Tips for Future Tragically Terrible LFR Encounter Designs

[Normie]

Perhaps someone at Blizzard can pick this up and pass it around, just in case some of the current talent moves on to bigger and better things.

Note how lots of these things bring value to an organized encounter, but collectively bring only misery to the world of random matchmaking.

Place Lots of Trash That Drops Nothing and Gives You Nothing

Organized modes have trash that gives you reputation and the occasional epic or even toy. Let's not have that in LFR. By "that" I mean the reward. But leave the trash there to slog through.

Place Lots of Optional Trash

Optional trash opens up a world of possibilities for random parties. Perhaps they can all sneak through it using exactly the same route. Perhaps they won't.

Place Optional Trash That Can Easily Be Skipped and Is Annoying If Pulled

The blind dudes that hit like trucks and take a couple minutes to kill. Sure, why not.

A room with several platoons of orcs practicing their killing skills off to the side. Sounds great.

Place Optional Trash Where There Is No Obvious Path through/around It

Imagine if you will an almost completely dark cave with three objectives in it, lots and lots and lots of trash, and several entirely reasonable routes between the three objectives, none of which is everyone's favorite.

Imagine if you will a quarry which must be crossed whose cliffsides are covered in trash, with numerous entirely reasonable routes through it, none of which is everyone's favorite.

As a bonus, this makes it much more exciting for players zoning in after the group has already wiggled its way through the mobs. "Hmm, which way should I go? Maybe I will just mount up and RIDE FAST STRAIGHT AT EVERYBODY."

Place Optional Trash Where It Can Be Just Barely Be Skipped

Let's go back to that almost dark cave, with numerous trash mobs patrolling back and forth, and 25 boisterous heroes bouncing around "trying not" to pull it.

Or, imagine a long stairway, where bones conveniently mark the locations of annoying mobs that could be skipped by simply walking around them ... or not.

Place Optional Trash Where It Can Be Pulled During a Boss Fight

Nothing livens up a fight with a hydra like a dozen cave spiders and a screaming worm made out of stone rings and a big pissed off fungus elemental thing.

The Boss's First Action Should Wipe the Group If The Group Is Out of Place

Who pulled the hydra? Dammit, I still got the mass rez debuff.

Place Trash Far, Far Away from the Entrance

DO NOT COME IN. DO NOT COME IN. STOP WALKING IN. OMG STOP STOP THE TRASH STILL HASN'T RESET.

Add NPCs That Pose Interesting and Pointless "What-Ifs"

Tyrande, I wonder, how many of these trash mobs would it take to kill her? And then what would happen? I don't suppose you 24 guys who waited an average of 30 minutes apiece to get into this instance mind if I experiment for a while do you? (We will be constantly in combat so you can't kick me, woo hoo!)

Follow a Chaotic Mess with a Super Important Action That Requires a Little Care and Coordination

After 15-20 minutes of killing multiple huge rooms full of insane orcs and goblins and machinery, everyone should have to stop at the entrance to a hallway and wait patiently while someone applies CC in the one and only one place in the entire four wings that it is more or less necessary. And then everyone should avoid spamming AoE right on top of the marks. Now, it's certainly not the hunter's first time placing a trap in a raid ... or is it ...?

Don't Fix Toys That Can Be Used for Evil; Don't Even Nerf Them

The Battle Horn is fine. It shouldn't emote "/e sounds her Battle Horn!". It shouldn't appear in the combat log. Because if it did, people would know who pulled the trash/boss/both. They would know after the first wipe, not the fifth. They wouldn't start kicking random suspects who showed up in "Who Pulled" and fail to kick the actual villain because the Battle Horn doesn't work that way.

In an Especially Long and/or Tedious to Reach Encounter, Make the Likely Failure Point at Least 10 Minutes into the Fight

So, you do need to single target the blistering tentacles.

Also, you need to attack the mind controlled people.

Make Sure that Important Mechanics are Well Hidden

I got this ... like ... Mark?

There are these purple orbs. It's really important to soak them. They're not real big though and they don't stand out in all that ... gray and purple.

And speaking of not standing out in purple:

Create Encounters Where You Have to Follow the Leader, and the Leader Has to Be Right

There is one path through the purple maze, or two paths if have good eyes and run fast. Everyone is going to follow the person with the mark, if there is a person with a mark, near the center. But often, he won't be on any path. In fact, he might not even be the tank or the "leader."

Use the Same Graphics to Mean "Come Here or Die" and "Get Away or Die"

This expansion seems to be the expansion of the group and soak, not the living bomb. I guess the living bomb was old.

Make Sure that Organized Raiders Bring Incorrect Strategies into the Group

Ah the legend of DPS OFF THE BOSS DURING DEFENSIVE!!!

[russykh]

Well, they have a point about the trash after Tortos. Guaranteed, the raid will have people who run off ahead, while some people still aren't sure which way to go, and get lost, or someone will go a different way because "they've always done it this way" and ignore most people going a different way. The route most people go isn't the most obvious way, and it's incredibly easy to pull trash (or at least, people always manage to) which half the raid ignores when it happens so they can tunnel the mob by the bell, leaving either a small group behind trying to kill it, or someone hoping they can run to the rest of the raid before they die. It's just a bit of a cluster fuck till you get to snake-head-boss-who's-name-I-always-spell-wrong. In fact the trash in that entire wing is pretty bad as on the way to Ji Kun someone always dies to molluscs and starts questioning how they died, or spawns more mobs.

