The slippery slope has finally ended.

[notorious98]

5 new races with 8 sub-expansion zones, 2 new classes, zone revamps (cataclysm and dustwallow marsh), pet battles, dungeon revamps. I'd say heirloom gear too, because while it's not exclusively a sub-cap feature, it services them.

Classes are not sub-max level content. Aside from the DK starting point, which only existed due to the starting level being at 55, classes themselves require nothing other than simply being. There is nothing to say there won't be new races and sub-expansion zones. For those that want to see them, the zones will be there. And you'll still be able to boost your character to 90 after you're done. The dungeon revamps only exist because they've been made into Heroics, for max level. So that doesn't apply at all. And who cares about Heirloom gear? MoP didn't have any Heirloom gear aside from the weapon that drops from Garrosh, which is only beneficial in the NEXT expansion. I mean, the entire reason Heirloom gear even exists is to help alleviate the issue that they're looking to eliminate with selling character boosts. You know, leveling.

Now, as for Pet Battles. I listed it, but it doesn't apply. Since it's not specifically sub-max level content. Pet Battles aren't level dependent (unless your level is too low to advance to the next level for pets). Boosting a toon to 90 doesn't suddenly make them unlikely to put pet battles in older zones. As for the zone revamps for Cataclysm, it was a colossal waste of resources that didn't achieve what they were hoping it would. Yes, it streamlined the leveling process and made it more accessible. No, it didn't do much to deter people who saw a game on its 3rd expansion and said "It's gonna take me forever to level." As for Dustwallow Marsh, it fit the story, so they did it. People leveling through wasn't the reasoning behind it. It wasn't content specifically created for anyone under max level.

- - - Updated - - -

There are positives to boosts like this, but I don't believe a population boom is one of them.

The boost that comes with the expansion is far more likely to create a population boom. It will appeal to both sets of players, old and new. It'll appeal to the old players that don't want to have to level 20-30 levels to get to max level to enjoy the content. It'll also appeal to the new players that look at "100" along with a subscription and say "No thanks. I'll always feel behind." I've said this numerous times, but WoD is almost like a reboot. Yes the game and the engine are the same, but it's allowing every single player that picks it up to be on the same playing field.

[Deleted]

It's not even that the leveling content is bad or boring or anything like that. It's that people have done it to death with multiple toons, and they really can't be bothered to do it for the umpteenth time. So these people that don't want to deal with leveling again or perhaps server+faction transferring, will just opt to buy a max level character on their friends server or faction or bring an alt up to raid level to run with friends. This doesn't kill the option of doing it the "old fashioned" way, and it's still available (not to mention it would save money).

Still doesn't explain why players should have to pay for it. If it's needed, it should be free, it doesn't even take extra development time like the cash shop pets and mounts.

[Deleted]

I love when someone says this "pay2win" is killing gaming, I wonder how since it has been part of gaming since the beginning.

But the truth is, it's contributing to WoW's decline. It might not kill it but WoW is already losing subs at alarming rate and this certainly isn't going to help.

[roahn the warlock]

People already could get instant high level characters with RAF.

Even without RAF people could just pay someone else to level up their characters.

This existed before WoW. Players have been paying for shortcuts in games since games were invented. Remember Game Genie? It is part of game culture.

I love when someone says this "pay2win" is killing gaming, I wonder how since it has been part of gaming since the beginning.

When did "gamers" become so self-serious that using cheat codes became something so evil?

Pay2win? Nah, what about pay2notgrind?

WoW next expansion should be called Heroes of the Storm in a Teacup

this is a miltiplayer game, difference i dont mind the one feee 90. being able to get more? no. if someone wants to go the rediculous way more power to them

[charliebr0wn85]

I gotta be completely honest. If I had started playing this game since Vanilla...yes I'd be pretty annoyed that they're gonna start selling level 90 boosts.

HOWEVER!...I only started playing WoW after Cataclysm was released...and part of the reason why I started was because of how easy it was to level up and catch up to my friends that were already playing end-game content. So I think...if being able to tell someone "Hey...start playing WoW today and you can start at level 90 with me and we can play together"...is gonna make more people join up...then good. It's not really going to affect the hardcore players. It just means they have more people on the server if anything. Numbers are dwindling so fast...they're basically on 'keep the lights on' mode.

[fengosa]

But the truth is, it's contributing to WoW's decline. It might not kill it but WoW is already losing subs at alarming rate and this certainly isn't going to help.

The same can be said about any decision Blizzard makes. It doesn’t make it true.

