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  1. #701
    The Insane Kujako's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shamburger View Post
    Congratz to everyone who demanded $15/hr. Your replacements are here, now you make $0/hr
    Yes... Ronald McDonald traveled back in time to build the kiosks so they would be ready for the minimum wage increase.

    Again, welfare state where tax payer money goes to support people who can't get a living wage (what we have now), or increase in the minimum wage. Pick one.
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  2. #702
    Quote Originally Posted by jakeic View Post
    Wyoming has Yellowstone and devil's tower!
    Jackson Hole is a fun town.

    Would recommend.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Kujako View Post
    Again, welfare state where tax payer money goes to support people who can't get a living wage (what we have now), or increase in the minimum wage. Pick one.
    Option C: Thin the herd

  3. #703
    Quote Originally Posted by Shamburger View Post
    Congratz to everyone who demanded $15/hr. Your replacements are here, now you make $0/hr

    Someone still has to actually prepare the food and clean the facilities though. We have had automatic machines substituting professions for years now, for example ATMs. It's a natural progression of technology and not some knee jerk reaction to not being able to afford $15/hour labor. These things would have been implemented even if the minimum wage remained unchanged.

  4. #704
    Quote Originally Posted by Yvaelle View Post
    I have size 12, wide feet, with high arches - just means you have to try more stuff on / find stuff designed for your feet
    I once needed a pair of black dress shoes for a special occasion, before the proliferation of the internet. I went to four different department stores and two different shoe stores between those six stores I found 1 pair of shoes the correct length that I could fit my feet into but it was far to tight. the last place I went to specialized in dress ware, where I found I had two options for shoes. It was the first time that I had to buy shoes as an adult and it was an awful, awful experience.

    with the internet it is easier to find shoes that fit, but still my choices are severely limited, the only name brand athletic shoe that is made wide enough is from New Balance.
    Last edited by jakeic; 2016-04-04 at 10:18 PM.

  5. #705
    Merely a Setback breadisfunny's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ayla View Post
    I had hoped you were female. But, you probably have 5x the amount of shoes I have. (I have 3 pairs)

    I am a shame to my gender. (Plus shoe shopping is awful, and I'd rather shoot myself in the foot)
    i have exactly two pairs. which i am replacing this month.
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  6. #706
    Quote Originally Posted by Shamburger View Post
    Congratz to everyone who demanded $15/hr. Your replacements are here, now you make $0/hr

    they've had these in supermarket for a dozen years, you think 15 dollars an hour is the reason they are there?
    if they could save 50 cents an hour they would put them in


    btw

    i was making 7.00 an hour at mcdonalds in 1988...its now 2016..and they are not even paying these people 10-11 dollars?

    $7.00 in 1988 dollars is:
    $16.82 in 2014 dollars
    Social Security Wage Index, 1951-2014

    at this rate in 2023 when the min wage is 15, it should really be over 20.

    Mcdonalds has been raising the prices on items and have taken none of that price increase and pass it on to labor.


    and why such the hate over people making 15? do you not think you should be making more money too? next time you go for a raise why not give us a heads up so we can find out which company you work for, how it will increase prices on the rest of us....so we can protest you getting a raise.

    don't worry, don't increase pay...just please stop crying about welfare and food stamps increasing each year and you paying more taxes. Mcdonalds, walmart, etc just pass the cost on to you, the taxpayer.

  7. #707
    Quote Originally Posted by Yvaelle View Post
    I have size 12, wide feet, with high arches - just means you have to try more stuff on / find stuff designed for your feet
    and thus the path to addiction begins......

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Zan15 View Post
    they've had these in supermarket for a dozen years, you think 15 dollars an hour is the reason they are there?
    if they could save 50 cents an hour they would put them in


    btw

    i was making 7.00 an hour at mcdonalds in 1988...its now 2016..and they are not even paying these people 10-11 dollars?

    $7.00 in 1988 dollars is:
    $16.82 in 2014 dollars
    Social Security Wage Index, 1951-2014

    at this rate in 2023 when the min wage is 15, it should really be over 20.

    Mcdonalds has been raising the prices on items and have taken none of that price increase and pass it on to labor.


    and why such the hate over people making 15? do you not think you should be making more money too? next time you go for a raise why not give us a heads up so we can find out which company you work for, how it will increase prices on the rest of us....so we can protest you getting a raise.

    don't worry, don't increase pay...just please stop crying about welfare and food stamps increasing each year and you paying more taxes. Mcdonalds, walmart, etc just pass the cost on to you, the taxpayer.
    The ironic thing is that you have stories about increases in food stamp / welfare usage because of the proliferation of low pay and the political right wing howls with rage. Then when states try to fix it by forcing up the minimum wage the political right wing again howls with rage.

