Is Siege of Orgrimmar REALLY that hard?

[Trubo]

iirc Norushen one shots everyone in the raid at the same time on his enrage.

He doesn't kill people that are doing their challenge but yeah, boss despawns after killing everyone outside.

[alucardtnuoc]

seeing as I've been in a raid with a 515 warrior who ended up tanking all the way up to malk on HEROIC, it should be doable.... Good luck, won't be easy.

[Deja Thoris]

seeing as I've been in a raid with a 515 warrior who ended up tanking all the way up to malk on HEROIC, it should be doable.... Good luck, won't be easy.

Wow thats only 45 ilevels higher than what the OP is trying.

Also, overgeared healers much to keep him alive the little bits he actually actively tanked?

[taliey]

What makes SoO difficult in the first place?

Do you know your weaknesses (that is, liabilities/deficiencies that might lead to a wipe)?

Can you overcome these said weaknesses?

So long as people can clear content (and you have a clear idea of your limitations), you can too. You just have to emulate them.

All this coming from a non-PvE player too, lol.

[PrairieChicken]

Fron page in the OP, 28th June. Same as its always been.

He said he will do flex in 14th but that was scrapped, and then he posted that they will do LFR->Flex some time which no one knows

[Dracodraco]

Which is not at the same rate as during WotLK. The game treats your stats differently right now than it did when you were Lv.80.

Feel free to point me to any evidence of that, please. Apart from the fact that we've gotten more HP compared to tanks (AKA they added more stamina scaling/points to the gear), there hasn't been any changes that I am aware of. Heck, the fact that the percentage-wise increase in DPS for every item level remains largely the same between WOTLK, Cata and MoP suggests the same thing.

[coocoo]

What makes SoO difficult in the first place?

Enrage timer. Lots of people here seem unable to understand that little bit. You need to kill the boss before the enrage timer. X gear level gives you the ability to do Y amount of damage. If said amount of damage is NOT enough to kill the boss before the enrage time, you wipe. Plain & simple.

So long as people can clear content (and you have a clear idea of your limitations), you can too. You just have to emulate them.

All this coming from a non-PvE player too, lol.

Easy to say, not quite the same to actually be able to do it.

[Deleted]

Good luck! Just make shure that you will have better than good healers to heal :g

[Deleted]

seeing as I've been in a raid with a 515 warrior who ended up tanking all the way up to malk on HEROIC, it should be doable.... Good luck, won't be easy.

I'm skeptical about that tbh, at 515 ilvl, even with fully stacking stamina, you'll be in the oneshot range. Not gonna claim its impossible but damn close.
With same ilvl healers ? yeh, not gonna happen.

[Deleted]

I'm skeptical about that tbh, at 515 ilvl, even with fully stacking stamina, you'll be in the oneshot range. Not gonna claim its impossible but damn close.
With same ilvl healers ? yeh, not gonna happen.

I dont see that as completely impossible. I did the first 12 heroics on progression with 543 (with healers between 535-555). I did not really feel threatened as a tank except for siege and thok, but even those was not super hard to tank and would probably have been doable with 530 or lower. For the other 10 bosses I am certain it would be doable with a lot lower item level, like what alucardtnuoc mentioned, 515. I see no boss out of the first 10 that would have been a problem to tank with that item level, atleast as a paladin.

[Deleted]

I personally feel like its hard to gauge tbh. We also started progression in 54x range, but 515 is not only downgrading from tot heroic, its lower then tot normal.
Just 543 down to 530 is a big step(doable), but then 15 ilvls more ? Thats no cloak, meta and most likely more then 1 piece of timeless trash.

I'll remain a tad skeptical until someone links a video or stream

[Durandro]

Enrage timer.

Those enrage timers were hard to beat even with decent gear early on in progression. They are probably the tightest enrages of any tier so far (some individual bosses were tighter, but consistantly every boss seems to be pretty darn tight. Bar Garrosh, who's got a ridiculously long Enrage).

[Deleted]

I personally feel like its hard to gauge tbh. We also started progression in 54x range, but 515 is not only downgrading from tot heroic, its lower then tot normal.
Just 543 down to 530 is a big step(doable), but then 15 ilvls more ? Thats no cloak, meta and most likely more then 1 piece of timeless trash.

