3v3 - MW/ELE/AFFLOCK trouble

[Tinamarina]

So my friends and i just started seriously playing together as Mistweaver/Ele shaman/ Affliction lock, we have done a few sessions of arenas but dont really feel like we are getting the result we should be. We have all been 2k + before, but for some reason we cant push past the 1700 bracket...

We are currently struggling against other caster cleaves / warriors as a whole.

Is there anything outstanding on how we should push past the trench rating other than basic, sit behind pillars.

Also as a mistweaver , if we verse a melee cleave i seem to be going OoM very quickly due to having to use Burst heals to keep team mates alive, Help :/

[Dsfunctional]

Are you having a hard time killing stuff? I've ran ele/aff on my alt warlock and find that although there is decent pressure, it's not enough to have all 3 enemy's die without picking a kill target (where boomy/aff shines). I went destro and things went much smoother, perhaps suggest to your warlock playing a few games as destro to see how things turn out. I wouldn't recommend regemming/reforging to it right out the gate because some people hate playing desto, and are terrible at it.

Targets will drop a little easier doing this.

I've never played a MW before, just with them so I don't want to mislead you with information which may not be true.

[Chuupag]

I can tell you that my team, elemental shaman, ret pally, and myself a mistweaver, that I always oom before other healers mainly because mw primary regeneration mechanic gets thrown out the window when you have to healing sphere spam. They also can put out the most damage of any healer through CJL and xuen. In my experience the worst burst to heal through is hunters openers especially if they have a melee with them. But just melee by themselves are not that bad unless is a MS couple with necrotic heal absorb really.

[Deleted]

You basically play at a pillar till your ele shaman gets a bunch of procs and kills someone. Kinda sad, but that's the only way to play that comp. GL

[Deleted]

We have all been 2k + before, but for some reason we cant push past the 1700 bracket...

2k in the past doesn't matter much in the current season: the meta-game has changed and several factors have increased the skill required to reach rating like 2-2.2k, which now compare to 1.7-1.9k.
This is not to say that your team sucks, simply that the game has gotten harder.

That said, LSD is one of the strongest comps right now, and you're only problem in that department is that you're running as mistweaver, which is one of the weakest healers for this kind of gameplay.

We are currently struggling against other caster cleaves / warriors as a whole.

Hard to comment without seeing you play or some additional replays, but some minor advice:

Against warriors: as a caster cleave, warriors are very viable targets. Your ele shaman only way of pressuring is with damage, so you guys should lure the warrior and make him overextend, then swap to him with a stun/hex. The game of hide and seek in the pillars was pushed into the background (meaning every decent player does it), and replaced by a much more fast-paced switch between offensive and defensive (which is encouraged with the amount of insta cc around).

Against caster cleaves: this is the hardest type of comp for you as a monk, but your shaman provides great utility which should keep you going for a while: if you guys have 2k experience but are playing at 1.7k mmr, things like grounding traps/shearin polies and fears, tremoring wyverns, etc etc, should be an acquired habit. As a monk, you're very dependant in your teammates for avoiding cc, so in this particular issue, check if the shaman is doing his job.

Also as a mistweaver , if we verse a melee cleave i seem to be going OoM very quickly due to having to use Burst heals to keep team mates alive,

It's easy to identify the problem here: your team is not reducing pressure. Let's do a check list:

1. Monk always has 3 orbs near the ele for him to eat when monk get's CCed
2. Shaman is not using healing stream on cooldown, but it's using it for pressure/cc on monk
3. Demonic gateway is always down, and the shaman prevents the enemy team from interrupting warlock at the start of the game
4. Monk is abusing grapple weapon, using disable between shockwaves, and using para against incoming cc
5. Team isn't always going for a kill on the most viable target (catching a player in a bad position, not just in terms of location, tends to work better except for special cases like warlocks)

Assuming you do all this, the most likely explanation is that you're not usin EM enough. Yes I know, EM seems too weak to respond to a melee cleave, but it's really not. Keep spammin chi brew AND avert harm (melee cleaves won't switch to you 90% of the times). And while we're here, you are aware that spammin soothing mists is better than channeling it right? It's higher hps and chi generation, and should be done every time you can in order to pool chi for another EM right away. You'll end up with LOADS of mana tea, so make sure you spam mana tea as well, there are still players who think they can interrupt it and lock you.

I played LSD with both rdruid and mw monk to +2k ratings this season, so if you have any more advice, just ask. If you really want to improve, I'd advice recording some of your games (software like bandicam can be installed and ready to record in less than 1 minute) and then showing them to us. But don't give up: monks are not the easiest healers for caster cleaves or vs caster cleaves, so you really need alert teammates in order to keep things flowing.

PS: the above comment is actually true: your ele's only way to do pressure is do damage, and loads of it. Help him be as offensive as possible and you'll do enough pressure to make the enemy go defensive.

[zenga]

The major issue I have found with this comp is glyph of paralysis and the monk using it on CD. It removes so much damage (pressure) from this comp that you might want to reconsider how you use paralysis.

[Tinamarina]

Woah, thankyou everyone for your replies, actually helped a hell of alot...

