6.0 Mage Speculation & Paranoia

[gallamann]

Color me one happy ass mage if they eliminate multi-dot from mages

I specifically rolled this toon back in Cata because I did not like the multi-dot play style of Shadow Priest and Warlock

[Deleted]

Color me one happy ass mage if they eliminate multi-dot from mages

I specifically rolled this toon back in Cata because I did not like the multi-dot play style of Shadow Priest and Warlock

i personaly will color you two happy ass mages

[Polarthief]

Comfirmation about something for a class that has been unhappy with how they have been forced to play for a really long time.

*Coughs* What exactly did we get confirmation about? "Mages not able to multidot" changes nothing but NT/LB target cap to 1, which I personally think is bad gameplay as it offers little to nothing for uniqueness other than pushing a pointless bomb in our faces to keep up, rather than, I don't know, make our gameplay/rotations more engaging.

[mrgreenthump]

*Coughs* What exactly did we get confirmation about? "Mages not able to multidot" changes nothing but NT/LB target cap to 1, which I personally think is bad gameplay as it offers little to nothing for uniqueness other than pushing a pointless bomb in our faces to keep up, rather than, I don't know, make our gameplay/rotations more engaging.

Most Mages I have talked to.. Didn't like multidotting at all, they would rather see dots gone from Mages. Is that a good thing, prolly not, but it's what the community thinks. They want Mages to feel different, not 1 of the 5 caster classes that all feel the same. Personally I get why the dots are in the game, but I wouldn't miss them. Well as Arcane I would, if they are determined to continue with the cast time on everything option

Also if the bombs are here to stay, I probably wouldn't like max target 1 option, but if that is what it takes for dots to feel relevant yet not OP.. I'm fine with that. In any case what the tweet implies is that we will have max 1-2 bombs up at a time, which means just refreshing your bomb every 11-13 seconds. Not terribly engaging I agree.

[LocNess]

Going to re suggest just adding flavour to each bombs:

Each explosion of Living Bomb spreads a mini-ignite to up to 10 targets ticking for 15% of the explosion.

Each tick of Nether Tempest grants 1.5% mana back to the caster.

Each Frost Bomb explosion shoots out icicles at nearby enemies doing all of the damage of your stored icicles.

[Kuni Zyrekai]

Each Frost Bomb explosion shoots out icicles at nearby enemies doing all of the damage of your stored icicles.

Ooo, I potentially like that. It's quite easy to have none up for the explosion, though.

[LocNess]

Ooo, I potentially like that. It's quite easy to have none up for the explosion, though.

It would just add a factor of making sure to get your Frostbolts in before you bomb, which might line up with a CD to the bomb? Has potential I agree.

[Milamber]

I'd like the bombs to be gone and have their dps added to our direct damage spells.

[Akraen]

I'd like the bombs to be gone and have their dps added to our direct damage spells.

In an ideal world that's what I would have. Though with a lot of different changes, like removal of snapshotting, I think we need to not eliminate all of the complexity. I'm a fan of simple, only a few buttons, but easy-to-learn hard-to-master is a good thing.

[Obelisk Kai]

I'd like to pose a question and this is the thread to do it.

How do you see each of our specs? What vision do you have for each of them? What should they be and how should they be different from each other. Because spec diversity is sort of an issue isn't it.

For me, it is clear.

FIRE

Fire should be the only spec that even touches dots in any shape or form. Dots SHOULD be the spec's identity, even if only applied passively via ignite.The entire spec should be built around fireball, instant pyroblasts, mobility via scorch and ignite.
Essentially I think Fire is almost where it should be. The big problem for fire right now is Combustion, the cooldown. It's been redesigned time and time again.

Iteration 1:It increased the critical strike chance of the next fire spell by 100%, only guaranteeing one critical strike. The cooldown was 5 minutes.
Iteration 2: When activated, this spell causes each Fire damage spell you cast to increase your critical strike chance with Fire damage spells by 10%. This effect lasts until you have caused 3 critical strikes with Fire spells. 3 minute cooldown
Iteration 3: Redesigned to be the super dot, based upon all our ticking spells on the target.
Iteration 4: Redesigned to simply mirror our Ignite. Continually nerfed.

I don't know about you but a spell that has been redesigned four times and STILL isn't satisfactory is an issue. For me personally, this spell and it's interaction with Alter Time and PoM are a massive Horsefly in the ointment as even though it was awesome to produce big numbers in pre nerf scenarios it always felt like a clumsy way of doing so.