I'll remain a tad skeptical until someone links a video or stream

Well, I mean, the first 10 in 540 was a cakewalk, and to be honest thok and siegecrafter was also very easy in 540. With 530 it would still have been really easy. So I absolutely see 515 as very realistic, I do not see what fight of the first 10 that would cause a problem with 515 ilvl as tank. It would of course be challenging and difficult, but definately doable, so if he says he did it, I have no reason to disbelieve him as it is very much within the realms of posibilities.

If you would be tanking in 515 on my paladin, I would rank the bosses as;
Difficult: Iron Jugg, Shamans, Thok
Medium: Galakras, Spoils, Siegecrafter
Easy: Immerseus, Protectors, Norushen, Sha, Nazgrim, Malkorok
this is based on my previous experience of doing it at 540 and gauging how much leeway I felt like I had on each fight.

Of course this is purely from a tanking PoV. Healers and DPS would need to be well above 515 to beat the number checks on said fights, but for a tank it would be doable if the rest of the group is at 540-550+

[Jacob Sweets]

Mathematically speaking this will be easy to accomplish, I have no doubt that if these players are decently skilled and have a variety of classes to choose from varying on the fight that these players will make it very far. If you plan to use the same comp for every fight then most likely you guys will end up failing. Every player here will need a variety of 471 geared specs and classes in order to make this possible.

For immeruses, simply stack ele shaman, shadow priest or whatever dps class can heal and it will die very quickly. Most likely a 1 shot.

For protectors stack shadow priest, affliction warlocks etc and it will be easy. Reason is because those classes have insane OP multi dot damage along with crazy survivalbility.

For norushen, do the same as above. Plentty of adds to multi dot and the damage is carried on to the boss.

For Sha, stack mainly strong single target classes with decent cleave and great survivalbility AKA combat rogues along with destruction warlocks. Have warlocks havoc and destroy add in the back while rogues stay on boss. Feint / sact pact swelling prides so your healers can focus healing on the classes that actually need heals. Other than warlocks and rogues fill in everything else with classes that can provide the buffs/debuffs needed.

For galakaras, easy mode. Stack destruction warlocks, ele shaman and arms warriors for the ground. Rogues and shadow priest will also be very good here. Strong CDs for phase 2 along with strong personal defensive CDs. Send rogues and warlocks up for tower team.

Juggernaunt stack rogues/warlocks and any other class with strong personal or raid wide CDs. For p2 stack in a corner far away from boss for maximum aoe healing. Have shadow and similar classes help tanks with mines. Maybe a 3rd tank will be needed here.

Shamans - Use 3 tank method and should be cake. Allow destruction warlocks and ele shamans to handle slimes. Send 4 healers up on the hill along with high single target dps melee classes, rogues.

Nazgrim = easy mode. Bring hunters and other decent kiting classes for assasin and gg.

[Deleted]

Medium: Galakras, Spoils, Siegecrafter

Do you really reckon that you'd have enough dps for killing the shredders in time as 515 ilvl? I haven't really tanked it so I do not know how much leeway there is.

Mathematically speaking this will be easy to accomplish

Yeah... no.

[Dracodraco]

Mathematically speaking this will be easy to accomplish, I have no doubt that if these players are decently skilled and have a variety of classes to choose from varying on the fight that these players will make it very far. If you plan to use the same comp for every fight then most likely you guys will end up failing. Every player here will need a variety of 471 geared specs and classes in order to make this possible.

For immeruses, simply stack ele shaman, shadow priest or whatever dps class can heal and it will die very quickly. Most likely a 1 shot.

For protectors stack shadow priest, affliction warlocks etc and it will be easy. Reason is because those classes have insane OP multi dot damage along with crazy survivalbility.

For norushen, do the same as above. Plentty of adds to multi dot and the damage is carried on to the boss.

For Sha, stack mainly strong single target classes with decent cleave and great survivalbility AKA combat rogues along with destruction warlocks. Have warlocks havoc and destroy add in the back while rogues stay on boss. Feint / sact pact swelling prides so your healers can focus healing on the classes that actually need heals. Other than warlocks and rogues fill in everything else with classes that can provide the buffs/debuffs needed.