[Aurimas]

The slippery slope has finally ended

Thank god. That means the end of the world threads should be coming to a close.
/wishfulthinking

[charliebr0wn85]

Also, WoW is losing subs...it's a normal thing. This game is what...9 years old? It's a 9 year old game...people are gonna stop playing it. That's just how games work. That's why Blizzard is making another MMO...a WoW Successor. They're doing everything they can to make the game as appealing as possible to NEW subscriptions. I say they're doing a great job. This new character revamp...UI revamp...etc...is gonna make it feel like a brand new game for a lot of people...and for some people it WILL be a new game. If it keeps the ball rolling for another year or so...great. Truth is...WoW is reaching it's end...and we're all just hanging on until it finally stops.

[Melchior]

But the truth is, it's contributing to WoW's decline. It might not kill it but WoW is already losing subs at alarming rate and this certainly isn't going to help.

Neither you nor I can definitively say why subscriptions are dropping... but personally, I feel it's more likely they drop over time because of the game's age much moreso than any development decision they could possibly make.

Blizzard seems to believe that this change will help the longevity of the game, by getting returning players back in the current content with their friends. Only time will tell who is right... but regardless of any decision, WoW will end one day. I personally believe that it won't be soon, and I'll be having fun for the foreseeable future.

[Trubo]

I can't wait to see what the fanboys say when Blizz start selling epic gear in the store.

"Well, it's not the best gear in the game, so it's not pay to win"

World of Warcraft: The game that's so fun to play people pay money to skip almost everything in it.

WoW is officially nothing more than 1 raid now.

That's fallacious as you'd actually be spending money for a tangible power up; based on what we've seen with RaF and SoR it's likely that the free 90 will be given the level 90 vendor greens you can pick up from various spots in Pandaria (if provided during MoP) or timeless isle/normal ToT equivalent stuff (for WoD).

But the truth is, it's contributing to WoW's decline. It might not kill it but WoW is already losing subs at alarming rate and this certainly isn't going to help.

And I believe that the current model is daunting to new players, preventing them from ever subbing. In addition, current players don't particularly wish to level additional characters so when they get bored of the class or two they have maxed they cancel their sub since there's nothing really for them to do that doesn't require a fairly significant time investment in something they don't enjoy.

[Deleted]

The same can be said about any decision Blizzard makes. It doesn’t make it true.

Yes it does, they have made a lot of bad, unpopular decisions in the past few years and it shows from declining sub numbers. This one is going to be unpopular as well because most players actually don't want to pay.. other than die hard Blizzard fans who play anyway. For most it's going to be "if I already pay my $15 a month, why are they asking for more for this?".. it might not cause every single player to quit but even if they lose 2% to this, 1% to another unpopular change, 5% to that etc. it's going to add up.

[blackblade]

Personally, I am not absolutely horrified by the concept but I only started playing WoW properly a couple of months ago. I currently have only one 90, my Feral Druid, and a Mage which is almost level 90 now. I am looking forward to boosting a Warrior or Paladin to have more options to play with, as all my friends (long-term players) are character capped now and I don't want to force them to delete an existing character just to level with me. I plan on leveling my Shadow Priest, Monk and Death Knight to cap myself for the experience.

The only problem with power-leveling to 90 is that players may not fully understand their class and will have to go back and level professions and the like. However there is a plethora of good information out there now for people leveling new classes, also going back and grinding professions is not absolutely dreadful and means that there will still be a value for the old mats for those people who do still choose to grind/ new players.

The line would be crossed for me if they started selling gear. An ideal system for me would be to sell the level 90 boosts but boosted characters only receive a basic level 90 set and then go from there, this would avoid the problem of selling gear in the store for new 90s.

While opposed to paid 90's pre-WoD myself,

The L2P issue will be an issue regardless. There's people who've played the same class since vanilla and still play well below what people would consider to be an acceptable level. There might be a higher correlation between no clue wtf to do and free 90's, but it's a separate issue regardless.

Leveling professions might get easier in comparison to what you'd expect. You can already mine/herb pandarian herbs/ore at level 1. Blacksmithing has a bunch of vendor trash they can make to boost themselves to cap using only pandaria mats. You may be a suboptimal miner/blacksmith to start, but using that mining, you can quickly gather whatever's needed to get engineering or JC.

