What new paid-for features we will get in the first year of WoD?

[Aquamonkey]

Yes it does. Like or not, you are always competing with other players for things that have limited supply (guild spots, AH goods, mining nodes, etc. etc.). Buying power (lvl 90 characters, VP, etc.) gives you an advantage over other players, which is what we call "pay2win". You get an advantage because those who do not spend money have to use their time get those lvl 90s or VP or whatever, while you've already got them and can do something else.

Nice that you completely ignored the rest of the post.

So your argument is that the time saved not having to grind VP frees them up to add more competition out in the world and in the realm's economy? You realize that doesn't change much, right? There's already competition out in the world for that kind of stuff. Besides, there's already CRZ and server merging to pump up the competition in the economy.

If you are competing for guild spots, you'd already be doing things for gear that would get you VP without having to buy it (i.e. running scenarios/dungeons/LFR/Flex for gear).

[Horizon]

easily garrisons features, nothing that affects gameplay but cosmetic changes? Absolutely

[LeperHerring]

So your argument is that the time saved not having to grind VP frees them up to add more competition out in the world and in the realm's economy?

No, this is not about the mount of competition. They don't "add more competition", the amount of competition is the same, it's just that people who buy power have an advantage in it.

You realize that the difference is insignificant right? ... If you are competing for guild spots, you'd already be doing things that would get you VP without having to buy it (i.e. running scenarios/dungeons/LFR/Flex for gear).

No, I do not realize that. It's a competition, sometimes insignificant advantage over another person is all it takes. For example, if you're competing for a guild spot with someone equally skilled that plays and equal amount of time, but you went and bought yourself all possible alts from the Blizzard store, it might very well tip the scale in your favor and you get picked for the guild (simply because having high level alts makes you more valuable and makes you appear to have more experience even though you really don't).

[facerollin]

I'd pay for max professions.

[Treeskee]

Gear, Lock outs, special zones, new professions, hair cuts, hair colours, sub-race models, dance studio, transmog, weapons, vanity items, mounts, pets, special raids, new scenarios/dungeons, "appear offline" feature for battle.net, youtube integration, stat boots, garrison features, garrison rushing, increased caps, friends, hunter pets, dk pets, mage elementals, quivers, mana for hunters, 2200 gear, glad rank, spectral tiger, old ZG mounts, mandatory profession recipes (ie smelting ore), additional bag slots & transmog space. Just to name a few... laugh now, but you will see

[Aquamonkey]

No, this is not about the mount of competition. They don't "add more competition", the amount of competition is the same, it's just that people who buy power have an advantage in it.

Which is limited by everyone else running around farming regardless if they saved some time by buying VP.

No, I do not realize that. It's a competition, sometimes insignificant advantage over another person is all it takes. For example, if you're competing for a guild spot with someone equally skilled that plays and equal amount of time, but you went and bought yourself all possible alts from the Blizzard store, it might very well tip the scale in your favor and you get picked for the guild (simply because having high level alts makes you more valuable and makes you appear to have more experience even though you really don't).

If someone has all 11 classes, leveled them to 100, geared all of them up to be raid-ready, and is proficient at each to be considered for recruitment in any of those classes, then that guild damn well should consider them over you regardless if they bought boosts to 90.

And if you have time and proficiency to do that without buying boosts to 90, you'd only be about a week behind which isn't significant because of RNG loot drops.

[SL1200]

I hope they stop beating around the bush and let me buy a full set of heroic gear. I'm tired of raiding anyway.

[Pancaspe]

This isn't a Poll, it is a thinly veiled slippery slope Troll Post.

[Kaleredar]

The ability to shut people the hell up about "slippery slope blizz store" threads. That's what I want most.

[LeperHerring]

If someone has all 11 classes, leveled them to 100, geared all of them up to be raid-ready, and is proficient at each to be considered for recruitment in any of those classes, then that guild damn well should consider them over you regardless if they bought boosts to 90.

If someone puts in more effort and time then they should have an advantage over someone that doesn't, sure. That's not what I'm talking about though. I'm talking about two guys who put in equal amount of effort and time and skill, while one of them whipped out their credit card to buy an account full of lvl 90s, VP, BoE mounts/pets converted to a huge pile of gold in the AH, etc. etc. You know, the guy who gained an advantage doing nothing but paying, i.e., pay2win.

[Raelbo]

So your argument is that the time saved not having to grind VP frees them up to add more competition out in the world and in the realm's economy? You realize that doesn't change much, right? There's already competition out in the world for that kind of stuff. Besides, there's already CRZ and server merging to pump up the competition in the economy.

If you are competing for guild spots, you'd already be doing things for gear that would get you VP without having to buy it (i.e. running scenarios/dungeons/LFR/Flex for gear).

Sorry mate. I have been with you on the whole paid level 90 debate, but I can't agree on the VP for cash one.

The ability to complete your VP cap every week is a major factor in determining character power. Most players do not VP cap every week even if most raiders do - remember most players aren't raiders.

Having a level 90 is not a major factor in determining character power because it is assumed that almost everybody has a level 90.