We KNOW they are going to change the way these three spells interact with each other so they should take time to build a combustion that really works. The first step they could do is remove the glyph. I'm sorry but that glyph is part of the balance issues problems. Stop treating Combustion as our big cooldown, the equivalent of Icy Veins and Arcane Power. Make it a spell we pop on a 45 second cooldown with a ten second (minimum, new level 100 talents) duration.

It should remain based on our ignite value...partially. I say give Combustion a base dot damage, base application damage and add in a percentage of our ignite so we can still try and aim for a good combustion but crucially will not be TOO penalised for messing up.

FROST

I'll say it now. I think Frost should be built into our pet spec. It is the perfect method of differentiating it from Fire and Arcane. I know some people don't like pets but there are two other specs for you if you don't. There shouldn't be a glyph opt out or a talent opt out from the pet.

But the pet is so bland. It has a ranged frost nova, and that is awesome, but it's a permanent pet for a spec that should be more fully pet based. Take a look at these

Fire Elemental has a kick ass new look and it has 274k hp and 9616 mana
- Fire Blast: 40 mana 20 yard range 6 sec cd Instant cast - Inflict Fire damage to an enemy
- Fire Nova: 30 mana 10 sec cd 1.78 cast - Inflicts fire damage to nearby enemies
- Immolate: 95 mana 30 yard range 1.78 sec cast 10 sec cd - Burns an enemy, then inflicts additional fire damage every 2.67 sec for 21.37 sec
- Empower: 40 yard range Channeled 10 sec cd - Empower the elementals creator with fiery energy, increasing all damage dealt by 5% and healing by 10% while channeling continues.
- Attack, Follow, Move To, Assist, Defensive, Passive commands ( just like hunter pets)

Earth Elemental has 457 hp and a cool new look as well
- Angered Earth: Instant 5 sec cd - Taunts and causes additional high threat to all enemies within 15 yards
- Pulverize: Melee Instant 40 sec CD - Smash an enemy with a rocky fist, dealing 150% damage of normal attack, and stunning target for 4 sec
- Harden Skin: Instant 1 min CD - The caster's skin hardens into pure granite, reducing all damage taken by 40% for 10 sec.
- Reinforce: 40 yard range Channeled 10 sec CD - Surround the elemental's creator with an earthen shield, reducing all damage taken by 20% and increasing healing done by 10% while channeling continues.
- Attack, Follow, Move To, Assist, Defensive, Passive commands

Those are the abilities for TEMPORARY pet summoned by shamans they have to spec a talent to get. Taunts. Stuns. An aoe. Even a buff for the caster. I am not saying the Water Elemental should copy these, but surely the Water elemental could get a few more abilities to manage?

ARCANE

And what should arcane be in my opinion?

Arcane should be everything Frost and Fire are not. Arcane should have nothing to do with dots. Arcane should have nothing to do with pets. Arcane should be for the Mage who wishes to basically blow crap out of the water. Like fire it is almost there. I think it needs a little more work.

I also think could do with a bit more 'Time' in it's character. If anything defines arcane now, it is Arcane's time magic. I am not sure how they could do that, but it would do wonders for Arcane's personality.

[Army Dreamer]

Arcane should be as it was in Cata - controllable DPS cycle with controllable mana burn during the damage burst. No freaking dots or procs.

[mrgreenthump]

Arcane should be as it was in Cata - controllable DPS cycle with controllable mana burn during the damage burst. No freaking dots or procs.

Am afraid that NT/LB were the saving graces of Arcane being viable this exp at all. They were the only spells aside from Scorch, Arcane Explosion and Arcane barrage that you could cast while moving. They need to fix Arcane's problem with movement before anything else tbh. It's fine for a class to be a "turret", but when your DPS is suffering really badly as you got nothing decent to cast while moving.

[Obelisk Kai]

Am afraid that NT/LB were the saving graces of Arcane being viable this exp at all. They were the only spells aside from Scorch, Arcane Explosion and Arcane barrage that you could cast while moving. They need to fix Arcane's problem with movement before anything else tbh. It's fine for a class to be a "turret", but when your DPS is suffering really badly as you got nothing decent to cast while moving.

Maybe Arcane should turret. If mobility is an issue, why not embrace the problem. Completely mad off the wall idea, allow Arcane to literally turret, damage mitigation in exchange for being snared or rooted.

[mrgreenthump]

-Snip-

I for 1 don't think dots are Fire's identity at all. Mages whole identity is direct damage. If you take that away, how would fire differ from Destro Warlock? Now sure Ignite is a dot, but it comes from direct damage. And what comes to fire being fine.. it's far from it, the spec is really boring as is, you have fireball spam, get crit, use IB and stuff, continue fireball spam. Either with high crit or no crit, the spec is almost the same all over again with using combustion every 45/90 seconds.