For galakaras, easy mode. Stack destruction warlocks, ele shaman and arms warriors for the ground. Rogues and shadow priest will also be very good here. Strong CDs for phase 2 along with strong personal defensive CDs. Send rogues and warlocks up for tower team.

Juggernaunt stack rogues/warlocks and any other class with strong personal or raid wide CDs. For p2 stack in a corner far away from boss for maximum aoe healing. Have shadow and similar classes help tanks with mines. Maybe a 3rd tank will be needed here.

Shamans - Use 3 tank method and should be cake. Allow destruction warlocks and ele shamans to handle slimes. Send 4 healers up on the hill along with high single target dps melee classes, rogues.

Nazgrim = easy mode. Bring hunters and other decent kiting classes for assasin and gg.

I just want to point out that most of this is common sense, and that you are severely overvalueing how strong classes were/are due to scaling. You aren't going to see a huge difference between destro lock/ele shaman and say, hunter AOE at lower levels.
Also, your dark shaman suggestion is hilarious. "Use 3 tanks, send 4 healers up the hill". So that's already 8 slots filled assuming you only have one healer downstairs. You wanna meet the enrage with 2 dps?

[Kryos]

The last 3 bosses are - we are 25 HC and right now we try Garrosh and he is a sonofabitch.

[Deleted]

Sub 100k sustained on single target. Remembering back to MSV, people were lucky to be pulling over 80k single target for very long.

Very high estimate people in actual blues, not the msv epics were more likely to do 50-70k Tops

[Hypasonic]

Mathematically speaking this will be easy to accomplish, I have no doubt that if these players are decently skilled and have a variety of classes to choose from varying on the fight that these players will make it very far. If you plan to use the same comp for every fight then most likely you guys will end up failing. Every player here will need a variety of 471 geared specs and classes in order to make this possible.

For immeruses, simply stack ele shaman, shadow priest or whatever dps class can heal and it will die very quickly. Most likely a 1 shot.

For protectors stack shadow priest, affliction warlocks etc and it will be easy. Reason is because those classes have insane OP multi dot damage along with crazy survivalbility.

For norushen, do the same as above. Plentty of adds to multi dot and the damage is carried on to the boss.

For Sha, stack mainly strong single target classes with decent cleave and great survivalbility AKA combat rogues along with destruction warlocks. Have warlocks havoc and destroy add in the back while rogues stay on boss. Feint / sact pact swelling prides so your healers can focus healing on the classes that actually need heals. Other than warlocks and rogues fill in everything else with classes that can provide the buffs/debuffs needed.

For galakaras, easy mode. Stack destruction warlocks, ele shaman and arms warriors for the ground. Rogues and shadow priest will also be very good here. Strong CDs for phase 2 along with strong personal defensive CDs. Send rogues and warlocks up for tower team.

Juggernaunt stack rogues/warlocks and any other class with strong personal or raid wide CDs. For p2 stack in a corner far away from boss for maximum aoe healing. Have shadow and similar classes help tanks with mines. Maybe a 3rd tank will be needed here.

Shamans - Use 3 tank method and should be cake. Allow destruction warlocks and ele shamans to handle slimes. Send 4 healers up on the hill along with high single target dps melee classes, rogues.

Nazgrim = easy mode. Bring hunters and other decent kiting classes for assasin and gg.

Wow, you make it sound so easy, and no..it's not mathematically "easy", sure you can stack (and its probably the only way to do it) DoT classes for protectors, but your shamans suggestion is borderline hilarity, I'm not even going to comment on that.

Stacking Ele shamans for galkaras you say? AT 471 ilvl ele shamans have a really low amount of mastery, you won't see them "owning" the meters as they can do there at high end gear, you'd be better off with SV hunters IMO...

[Deleted]

Wow, you make it sound so easy, and no..it's not mathematically "easy", sure you can stack (and its probably the only way to do it) DoT classes for protectors, but your shamans suggestion is borderline hilarity, I'm not even going to comment on that.

Stacking Ele shamans for galkaras you say? AT 471 ilvl ele shamans have a really low amount of mastery, you won't see them "owning" the meters as they can do there at high end gear, you'd be better off with SV hunters IMO...

Not an expert on CM's, but isn't chain lightning still massive in those? Gear levels are roughly same.