In organised groups, neither of these are problems, with 24 randoms running around unco-ordinated and rushing as fast as poss, it makes for a poor experience.

[banur]

"Pls remove dis difficult mechanics and just giev loot."

Sorry if your groups suck but that is what you have to expect from a ffa mode.

Warning: I think you probably read the title and assumed he wanted automatic loot? Read the thread before you post. -Azshira

[Deleted]

Ensure that the boss can cast a 30 second debuff that needs to be dispelled or else it will wipe the entire raid.

Or even better, ensure there's a mechanic that every player needs to move at least one yard from or it'll inverse-flame wreath the raid and wipe it. Many fun to be had!

[Tobedeleted123]

"Pls remove dis difficult mechanics and just giev loot."

Sorry if your groups suck but that is what you have to expect from a ffa mode.

Yeah clearly don't get the point of the thread, do you?

[Nobleshield]

Actually I agree with most of what the OP wrote. Trash is fine when it makes sense, it's not fine when it's just a time waster, and even less fine when it's highly annoying trash where CC would be great... except they're all immune to CC for some unknown reason (e.g. Siegecrafter trash). Trash in LFR provides an easy way to grief people either accidentally or on purpose by trying to skip anything and everything and accidentally pulling while doing so, or having trash be dangerously close to the boss (see: Megaera).

[banur]

Yeah clearly don't get the point of the thread, do you?

Yeah I don't, oh wait half is about how an LFR group fails at moving from Tortos to Magaera. What is the reason for that? Well, most people in LFR turned off their brain when signing up and blindly follow the herd.
I've been running LFR on multiple alts and yes groups have pulled unnessecary trash or wiped (however not during Magaera), but that happens because, again, the majority is brain-afk in LFR.
All of that is ONLY a problem if people don't pay attention and that is not a problem on Blizzards side.

[Deleted]

just get rid of trash altogether its shite it just slows boss kills down and no more shit running to bosses make every raid same as the circus (totgc) no running no trash just straight to business. idc about how good or as it is bad your buildings where bosses live are I just want my loot i don't want to look around at the scenery.

[Normie]

"Pls remove dis difficult mechanics and just giev loot."

Sorry if your groups suck but that is what you have to expect from a ffa mode.

You have a problem with my spelling?

[banur]

You have a problem with my spelling?

No with your idea to remove trash because people in LFR groups fail.

[Normie]

No with your idea to remove trash because people in LFR groups fail.

I thought my post recommended adding trash?

[banur]

I thought my post recommended adding trash?

Then I misread your text as it reads like a nice evening full of failing in LFR.

[Kalmah]

the only trash that is incredibly stupid is the trash at the start of the 4th wing in siege.

Most of the time when I get in there, for some reason we only get 1 tank and 3 healers (why does the queue pop with an incomplete group?), then someone pulls everything, the tank obviously dies and then I spend 15 minutes waiting for people to stop zoning while the trash still hasn't reset.

The exact same trash is never a problem when it's done as part of wing 3 though...

[Normie]

Then I misread your text as it reads like a nice evening full of failing in LFR.

You misread it, anyway.

[Kaleredar]

For your latter points, if you know the boss fight, describe it... never assume that people know what to do, and know that "well they should know" gets you jack shit nowhere in LFR, so there's no reason trying to adhere to that.

It's quite simple to one-shot fights when people know what to do. One guy on blackfuse's conveyer belt and the fight is trivial. As long as someone marks the paragons (it really doesn't matter which, as long as amber guy dies first when he pops up) it's simple. Even Garrosh can be one-shotted if you simply tell people what they need to do (like setting markers for ranged to run between, designating someone to kill the rear engineer,) and so on.

- - - Updated - - -

the only trash that is incredibly stupid is the trash at the start of the 4th wing in siege.

If you're alliance, you get to skip all that trash!

[Normie]

For your latter points, if you know the boss fight, describe it... never assume that people know what to do, and know that "well they should know" gets you jack shit nowhere in LFR, so there's no reason trying to adhere to that.

It's quite simple to one-shot fights when people know what to do.

"Everyone has seen this fight already cmon its bean out for months at least raed the dj" doesn't work in LFR.

[Kaleredar]

"Everyone has seen this fight already cmon its bean out for months at least raed the dj" doesn't work in LFR.

That's exactly what I just said...

You describe the boss before each fight. It works pretty damn well.

[Normie]

That's exactly what I just said...

You describe the boss before each fight. It works pretty damn well.

I thought "everybodies already seen this fite" was the boss description?!?

[Kaleredar]

I thought "everybodies already seen this fite" was the boss description?!?

I posted:

"For your latter points, if you know the boss fight, describe it... never assume that people know what to do, and know that "well they should know" gets you jack shit nowhere in LFR, so there's no reason trying to adhere to that."

It's like you just didn't even read that.

[Normie]

I posted:

"For your latter points, if you know the boss fight, describe it... never assume that people know what to do, and know that "well they should know" gets you jack shit nowhere in LFR, so there's no reason trying to adhere to that."

It's like you just didn't even read that.

It's like you are on the internet without the ability to detect a sly wink and a nod.