    Honestly what do they want? That the poor hurry up and starve to death? There isn't really any other choice, and no getting a better job won't fix it since if they all tried it would simply devalue the wage of that better job.

  8. #708
    Merely a Setback Adam Jensen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ayla View Post
    I am a shame to my gender. (Plus shoe shopping is awful, and I'd rather shoot myself in the foot)
    Can you please replace my sisters? They've dragged me into so many shoe stores that I have dreams of shoes now. Nightmares!
    Putin khuliyo

  9. #709
    Banned Orlong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zan15 View Post

    Mcdonalds has been raising the prices on items and have taken none of that price increase and pass it on to labor.
    They raise prices because the cost of ingredients and overhead such as electricity keep raising. Its not all profit

  10. #710
    Quote Originally Posted by Orlong View Post
    They raise prices because the cost of ingredients and overhead such as electricity keep raising. Its not all profit
    They raised prices because they can make more money by raising prices regardless of increased costs.

  11. #711
    Really a great time to do this when automated robots are right on the horizon.

    All the people cheering this and who supported it are going to be crying when the jobs are replaced with robots.
    Quote Originally Posted by Venant View Post
    I feel bad for all those 'protesters' at the Trump rally, it's like the real life equivalent of making a 40 man raid in WoW and not having the boss spawn, thereby denying them a chance at looting.
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    That's a nonsense argument that ignores what words mean.

  12. #712
    I Don't Work Here Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jakeic View Post
    A persons desire to buy shoes is directly tied to how easy it is to find shoes that fit. As someone with unusually wide feet, I think people who buy shoes every month or two are crazy.
    I know, right?

    Size 11, width F. Yes, one past EEE. If you find "wide width" shoes in a shoe store, chances are they're E, rather than the standard D. SOMETIMES, they might go as far as EEE. F? Never seen 'em on a shelf. Ever. In my life. I get by through finding E or EEE shoes that have enough 'give' that I can wear 'em, mostly. Since the alternative is paying much dinero for custom-made shoes.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Luxxor View Post
    Really a great time to do this when automated robots are right on the horizon.

    All the people cheering this and who supported it are going to be crying when the jobs are replaced with robots.
    "Automation will mean a massive loss of jobs" is a refrain that's been chanted for two centuries, now, and has never brought about anything like what you're claiming.

    If we do develop robots that can automate low-end labor that effectively across the board, we'll be bordering on a societal shift that's comparable to the invention of agriculture, for humanity. Expecting modern systems to survive that kind of shift is like expecting gathering wild berries for a living to be an important role in modern society.


  13. #713
    Quote Originally Posted by jakeic View Post
    A persons desire to buy shoes is directly tied to how easy it is to find shoes that fit. As someone with unusually wide feet, I think people who buy shoes every month or two are crazy.
    So basically Chris Brown

  14. #714
    Banned Orlong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zan15 View Post


    and why such the hate over people making 15? do you not think you should be making more money too? next time you go for a raise why not give us a heads up so we can find out which company you work for, how it will increase prices on the rest of us....so we can protest you getting a raise.
    The hate is because for people making $15 and over now will experience a loss in buying power due to price increases. Not to mention all the years of working your way up to $15 will have been wasted While some snot nosed kid with no skills right out of high school will be making the same thing. They need to pay their dues and work their way up like we all did. And I dont want to hear how we can negotiate for raises because no company is going to give everyone a $7 raise to make up for the no skill people getting one. Yeah everyone else will see increases over time but we want compensated right away, not over the course of 6 years

  15. #715
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    "Automation will mean a massive loss of jobs" is a refrain that's been chanted for two centuries, now, and has never brought about anything like what you're claiming.

    If we do develop robots that can automate low-end labor that effectively across the board, we'll be bordering on a societal shift that's comparable to the invention of agriculture, for humanity. Expecting modern systems to survive that kind of shift is like expecting gathering wild berries for a living to be an important role in modern society.
    That is exactly what I'm suggesting and it will be a gigantically fundamental change. How has technology not replaced the common worker gradually over time? Its an inevitability.

    Big business in America will respond to this by cutting jobs and automating. Its already happening.
    Quote Originally Posted by Venant View Post
    I feel bad for all those 'protesters' at the Trump rally, it's like the real life equivalent of making a 40 man raid in WoW and not having the boss spawn, thereby denying them a chance at looting.
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    That's a nonsense argument that ignores what words mean.

