than heal it up.

Well...hopefully it's appealing enough they don't feel the need to take another hack out of SS.

[Splashtastic]

I was wondering this last night & was planning on making a thread, but I've been shared the worry of waiting on replies. The problem I have is our sheer bad luck with tier drops, I hit the (4) finally last night but I'm using HC helm & legs, normal gloves & normal chest (damn you heroic bosses!). The chest is my main problem as the stats on it are complete shit from a dog & reforging away from either doesn't really give me much of anything & we haven't actually seen a Conq token drop at all from Quon yet, frustrating with 4 conq users in our raid..

Main issue I'm having is that I just can't live with myself dropping what is almost 8% haste by taking the (4) because I enjoy the play style so much as Firefly said earlier. However I'm not as passive with CD's as that, used to be when I wasn't experienced with veng / HoPp gen but now I'm much better with it. I'm pretty much solo tanking every fight that can be solo tanked on HC other than the obvious ones like Primo, Ji-Kun & Jin. Just not sure whether the trade-off of 8% haste vs the (4) will be worth it when tanking like I do. Obviously I'll give it a go next reset but I was just wondering what other people's thoughts would be?

[Kortane]

I assume you're 10 man, since you only have 4 conq users. As an aside, my raid generally has 2 paladins, 3 priests and 1 warlock on 10 man, so I know your pain!

For 10 man I generally stick with prot tier helm & shoulders, ret tier chest, gloves from Primordius and legs from Durumu (Horridon's work too). I have prot gloves and legs, but I find the 4pc lackluster on a lot of fights on 10 man. I use it for Dark Animus mainly, but for most fights I prefer the extra haste over the 4pc.

Obviously it's going to be up to you to decide how valuable 4pc is. Like you said, give it a go next reset and see the HP gain to come to your decision... Although 8% haste is a lot! Also be aware that you're using the prot chest which, as you mentioned, is pretty garbage! As above, I came to the conclusion that on most fights I'd rather have the extra haste from non-tier pieces.

[Promdates]

8% haste

Can you link your armory for me? I'm honestly curious how switching to 4p is an 8% haste drop, because I'm pretty sure that I can't even gain 8% haste by not using 4p and I'm pretty geared up.

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prot chest which, as you mentioned, is pretty garbage

Hey now, I'm using Prot chest. Primarily because using prot chest and HTF horridon legs (damn you durumu for never dropping HTF!) came out better, and kept my 4p. I would probably not recommend using 4p in a 10m for current tier content. As everyone loves to point out, the bosses hit for wet noodles and everything is telegraphed. Unless you plan on abusing the bonus and doing things you normally wouldn't do to take more damage to increase the holy power gained from it, don't do it. I recommend it for t16 as bosses will be hitting harder, and you will have a 30 second cd on Divine Protection with a 33% uptime.

[Nairobi]

Can you link your armory for me? I'm honestly curious how switching to 4p is an 8% haste drop, because I'm pretty sure that I can't even gain 8% haste by not using 4p and I'm pretty geared up.

IIRC, (for me) going hands and legs (over HTF Primo hands and H Durumu/Horri legs) cost me ~2100 haste after reforges. Problem is, he's using NORMAL tier, which is leagues behind commensurate H/HTF replacements.

Hey now, I'm using Prot chest. Primarily because using prot chest and HTF horridon legs (damn you durumu for never dropping HTF!) came out better, and kept my 4p. I would probably not recommend using 4p in a 10m for current tier content. As everyone loves to point out, the bosses hit for wet noodles and everything is telegraphed. Unless you plan on abusing the bonus and doing things you normally wouldn't do to take more damage to increase the holy power gained from it, don't do it. I recommend it for t16 as bosses will be hitting harder, and you will have a 30 second cd on Divine Protection with a 33% uptime.

Just adding in my 2 cents on this: I've got HC tier legs and hands in the bank, waiting for t16 to use. You CAN use them in 10H in t15, but the effects are not huge. It IS enough, though, to offset the haste loss for MY gear sets, provided you use them properly, though YMMV if you use things like normal tier or the prot chest (eww).