[Count Zero]

There are two things I'd pay real cash for:

Headless Horseman mount (it's the thing I want most in the game, period, and it has eluded me all these years)

A 2nd void storage tab

[Aquamonkey]

If someone puts in more effort and time then they should have an advantage over someone that doesn't, sure. That's not what I'm talking about though. I'm talking about two guys who put in equal amount of effort and time and skill, while one of them whipped out their credit card to buy an account full of lvl 90s, VP, BoE mounts/pets converted to a huge pile of gold in the AH, etc. etc. You know, the guy who gained an advantage doing nothing but paying, i.e., pay2win.

And if you have time and proficiency to do that without buying boosts to 90, you'd only be about a week behind which isn't significant because of RNG loot drops.

Buying VP wouldn't change anything in this scenario, the person would cap on all those toons anyway just running scenarios/dungeons/LFR/Flex for gear to be raid-viable.

You greatly overstate the amount of gold people can get from selling cashshop mounts and pets for gold. There was 1 pet over 2 years ago. The game didn't end and the price dropped rapidly from all the people trying to take advantage of it.


EDIT: Has Blizzard added any more BoE items to the cash shop since then? Shouldn't there be a flood of such items according to the slippery slope guys?

[LeperHerring]

And if you have time and proficiency to do that without buying boosts to 90, you'd only be about a week behind which isn't significant because of RNG loot drops.

A week? Can you level an account full of 90s in a week? Can you get a million gold in a week?

Buying VP wouldn't change anything in this scenario, the person would cap on all those toons anyway just running scenarios/dungeons/LFR/Flex for gear.

Yes it would. Instead of having to spend time capping my VP, I could do something else, like grind gold, or gear up alts or whatever. If I buy my VP I now have an advantage over everyone else who has to spend time grinding it.

You greatly overstate the amount of gold people can get from selling cashshop mounts and pets for gold. There was 1 pet over 2 years ago. The game didn't end and the price dropped rapidly from all the people trying to take advantage of it.

One of the things I liked to do in game was to make gold by being skilled at trading and identifying gold making opportunities. That gave me an advantage in the game because with that gold I could buy important pieces at critical times (crafting mats after xpacs, new BoEs, etc.). Then BoE pets happened and a couple of people I knew made a whole bunch of gold just by essentially buying gold. Now they could match my AH bids even though I spend a lot of time and effort to put me in the position I was in. They paid-to-win.

[Aquamonkey]

A week? Can you level an account full of 90s in a week? Can you get a million gold in a week?

Yes it would. Instead of having to spend time capping my VP, I could do something else, like grind gold, or gear up alts or whatever. If I buy my VP I now have an advantage over everyone else who has to spend time grinding it.

I thought we were talking about someone who could maintain 11 max level toons as raid-viable... Running scenarios/dungeons/LFR/Flex on all of them every week for the gear to get them raid-viable... something that would simultaneously give VP cap without any extra effort.

And that's just classes... what about classes with multiple roles? Are these hypothetical people also gearing for each role too?

One of the things I liked to do in game was to make gold by being skilled at trading and identifying gold making opportunities. That gave me an advantage in the game because with that gold I could buy important pieces at critical times (crafting mats after xpacs, new BoEs, etc.). Then BoE pets happened and a couple of people I knew made a whole bunch of gold just by essentially buying gold. Now they could match my AH bids even though I spend a lot of time and effort to put me in the position I was in. They paid-to-win.

Is selling that 1 BoE pet even still a thing anymore? It came out over 2 years ago.

[Kaleredar]

Is selling that 1 BoE pet even still a thing anymore? It came out over 2 years ago.

I remember people bitched and moaned about that before it happened, and then... yeah, it didn't do anything. People weren't controlling server economies with Guardian cubs. I don't recall them selling for more than 2k gold, honestly. That's not a great "money-to-gold" conversion rate.

[Alandalus]

Garrisons seem designed for microtransactions. I'm sure you'll get a decent amount of stuff for playing, but I can imagine the WoW store having extra items to buy for your garrison.

[rda]

I remember people bitched and moaned about that before it happened, and then... yeah, it didn't do anything. People weren't controlling server economies with Guardian cubs. I don't recall them selling for more than 2k gold, honestly. That's not a great "money-to-gold" conversion rate.

That's simply because most of the gear drops from bosses. If the best gear in the game was coming from professions, for example, it'd be a different story totally.

[Raelbo]

The irony is overwhelming. You've actually concocted an argument to fill the place of my opinion and mockery so you can debunk it as a strawman.

Huh, you mean you weren't mocking "Blizzard and Blizzard apologist logic"?

Tell you what. YOU explain what you meant with your original post, and how I misinterpreted it. Seems to me you are simply trying to deflect this discussion away from you actually wrote.

[Kaleredar]

That's simply because most of the gear drops from bosses. If the best gear in the game was coming from professions, for example, it'd be a different story totally.

Maybe, but it didn't and doesn't. And honestly, as far as the guardian cub goes (especially NOW) you only ever need ONE of them. So you aren't going to be grabbing servers by the cojones because you've got something that everyone needs. Most people that would want one would probably buy them with real money first. People that have a lot of gold might spend 2k gold on it. MOST people wouldn't care enough to buy them. Not exactly a "bankable commodity."