Will ESO being sub based affect WoW?

[MoanaLisa]

Have to admit, if WoW winds up going free to play, it would make my decision easier to go with ESO

You'll probably have to project that idea out to 2015/2016 at least. WoW has plenty of steam to get through another expansion without it and even then they don't need to take the whole game F2P. Let's imagine that the next expansion really is 10 levels. So it's out for a year and Blizzard announces that 1-90 will be F2P with the subscription model in place as is for 91-100. That might change a lot of minds that are adamantly putting a stick in the ground about quitting if the game goes to another revenue model. And F2P for 1-90 at that point would very likely be a hell of a thing for Blizzard and their store.

And who knows where ESO will be by that time. I don't know about anyone else but while I level alts like a lot of other people, I'm really spending my $15 a month for 85-90.

[razorfire]

Just to clarify this not nor do I want it to be a "WoW is dying" thread.

With ESO being confirmed as p2p with a $15 subscription fee how do we think this could affect WoW's players base, if at all? I know that I'm very interested to play ESO, but being unable to afford two monthly subscriptions it'll be unlikely that I'll be able to play both.

As I'm still enjoying wow I doubt I'll unsub for ESO but it made me wonder if maybe other people in a similar position would?

it will be about the same as when any MMO launches in competition with another while using the same payment method, there will be a brief drop in subs as some people who have been hyping up the new game leave for their awaited time with their newfound love, some people hearing there's a NEW MMO will decide that now sounds like a good time to check out the ones that are already around to see if they like them meaning subs will stabilize fairly quickly and probably go up a tiny bit, then people who are bored of the new MMO will come back while those who aren't will stay with it, or there will be people fully willing to subscribe to both (as long as you aren't the companies running them it really isn't a competition)...so eh, doubt it will do anything major to WoW but I doubt ESO will instantly go under for competing with it either. they'll both just...exist

[Maniac2]

Bottom line I think is that TESO (and WildStar) are taking a BIG gamble by choosing the (IMHO) outdated subscription-based model for their games. It smells very much like the arrogance of SWTOR, and look where they ended up - one of the biggest failures in MMO history. It's very dangerous to go sub-based in the age of f2p and "freemium" games, and while I can't speak to TESO I know from WildStar I've seen a lot of general arrogance and "We're the chosen ones who will restore the golden age of MMOs" in a lot of the posts, and I for one think that's very dangerous. If they wanted to chip at WoW (again, while I can't speak to TESO, Wildstar is pretty much positioning itself as a WoW clone and competitor) then the way to do it isn't to use the same model.

As I said before both of these games lost a potential customer in myself, because I won't pay for multiple subscriptions right now and I currently subscribe to WoW. Had they been free to play in the manner of RIFT (IMO one of if not the best current f2p implementation in a game) I would play one or both in a heartbeat, but if I have to buy a game plus pay $15/month, I'm less likely to bother.

I have the feeling that, in the words of Lord Jaraxxus, their arrogance will be their undoing.

Actually, Swtor is still subscription based game with added ftp model with cash shop. And game is rising again, not sinking. And people spend so much cash in game shop, many pay much more than actual sub is, mostly for cosmetic items.
Only problem Swtor had is Bioware launching unfinished game and due to numerous bugs and slow updates, people left the game. Now, when Swtor is almost bug-free, many people come back.
Personally, I rather play sub-based game for 2 reasons:
1) Steady income enable devs to put out more content at faster pace
2) Subscription is "filtering" out kids from the game making it much more pleasant experience for comunity in general

[Nobleshield]

I mean more that SWTOR is a failure because of the massive hype it got compared to how fast it went F2P.

[Trakanonn]

ESO being sub based will effect ESO only... in a horrible manner.

Everquest Next is going to wreck all these new MMOs in competition.. Not only is it technologically groundbreaking, its a change from the 'normal' "grind quests to level 60 then raid" type of games we keep seeing rehashed. And did I mention it is free to play?





New games cannot be successful with a $15/month model.. It is as simple as that. The F2P model is just far more rewarding on a business level and consumer level.

as for WoW, itll slowly diminish due to age and lack of a new engine and dev innovation and LFR, dailies, etc you get the point. Every new MMO that pops up hurts WoW one way or another, it gives people options, and when people play WoW and arent having fun, they tend to look at their options.

[Nobleshield]

The worst part for me is that I was really looking forward to WildStar , but I'm not justifying spending an extra $15/month, and IMO their decision to actually pursue a subscription smacks of unbelievable arrogance.

Those EQ Next vids look badass, may have to keep an eye on that as well.

[Deleted]

The worst part for me is that I was really looking forward to WildStar , but I'm not justifying spending an extra $15/month, and IMO their decision to actually pursue a subscription smacks of unbelievable arrogance.