The ~2100 haste that I lose swapping is recouped by picking up 3 or more HoPo from the 4pc, if I am recalling the math properly. So, as long as you're firing off DivProt semi-regularly, you should see small gains using the 4pc, if your haste deltas are similar to mine.

If you truly are giving up 8% haste (which is what, like 4300 haste?), you'd need a good bit more influx from 4pc, which you may be hard pressed to squeeze out of 10H content without cheesing.

[Promdates]

Ah yeah, didn't see that he was using Normal chest/legs. Yeah, that would make sense then. Still wouldn't recommend using 4p t15 unless you have all of them in H+2/2

[Deleted]

If you truly are giving up 8% haste (which is what, like 4300 haste?), you'd need a good bit more influx from 4pc, which you may be hard pressed to squeeze out of 10H content without cheesing.

Should be noted too that HoPo is not the only reason you stack haste. If you have to give up 8% haste (which seems a lot), you are also dropping noticeable amounts of aps, hps and dps.

[Nairobi]

Should be noted too that HoPo is not the only reason you stack haste. If you have to give up 8% haste (which seems a lot), you are also dropping noticeable amounts of aps, hps and dps.

Preaching to the choir, but since 4p is purely about HoPo influx, I was trying to address that aspect alone.

[Splashtastic]

My armoury link is:-
http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...shizzle/simple

Sorry, I've been travelling since I wrote that post so I've only just sat down to reply to you all.

Yeah, I'm in 10HC raiding, my pieces of tier are as follows:-
Helm HC
Chest N (Urgh)
Gloves N
Legs HC

If the shoulders ever drop from Quon then I will likely roll on them to complete the real set, ie dropping the absolutely terrible chest slot, but admittedly at the same time my gear & playstyle works pretty well at the moment, meaning that I'd rather the tier go to our lock / priests if they can make better use of it.

@ Firefly, yeah indeed, that was another of my concerns, the fact that I'd be dropping 7% haste, not 8% I lied, it drops me from 45% to 38%, which to me still seems like a lot to lose on my GCDs, SS ticks, HoPo, DPS & HPS.

Just praying that I finally get the HC version of the trinket from Horridon next reset as it still hasn't actually dropped for us, will again improve my haste significantly.

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Can you link your armory for me? I'm honestly curious how switching to 4p is an 8% haste drop, because I'm pretty sure that I can't even gain 8% haste by not using 4p and I'm pretty geared up.

Also, just another thing, I can actually see how I'm dropping like ~4,000 haste from switching to the 4P, every piece that I'm swapping out has around 900+ haste on it at the very least. Obviously I'm getting some of that back from reforges, but sadly not a lot which again begs the question, is it really worth it?

I expect it will be at a later gear level, ie full HC tier pieces & with the Ji-kun HC feather trinket + Horridon HC trinket but at the moment I feel that I'm lacking a bit of key pieces of gear. On a side note, I hate my guilds luck with trinkets, every Ji-Kun kill we either get Rising Winds HCTF or the dodge parry gloves drop. C'est typiquement.

[Promdates]

Yeah, in your situation going for the 4p bonus would not be worth it at all. You might gain some holy power from it, but you're going to lose too much other stuff. There is going to be a dividing line between what gear level is ok to go for 4p and which isn't worth it. In general, if you can hit 18k haste rating with 4P bonus, then you're probably going to be in a good spot to use it (I think that was somewhere around 545 for me).

[Nairobi]

Honestly, just go offset at that point. The tier options you have are so very lackluster, that you're really doing yourself a disservice by trying to force 4pc to work. Esp in 10H.

If you had HC 2/2 Helm/Shoulders, and then 2 other pieces as well, I'd say maybe. But as it is there, 2 normal pieces, no shoulders, and the fact that you have alternatives to get your haste into the 40's makes it a no-brainer.

Try to stock up on the tier IMO, since honeslty this late in the tier, your DPS/healers probably really don't need it anymore now that progression is done (given that they'll be replacing it all shortly, whereas we're going to be keeping it for a solid duration).

[Deleted]

Preaching to the choir, but since 4p is purely about HoPo influx, I was trying to address that aspect alone.

Yeah, I know you know that Was not trying to preach to you, more to the people that may read this.