Yes it does, they have made a lot of bad, unpopular decisions in the past few years and it shows from declining sub numbers. This one is going to be unpopular as well because most players actually don't want to pay.. other than die hard Blizzard fans who play anyway. For most it's going to be "if I already pay my $15 a month, why are they asking for more for this?".. it might not cause every single player to quit but even if they lose 2% to this, 1% to another unpopular change, 5% to that etc. it's going to add up.

Given that everyone gets one free with the xpac, I'm not thinking this is a money issue. Chances are the free 90 will basically just be 40$ (the cost of another expansion) but you don't have to deal with transfering the toon to your main account (another 25$)

[Deleted]

And I believe that the current model is daunting to new players, preventing them from ever subbing. In addition, current players don't particularly wish to level additional characters so when they get bored of the class or two they have maxed they cancel their sub since there's nothing really for them to do that doesn't require a fairly significant time investment in something they don't enjoy.

Sure but as a new player, I wouldn't try a game, find it boring and then pay them even more money to skip the boring stuff.. I'd just find a new game thats less boring.

[Arbs]

Sweet in that case we don't have to hear about slippery slope arguments anymore.



Oes noes someone will get a gearless 90 without having to go through Jade Forest for the 40th time.

Or doing Brewery until their eyes bleed.

I know, if it has started than we shouldn't see countless forums threads about it right?? .

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Thank god. That means the end of the world threads should be coming to a close.
/wishfulthinking

We can only pray at this point.

[KurenaiXIII]

But the truth is, it's contributing to WoW's decline. It might not kill it but WoW is already losing subs at alarming rate and this certainly isn't going to help.

That's a fallacy. You have no proof that the boost to level 90 will affect the subscription rate--positively *or* negatively. WoW is a -ten year old- game. It's built on a ten year old engine. Anyone who thinks that WoW would have the same subscriber numbers now as it did during the height of its subs is just fooling themselves.

Even if you get a 'free' level 90 now--even if you get -ten- of them--that does not fundamentally change the experience of the game for others. *It does not affect you*. Giscoius(sp?) pointed at the AH economy or whatnot--implying that you could flood the market with crafted epics and make a set for yourself. But that isn't true. Even if you could buy characters to level 90 -right now-, they'd still have to train in professions and gather the raw materials needed. That's a major time investment to make in pretty much any set of professions, gathering and crafting alike.

People talk about the 'necessity' of the leveling experience. But look at how fast leveling is now. How much of the 'lore' do you really see? How many people--be honest--do you think deliberately stay in an area to do all the quests and see all the content before moving on? It's unrealistic to expect a new player to do that. They would be stuck for days, weeks, months, doing inconsequential quests. Learning about your character? Please. As so many have pointed out, leveling a character teaches you about maybe three or four buttons. You don't learn anything about how to properly play a character until you have to sit down and learn. Even if you just bomb the dungeons forever.

Instead of crying and moaning about 'the slippery slope' and 'what might be', take a look at what -is-. And right now, that is: if you preorder the digital WoD, you get your free level 90 boost at the time of pre-order (which will be Blizzard Soon(tm)). You possibly, not 100% guaranteed, may be able in the future to buy a character slot an upgrade to level 90 directly (as opposed to buying multiple copies of WoD).

That's -all-. Pay to win? Pay to start, more like.

[Trubo]

Sure but as a new player, I wouldn't try a game, find it boring and then pay them even more money to skip the boring stuff.. I'd just find a new game thats less boring.

So how does the option of being able to pay for a 90 affect that person who was going to quit anyway?

[Zaqwert]

Is buying gold P2W?

I mean, technically anyone can accumulate gold easily with grinding.

Isn't buying gold just "pay to avoid grinding" as well?

[soulzek]

you wont quit

[Sylreick]

Still doesn't explain why players should have to pay for it. If it's needed, it should be free, it doesn't even take extra development time like the cash shop pets and mounts.

They don't have to pay, that's the whole point. They have the OPTION to pay, if they desire it. It isn't needed, that's why it's considered optional. Optional things aren't meant to be free, because you can get by without it.

[Zalraki]

Look, I get why some of you are defending Blizzard. It's called denial.

By itself the eventual selling of lvl 90 chars might not seem like a big deal but it's another step closer to pay to win. Heck, remember how Blizzard said the XP potion would only be available in the Asian version of the game? Well surprise! Here's 500 XP potions for the price of 1, instant lvl 90.

It's started with pets, mounts, then transmog gear, then potions, then lvl 90. So guess what? Unless you're blind on purpose, a rational person can see the way it is going. It's just a matter of time.

They will slowly keep adding things until it really is pay to win. And the more people who "don't mind" the faster it will arrive.