My Guild just got disbanded

[Repefe]

Sucks, but when 10 and 25 man were going to share a lockout and the death of 25 man guilds were imminent, all of you 10 man people were like good riddance or we're more hardcore than 25s or some bullshit. So good riddance to 10 man "Heroic" raiding (if it can even be called that), and I look forward and will raid hardcore again with this 20 man mode.

The shared lockout was another thing that Blizz did for 25 mans so they don't have to run both 25 and 10 man raids to maximize loot. Don't turn the argument around.

[Melkandor]

The shared lockout was another thing that Blizz did for 25 mans so they don't have to run both 25 and 10 man raids to maximize loot. Don't turn the argument around.

I know. I'm just simply saying goodbye to all these 10 man 'heroic' guilds and I welcome all the new 20 man Mythic guilds.

[Repefe]

I know. I'm just simply saying goodbye to all these 10 man 'heroic' guilds and I welcome all the new 20 man Mythic guilds.

Thing is Blizz keeps doing stuff for 25 mans and ppl keep refusing to play them Now that they failed to make ppl play big raid size the final move is simply to kill the 10 mans. Tad too drastic imho.

[Madruga]

Or you may recruit and start doing 25 man right away. It is what we are doing.

[Nelle]

“It is not the strongest or the most intelligent who will survive but those who can best manage change.”

[Skippy88]

To me it's sad you disbanded without at least trying to give it a shot. For those on low-population realms it is going to be a struggle and your probably going to have to do several things just to pick up 1 or 2 people here and there. Your probably going to have get creative too.

I will point out if you can afford internet and pay the monthly $15 you should be able to afford a realm transfer of at least one character. I think with the new Garrison feature it's going to be easier for guilds to start over on a new realm. I know I know you shouldn't have to pay extra costs to do that but it's the easiest and less time-consuming solution to getting access to more players willing to join your team.

[owbu]

I sometimes feel like people are creating most of their problems by thinking too much about, why something is impossible.
What is impossible is to predict, what will happen to your guild next. Too many variables. Thousands of them. And you know like two (you have this many people right now and you need 20 people at some unknown point of time).

Which servers will yours be merged with? How many people will quit raiding till that point? How many will start playing again? How long will the gearing up progress last? How many guilds will brake up on your realm to give you more players? And so on.
Ive done the "pre expansion planing" for my guild for 4 expansions now and every time it gets more minimalistic, because I know everything will turn out diffrently and everything will be okay in the end anyways.
So there is really no need and no sense in trying to figure it out now.

Just spend the time doing that with something fun. Like killing those last few bosses your missing.
You have like 6 month!

[sethman75]

Good

I hope Blizzard come up with a different type of end game which doesnt involve raiding.
Raids are two time consuming to make and play and are not rewarding enough for the effort put in.

If they can solve the end game puzzle, theynwill get LK numbers back

[Melkandor]

Thing is Blizz keeps doing stuff for 25 mans and ppl keep refusing to play them Now that they failed to make ppl play big raid size the final move is simply to kill the 10 mans. Tad too drastic imho.

Do you know why 25 mans were dying out? Because people went to 10 man easy mode and just 'raided' with a few friends. Blizzard sees that 10 mans are just a crappy raid size, thus why they are killing them off

[Terridon]

Good

I hope Blizzard come up with a different type of end game which doesnt involve raiding.
Raids are two time consuming to make and play and are not rewarding enough for the effort put in.

If they can solve the end game puzzle, theynwill get LK numbers back

It doesn't have to be. We raid 5-6 hours pr week, fool around and want the heroic difficulty, as it is now
This might still be a lot for you, but to me it's not much. One day of 3 hours, and one of 2½ (sometimes pushed half an hour more if we really think we gain something from it)
Most people spend more time watching series/movies than that.

[Repefe]

Do you know why 25 mans were dying out? Because people went to 10 man easy mode and just 'raided' with a few friends. Blizzard sees that 10 mans are just a crappy raid size, thus why they are killing them off

Do you know how silly this sounds Ppl were just raiding ... were just having fun with friends. The blasphemy. We should all spend hours and hours managing guilds to assemble big roasters where ppl don't even really know each other in order to earn the right to raid.

It's a matter of taste I guess, but still funny. Big raid size on its own is a negative for a lot of raiders because of the normalized gameplay it brings. Put extra managment cost on top of it and the only conclusion is that the new raids tailored for fixed raid size will have to be pretty revolutionary to justify this move.

[Glazey]

25 man raiding gave you better gear because you had to put more effort into your group.
10man raiders felt like second class players because they didn't get the same ilvl of loot for, back then, easier content. (10 vs 25 arguement is dumb. Some bosses are harder on 25, some on 10)
Blizzard changes this to please to the 10man crowd, by allowing the same ilvl in both 10/25.
Blizzard changes the lockout so it's shared, so the 25man raiders don't have to raid 10man too.
Substantial amounts of 25man guilds became 10man because it was easier to manage for the same reward. (Paragon is the best example).