Those EQ Next vids look badass, may have to keep an eye on that as well.

Well isnt that what the creeds system is for?

[hrugner]

Those EQ Next vids look badass, may have to keep an eye on that as well.

but that lion thing...

[Maniac2]

I mean more that SWTOR is a failure because of the massive hype it got compared to how fast it went F2P.

Well, we can only imagine how many fans Star Wars franchise have, but must be a lot. And hype is inevitable by that simple measure. Too bad Bioware wasnt experienced mmo dev, who bought beta stage engine for swtor and who underestimated players about their pace of consuming content.

[mmotroof]

Honestly, I don't think it will affect WoW not because WoW is some untouchable titan, but more than ESO seems kinda... bad from what I've seen so far. Now, of course I'm a fan of the Elder Scrolls, so I'll be watching it, but I wouldn't be surprised if it tanks.

you can't be a fan of ES and think ESO looks bad, fuck, it feels and looks like ES

that was the point of bringing over 99% of ES mechanics and making them into an MMO. in this one thread we have people saying they dislike it because it's too much like skyrim, then a guy who says he loves skyrim but thinks ESO looks bad lol

"i have nothing to say, but i must share my faux-opinion with the world"

[Nobleshield]

Well isnt that what the creeds system is for?

Maybe, from what I understand though it's a subscription either way and the creeds or whatever just give you extra. I can't justify the sub fee to begin with.

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but that lion thing...

Looked BADASS. WTB Lion race for Alliance

[razorfire]

Maybe, from what I understand though it's a subscription either way and the creeds or whatever just give you extra. I can't justify the sub fee to begin with.

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Looked BADASS. WTB Lion race for Alliance

alliance already stole lions with their guild mount and worgen druid cat form, you can take the lions with their false nobility and disturbingly low hunting success rate, we'll take tigers...far more efficient, graceful, and powerful.

[Tomana]

Everquest Next is going to wreck all these new MMOs in competition..

I think I've heard that before quite a few times

[Trakanonn]

but that lion thing...

There is scientific data (seriously) that proves that "cartoony" characters are more futureproof than an attempt at realistic ones, and that people prefer the look opposed to a realistic one for longer periods of time. Yeah the character looks a bit Disney lol, but the game isnt even in beta yet and that was a Demo, it could change. I dont mind it except the facial feature looks too Disney.

[Deleted]

A P2P model nowadays is a very very risk decision and I don't know how the investors/boards were convinced to go with it.

[Fullmetal89]

ESO's sub business model is going to affect ESO more than anyone else...

They basically killed their own game before release. Nobody is going to want to pay $15 a month for yet another Fantasy MMORPG, even if it is the Elder Scrolls franchise. ESO is going the same route as SW:The Old Republic, and we all know how well that played out..... I give them a year at best before they go F2P.

[razorfire]

I think I've heard that before quite a few times

warhammer online (was really sad how rushed that was, I absolutely love warhammer, and warhammer 40k), aion, rift, terra, ToR, I'm sure there were others...but yeah as I said in the first post I made on this topic, it's more likely that they'll both just find some level they exist and and stay there than it is that they'll manage to kill eachother. people are too invested, be it for enjoyment, attachments, or just personal pride, for WoW to "die" anytime soon.

[Nobleshield]

A P2P model nowadays is a very very risk decision and I don't know how the investors/boards were convinced to go with it.

Don't know about TESO but WildStar's devs seem convinced that they can bring back the glory days of MMOs, or at least that's the impression I got reading their blogs and such a while back.

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alliance already stole lions with their guild mount and worgen druid cat form, you can take the lions with their false nobility and disturbingly low hunting success rate, we'll take tigers...far more efficient, graceful, and powerful.

Yes but a Lion-man Paladin would be the most awesomest thing ever. I don't know what that Lion race was but if I play EQNext I want to make one

[hrugner]

Maybe, from what I understand though it's a subscription either way and the creeds or whatever just give you extra. I can't justify the sub fee to begin with.

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Looked BADASS. WTB Lion race for Alliance

In theory you should be able to generate enough cred to not need a subscription. I don't know how my play time compares to their expectations though, so I'd probably end up subbing just to be sure. That is if I play it at all, who knows there.

That lion thing doesn't fit in with the art style of the environment or the other character. If it was in Azeroth it wouldn't look as out of place as it does there. Also, Azeroth already has lion people that are:
1. Awesome
and
2. should be playable
oh and
3. Look like the liontaur from Quest for Glory
also
4. Look amazing next to that embarrassment

[Deleted]

Don't know about TESO but WildStar's devs seem convinced that they can bring back the glory days of MMOs, or at least that's the impression I got reading their blogs and such a while back.

Oh well, another crash and burn. The problem is not the glory days of MMOs, it's the dying model of P2P.