It's easy to identify the problem here: your team is not reducing pressure. Let's do a check list:

1. Monk always has 3 orbs near the ele for him to eat when monk get's CCed
2. Shaman is not using healing stream on cooldown, but it's using it for pressure/cc on monk
3. Demonic gateway is always down, and the shaman prevents the enemy team from interrupting warlock at the start of the game
4. Monk is abusing grapple weapon, using disable between shockwaves, and using para against incoming cc
5. Team isn't always going for a kill on the most viable target (catching a player in a bad position, not just in terms of location, tends to work better except for special cases like warlocks)

Assuming you do all this, the most likely explanation is that you're not usin EM enough. Yes I know, EM seems too weak to respond to a melee cleave, but it's really not. Keep spammin chi brew AND avert harm (melee cleaves won't switch to you 90% of the times). And while we're here, you are aware that spammin soothing mists is better than channeling it right? It's higher hps and chi generation, and should be done every time you can in order to pool chi for another EM right away. You'll end up with LOADS of mana tea, so make sure you spam mana tea as well, there are still players who think they can interrupt it and lock you.

extremely helpful, thankyou man

Ty all so much

- - - Updated - - -

is there any way that we could beat Original LSD ( with a Rdruid)
ive found that they just out cc me in every way, and its really hard to be able to cast with cyclones agaisnt me

[Anium]

You basically play at a pillar till your ele shaman gets a bunch of procs and kills someone. Kinda sad, but that's the only way to play that comp. GL

Honestly, basically this. It's virtually impossible for you to get killed as long as you hump. Pretty sure you'll outright win when dampening sets in as well...

[Dsfunctional]

2k in the past doesn't matter much in the current season: the meta-game has changed and several factors have increased the skill required to reach rating like 2-2.2k, which now compare to 1.7-1.9k.
This is not to say that your team sucks, simply that the game has gotten harder.

That said, LSD is one of the strongest comps right now, and you're only problem in that department is that you're running as mistweaver, which is one of the weakest healers for this kind of gameplay.

That's not their only problem, the other and biggest problem is they're not running true LSD or LSD 2.0 which shine for many reasons. Have your Warlock switch to Destro and you'll be fine running with the MW til 2.2k

LSD - Destro Lock, Ele Sham, Rdruid - more traditional play still, picking kill targets and burning them, occasional swaps, etc.
LSD 2 - Affliction Lock, Balance Druid, Rsham - kills come over time through dots, lot of over all pressure, nearly impossible to heal

Rolling Affliction Lock, Ele Sham, Rdruid just doesn't have the same effect as how LSD or LSD 2 is ran, and I can completely understand why their having a harder time with matches. If the MW is skilled and understands their class, the healer isn't the biggest issue here, if your two dps can't kill shit efficiently than of course hes going oom.

I'm not quite use how he over looked this aspect as the remainder of his post seems very informative. But taken from someone who plays both LSD (2250CR) & LSD 2 (2370CR) on two separate warlocks, and has fooled around with the variations of swamping the dps around it's important you roll with the correct warlock spec.

[Tinamarina]

LSD - Destro Lock, Ele Sham, Rdruid - more traditional play still, picking kill targets and burning them, occasional swaps, etc.
LSD 2 - Affliction Lock, Balance Druid, Rsham - kills come over time through dots, lot of over all pressure, nearly impossible to heal

Rolling Affliction Lock, Ele Sham, Rdruid just doesn't have the same effect as how LSD or LSD 2 is ran, and I can completely understand why their having a harder time with matches. If the MW is skilled and understands their class, the healer isn't the biggest issue here, if your two dps can't kill shit efficiently than of course hes going oom.

I'm not quite use how he over looked this aspect as the remainder of his post seems very informative. But taken from someone who plays both LSD (2250CR) & LSD 2 (2370CR) on two separate warlocks, and has fooled around with the variations of swamping the dps around it's important you roll with the correct warlock spec.

I understand destruction can be good, but maybe its better with a druid rather than a MW seeming we have virtually no peeling ( druids have clone and roots etc.) so i cannot stop people sitting on the destruction and making then unable to cast, hence why i feel Afflock is a lot better in our situation.
I think our main problem at the moment after taking these tips into consideration is just scoring kills, maybe our dps needs to Co-op better with burst and hopefully results will come.

The major issue I have found with this comp is glyph of paralysis and the monk using it on CD. It removes so much damage (pressure) from this comp that you might want to reconsider how you use paralysis.

I completely agree but which glyph would i use instead? Im baffled

Thankyou all

[zenga]

I completely agree but which glyph would i use instead? Im baffled

I don't know how to play MW monk, all I know is that it's annoying as hell as ele or as lock when your monk randomly saps targets with the glyph on. If the enemy healer isn't sleeping and he notices that flame shock got removed on 1 target, he pretty much can immediately dispel someone else and eat the UA as it will negate the dmg from the shaman for a good 10 seconds (as a lock it's less of a problem but it has fucked me over a couple of times when I had strong dots going). That being said I don't think you can play without the glyph, but instead the monk should be more careful who to use sap on, and clearly communicate with the team so they know. When going for a kill or when your team is in trouble than obviously glyphed sap is a winner. Pretty sure the higher rated monks don't randomly sap the enemy team.

TLDR if you sap at random as a monk then it does more bad than good for your team if you play with ele/affliction