And what it comes to Frost, as said before Mages identity is direct damage. And Frost plays around Freeze-->Shatter ideology. It works rather ok atm. Needs a few tweaks here and there, but Frost is good.

Arcane in the other hand.. I feel like it really has a hard time to find it's true identity. Mana play sure, but since they brought it to Arcane, it has almost never been interesting option. I'd rather have Arcane changed completely. And while I'd like to see Blood or Battle Mage as a mage spec in WoW, it will prolly never happen.. And time modifying didn't really work either this expansion when looking at Alter Time. Arcane needs something to identify itself by, it just has nothing atm. And the spell graphics for Arcane blow.

- - - Updated - - -

Maybe Arcane should turret. If mobility is an issue, why not embrace the problem. Completely mad off the wall idea, allow Arcane to literally turret, damage mitigation in exchange for being snared or rooted.

Turret would be fine, but I doubt Blizzard would ever allow damage migitation to that extent. So you would really need something to be decent to use while moving, something that makes you feel that Standing still > movement, but something that still does decent damage when you actually have to move.

[Obelisk Kai]

snip

I have to disagree. I know Mages are all about direct damage and that is what they gave us this expansion. Three specs that are functionally identical. I believe that the differences between the specs should be enhanced so that we can get access to more variety.

[mrgreenthump]

I have to disagree. I know Mages are all about direct damage and that is what they gave us this expansion. Three specs that are functionally identical. I believe that the differences between the specs should be enhanced so that we can get access to more variety.

They can make them as different as they want.. They made them identical by choice and my guess.. to be easier to balance. Frost for me is very different from Fire atm when speaking identity. Fire just suffers from the lack of real gameplay. The real problem is all mage specs became, cast A, wait for a proc/crit, cast B/B+C and repeat with Bomb every 11-13 seconds. With Arcane having mana play with it as well. And Frost has 2 procs.

[Polarthief]

Most Mages I have talked to.. Didn't like multidotting at all, they would rather see dots gone from Mages. Is that a good thing, prolly not, but it's what the community thinks. They want Mages to feel different, not 1 of the 5 caster classes that all feel the same. Personally I get why the dots are in the game, but I wouldn't miss them. Well as Arcane I would, if they are determined to continue with the cast time on everything option

Also if the bombs are here to stay, I probably wouldn't like max target 1 option, but if that is what it takes for dots to feel relevant yet not OP.. I'm fine with that. In any case what the tweet implies is that we will have max 1-2 bombs up at a time, which means just refreshing your bomb every 11-13 seconds. Not terribly engaging I agree.

I don't like multidotting, but I don't like dots to begin with. It's why I didn't enjoy Warlock too much prior to MoP since every spec had them. I want them gone, but saying "multidotting is gone" tells us nothing really.

That doesn't really change anything except make us unable to AoE unless they actually fix that bullshit. Not to mention our ONE DoT requires constant reapplying. No other class that has to use a DoT has one as short as us.

[LocNess]

I don't like multidotting, but I don't like dots to begin with. It's why I didn't enjoy Warlock too much prior to MoP since every spec had them. I want them gone, but saying "multidotting is gone" tells us nothing really.

That doesn't really change anything except make us unable to AoE unless they actually fix that bullshit. Not to mention our ONE DoT requires constant reapplying. No other class that has to use a DoT has one as short as us.

Eh I don't find it too much of a nuisance to keep it up. I find my shadow priest a lot more annoying to keep dots going but it might just be me.

[mrgreenthump]

Eh I don't find it too much of a nuisance to keep it up. I find my shadow priest a lot more annoying to keep dots going but it might just be me.

It ain't terribly engaging gameplay either, you just look at a timer once to make sure how many spells or GCD's you can cast and press the Bomb button when you are done. As fire, it's a bit like SnD is for Rogues, exept they have to have combos for it. Which is kinda funny if SnD truly goes passive next expansion and Bombs for fire stays the same.

[voltaa]

It ain't terribly engaging gameplay either, you just look at a timer once to make sure how many spells or GCD's you can cast and press the Bomb button when you are done. As fire, it's a bit like SnD is for Rogues, exept they have to have combos for it. Which is kinda funny if SnD truly goes passive next expansion and Bombs for fire stays the same.

Well SnD is going passive for Ass only, but thats not really the topic at hand here. I don't see how bombs are "staying the same" when multidot is getting cut, but even staying functionally the same but on a single target, while not really "engaging" is it really bad for us?

Many mechanics in this game are just 1. Look at timer 2. Re apply. Not everything has to be super engaging as this would cause either a sensory overload, or nothing being engaging. We need the bland to balance the boom.