  16. #716
    Banned Orlong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zan15 View Post
    don't worry, don't increase pay...just please stop crying about welfare and food stamps increasing each year and you paying more taxes. Mcdonalds, walmart, etc just pass the cost on to you, the taxpayer.
    We can bitch about welfare too. They should be working 2 jobs like we all did growing up until they earn the experience where they can get a better job with higher pay. Handouts need to be stopped, personal AND corporate

  17. #717
    Quote Originally Posted by Orlong View Post
    We can bitch about welfare too. They should be working 2 jobs like we all did growing up until they earn the experience where they can get a better job with higher pay. Handouts need to be stopped, personal AND corporate
    I wonder what would greatly help reduce the need for welfare handouts...hmm. Oh yea, a livable wage!

  18. #718
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orlong View Post
    We can bitch about welfare too. They should be working 2 jobs like we all did growing up until they earn the experience where they can get a better job with higher pay. Handouts need to be stopped, personal AND corporate
    You can bitch about both all you like, but you are supporting one side with the above. We've been through it already, no need to repeat history:

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  19. #719
    The Undying Cthulhu 2020's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by woozie21 View Post
    Give more money to people that "flip burgers" for a living, I am sure a person with the burger flipping skills needs to be paid more money for it.
    Paying 2400 a month (if the person worked 40 hours a week) to a person flipping burgers, are you kidding me? :S
    This is one of those pants on head arguments that clueless people tend to tote out. Most people on minimum wage aren't working in fast food, and most people on minimum wage are working there either to bring in a second income for their household or they're people with marketable skills working until they find a better job. The vast majority of people on minimum wage actually perform pretty tough labor.

    Ever worked a minimum wage job? Probably the HARDEST job you will ever work. It may not be a specific skill, but you bust your ass working for minimum wage. At least every place I've ever encountered and knew about their work culture did not allow slacking.

    Although a lot of people I see who are against the minimum wage got mom and dad to pay their way through college into a good job, so they've never actually worked a hard day in their life.
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  20. #720
    Fluffy Kitten Yvaelle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    "Automation will mean a massive loss of jobs" is a refrain that's been chanted for two centuries, now, and has never brought about anything like what you're claiming.

    If we do develop robots that can automate low-end labor that effectively across the board, we'll be bordering on a societal shift that's comparable to the invention of agriculture, for humanity. Expecting modern systems to survive that kind of shift is like expecting gathering wild berries for a living to be an important role in modern society.
    That's not true at all - we have transitional unemployment all the time as the result of new technology. Like for example, some hundreds of years ago - the principle job was "farm hand" - because scything wheat was laborious. Then with motorized combines, one dude can mow entire fields in a matter of hours. Now combines are fully automated - they reap, thresh, and winnow - all while navigating a field via GPS and laser sensors, and they drop off the product at the drop point. We went from the principle human profession, to 0 human involvement - in less than 100 years.

    That doesn't mean most would-be farmhands of yesteryear, are today unemployed - we invented new jobs to fill all those gaps - first in industrial manufacturing - then in computing and retail. So you're right that automation hasn't resulted in permanent unemployment, but it does result in transitional unemployment - while new jobs are invented, after the old jobs have become obsolete.

    What may be different this time isn't automation taking our jobs - it's been doing that since the dawn of human history. It's that the speed with which humans transition from one job to the next is not decreasing as quickly as technology may soon make new jobs obsolete. This means that we may go through waves of transitional unemployment - for example when all 'drivers' are suddenly made obsolete by self-driving cars - but before they can all become 'carpenters' - a few years of training - CarpenterBot will hit the market and enable 1 senior carpenter (someone with decades of experience already) to orchestrate the construction of an entire building: by supervising a team of CarpenterBots: no need for low-experience carpentry labourers.

    All the Drivers-Turned-Carpenters decide to become Programmers so they can make the next generation of Automation: surely that will save them. They spend some years in school - but then suddenly there are sentient AI who program stuff better than we ever will (or rather, non-sentient learning algorithms equipped with robot arms, who can learn new tasks and optimize them better and faster than a human can program them).

    If the waves of transition unemployment from the increased rate of technology, lead to increased frequency of transitional unemployment - then it becomes permanent unemployment: because we can't uptake new professions as quickly as they become obsolete.

    Now, in the short-term - I see this as a real threat. In the longer-term however, once we have the Basic Income Problem fixed, this will only lead to people doing more human-oriented professions: music, art, tutoring, care, service, etc. There will still be those lone dudes out there doing Carpentry professionally (rather than as a passion or craft) - but it will be 1 dude, orchestrating 5 robots - throwing together a mansion in a week. Rather than 10 dudes over the course of months or years.

    We have been, and will continue to, make labour obsolete. This only multiplies the power of 'Craft' that we wield. Ultimately we'll turn the world into something like MineCraft - a bunch of empowered users running around building castles (albeit via robots) - because we can: because we have eliminated the 'labour' from 'work'.
    Last edited by Yvaelle; 2016-04-05 at 12:10 AM.
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