Mythic is the answer to this dumb debate. 10man guilds who are crying right now need to suck it up and deal with it, this is going to be one of the better things that has happened in a long time.

[Melkandor]

Do you know how silly this sounds Ppl were just raiding ... were just having fun with friends. The blasphemy. We should all spend hours and hours managing guilds to assemble big roasters where ppl don't even really know each other in order to earn the right to raid.

It's a matter of taste I guess, but still funny. Big raid size on its own is a negative for a lot of raiders because of the normalized gameplay it brings. Put extra managment cost on top of it and the only conclusion is that the new raids tailored for fixed raid size will have to be pretty revolutionary to justify this move.

Define what would be revolutionary to justify this?

[Axethor]

Do you know how silly this sounds Ppl were just raiding ... were just having fun with friends. The blasphemy. We should all spend hours and hours managing guilds to assemble big roasters where ppl don't even really know each other in order to earn the right to raid.

It's a matter of taste I guess, but still funny. Big raid size on its own is a negative for a lot of raiders because of the normalized gameplay it brings. Put extra managment cost on top of it and the only conclusion is that the new raids tailored for fixed raid size will have to be pretty revolutionary to justify this move.

If you want to have fun with friends you still can, that's what dungeons and Heroic Flex are for. They are finally making the hardest tier of raiding for the people who want to raid hardcore. Normalized size means no more balancing act. Bigger raid size means they can plan for the group to have at least one of each class and design encounters around it.

Bigger raid sizes normalize gameplay? What? Smaller sizes normalize it because you can't do as much with less people. It restricts you to certain mechanics. Bigger raid size = more options for mechanics because you have the extra people to use. Too big and you have useless people, which is why they picked 20m and not something massive like 40m.

[Deleted]

Thing is Blizz keeps doing stuff for 25 mans and ppl keep refusing to play them Now that they failed to make ppl play big raid size the final move is simply to kill the 10 mans. Tad too drastic imho.

Not sure if you noticed, but Mythic is 20 and not 20-25.

25 guilds are getting the same treatment.

[Glazey]

Bigger raid sizes normalize gameplay? What? Smaller sizes normalize it because you can't do as much with less people. It restricts you to certain mechanics. Bigger raid size = more options for mechanics because you have the extra people to use. Too big and you have useless people, which is why they picked 20m and not something massive like 40m.

Double edged blade.

Too many people makes the content easy. Vanilla encounters were not hard.
Not enough people forces less mechanics for fights.

[Repefe]

If you want to have fun with friends you still can, that's what dungeons and Heroic Flex are for. They are finally making the hardest tier of raiding for the people who want to raid hardcore. Normalized size means no more balancing act. Bigger raid size means they can plan for the group to have at least one of each class and design encounters around it.

Bigger raid sizes normalize gameplay? What? Smaller sizes normalize it because you can't do as much with less people. It restricts you to certain mechanics. Bigger raid size = more options for mechanics because you have the extra people to use. Too big and you have useless people, which is why they picked 20m and not something massive like 40m.

Problem is you get to hardcore content as a casual player as well ... it takes longer, but you get there. And for those 10 man guilds that finished normals and followed it up with heroic content, that option is gone now. Normals last a month or two as a content, no more ... what are you supposed to do after.

As for the normalization I was talking about gameplay style. In 10 mans your function is broader compared to 20 mans where you are much more specialized.

[pallyopness]

Problem is you get to hardcore content as a casual player as well ... it takes longer, but you get there. And for those 10 man guilds that finished normals and followed it up with heroic content, that option is gone now. Normals last a month or two as a content, no more ... what are you supposed to do after.

As for the normalization I was talking about gameplay style. In 10 mans your function is broader compared to 20 mans where you are much more specialized.

Easy solution. You join a guild running mythics. You realize and understand that if you stay in a 10 man guild you are only fucking yourself. Blizzard isn't forcing you to not adapt and change.

[Repefe]

Easy solution. You join a guild running mythics. You realize and understand that if you stay in a 10 man guild you are only fucking yourself. Blizzard isn't forcing you to not adapt and change.

Yeah, but that's the argument. "If you want to have fun with friends you still can ..." Yeah, except, not really.

[pallyopness]

Yeah, but that's the argument. "If you want to have fun with friends you still can ..." Yeah, except, not really.

yes you can....join other guilds as a group. I personally know of many 10 mans asking around for groups together to join. People say it doesn't work but what choice do you have. You can either split up and singularly join guilds or give a go at a merger of sorts. Those are your only 2 options if you want mythic. End of story.