[BETA] Demonology Warlock Discussion

[Deleted]

These legendarys, providing they go live like this, are looking very interesting (let's hope they are rare like pepe)
http://legion.wowhead.com/item=132393/recurrent-ritual
" Call Dreadstalkers refunds 2 Soul Shards. "
http://legion.wowhead.com/item=13236...rior-summoning
"Reduce the cooldown of Doomguard and Infernal by 2.0 seconds for every Dreadstalker, Wild Imp, or Beholder you summon."
http://legion.wowhead.com/item=132379/sindorei-spite
"For 20 sec after casting Summon Doomguard or Summon Infernal, you and your minions deal 40% increased damage."
http://legion.wowhead.com/item=13237...ks-final-curse
"Doom deals 5% increased damage for every demon pet you have active."

[Deleted]

Stupidly overpowered and guaranteed to generate friction in a raid when some folk have them and some don't. Not to mention those that don't will feel very pressured to get them.

Which is, of course, the whole idea, to motivate people into grinding.

[Baconeggcheese]

The dreadstalker one would be funny with demonic calling.

Call dreadstalkers would just give you 2 shards.

[Deleted]

Stupidly overpowered and guaranteed to generate friction in a raid when some folk have them and some don't. Not to mention those that don't will feel very pressured to get them.

Which is, of course, the whole idea, to motivate people into grinding.

well, i can see some locks being more annoyed by the fact that there is a limit of 5 legendaries but demo locks only have 4 usable legendaries, the 5th benefits you only if you have instant cast spells which demo does not have, except for something like implosion.

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The dreadstalker one would be funny with demonic calling.

Call dreadstalkers would just give you 2 shards.

yeah, it basically turns call dreadstalker into a shard generator.

too bad you can only get the 40% dmg buff once every 3 min coz with the ring you could have had an uptime of potentially 20-25% which would be insane.

[Deleted]

you most likely wanna take the 8 sec still>4 sec cast on the move legendary anyway

[Deleted]

you most likely wanna take the 8 sec still>4 sec cast on the move legendary anyway

i think that item has been removed, atleast i couldnt find it, if its still there then its certainly an option for your 5th legendary.

[Deleted]

Bumping up Doom by 5% per demon when you can have so many of them is also ludicrous

[Gaidax]

That and Doom, Doubled thing - that gonna hurt.

[Deleted]

That and Doom, Doubled thing - that gonna hurt.

yeah, should be able to reach as much as 5-600k crits, assuming 25kish spellpower, then comes the 40% dmg buff from the other legendary and potentially 50-60% extra doom dmg and doom could potentially crit for like 1,2 million, ofc you need the rng which wont happen often but when it does, on something like an iskar fight during the add phase and your dps will go over the the moon lol.

[Walterion]

New Alpha build comming up: Link to the official post.


Few interesting things:

Enslave demon being more useful, relaxed a lot of limitations (Cast speed/Atk Speed reduction and level cap)
A greatly improved version of Soul Leech is now baseline, in place of Fel Armor, and Demon Skin is a new talent in Soul Leech’s place that further enhances Soul Leech significantly. (To ALL Warlock specs)
We’ve added baseline interrupt duration reduction to several specializations. This includes Shadow Priests, Restoration Shamans, and all Warlocks. (EDIT: To clarify, this is a reduction to the duration of interrupts used ON them, not BY them.)


No datamining happening YET, but expect new stuff popping up soonish.

[Fearsom1992]

Im not getting my hopes up we have been disappointed a lot xD

[Deleted]

well, the only superior part of the new soul leech is that you can get it to 20% max hp, it stacks from all single target dmg you do and the new it lets you get 1% max hp as shield every 1 sec, so you would max it out after 20 secs, i dunno if i would call that greatly superior but it is superior none the less and will cement it as the go-to choice in that tier, helps with fel guard's survivability too i suppose.

[ShasVa]

well, the only superior part of the new soul leech is that you can get it to 20% max hp, it stacks from all single target dmg you do and the new it lets you get 1% max hp as shield every 1 sec, so you would max it out after 20 secs, i dunno if i would call that greatly superior but it is superior none the less.

Sounds like fun nonetheless. I'm definitely not abandoning my new Demolock main now.

[Drakile]

I hate to be that guy, but does it seem like the Aff and Destro artifacts have more artifact abilities tied into healing themselves more and overall higher survivability?
Obviously Alpha stuff will change blah blah blah BUT taking a quick look.

Demo- 30% more healing from Soul Link, 30 seconds off of Eternal Resolve, and Fel Skin which double Fel Armor effect below 35% health(Maybe that will effect the new Soul Leech)

Destro- 30% less damage after casting life tap for 6 seconds, 50% health heal whenever you use gateway, 45% chance of increased drain life heals, as well as 30 seconds off of resolve.

Aff- Healthstone full heals you as well as you getting healed whenever someone uses one of your healthstones, Drain life heal increase 30%, 10% damage reduction, and Corruption has a chance to restore 3% health on tick.

I'm not saying there is huge power differences but the Healthstone buff from Aff, and the Lifetap/Gateway talents for Destro outshine whatever Demo is currently bringing to the table in terms of durability. Also the new way they worded Soul Link looks like a nerf if it is basing the heal off of the absorption amount and not the original damage, though it could just be clarification with the Soul Leech change.

[Kirroth]

I hate to be that guy, but does it seem like the Aff and Destro artifacts have more artifact abilities tied into healing themselves more and overall higher survivability?

Well, it depends a lot on what further changes come down the line. The Destro artifact talents are very much incomplete, Demo's Fel Skin artifact talent is obviously going to need a revision, and Afflic being really good at self-heals is entirely in character (plus it's a very mana hungry spec that needs to Life Tap more). So we'll see where thing stand in another update or three.

It also depends on what situation you're talking about. Demonic Empowerment and Soul Link mean Demo will have amazing pet tanks for solo PvE work. Soul Link's passive 20% DR (don't overlook that) is also super useful in raids for taking the edge off that unavoidable raid damage. Now, PvP? Yeah, Demo's got less of the on-demand burst healing that PvP really wants. So it's probably not going to be the arena spec of choice. Can I live with that? Very likely.

[Duckz0rs]

well, the only superior part of the new soul leech is that you can get it to 20% max hp, it stacks from all single target dmg you do and the new it lets you get 1% max hp as shield every 1 sec, so you would max it out after 20 secs, i dunno if i would call that greatly superior but it is superior none the less and will cement it as the go-to choice in that tier, helps with fel guard's survivability too i suppose.

But that's with the talent. The talent increases it to 20%, baseline it's 15%. Effectively (unless I missed something) it went from passive +10% max hp to a max of 15% max hp based on damage done. The talent increases it to 20% and makes it recharge passively.
However, we've completely lost the +10% healing received aspect from the previous implementation of Fel Armor. Not sure how 5% max hp compares to +10% healing received, but on a glance it looks like the new version might be very marginally better than the previous version, not "vastly superior". Especially when you take into account that the +healing could've affected the healing from Soul Link.

Note: It might be the time of day, but I'm not fully understanding the wording on the change. Good chance I made some interpreting mistakes, so please correct me where I'm wrong!

[wooters]

Didn`t we kinda just lose the 10% healing based of the damage we do right now..?

Demonology
•Soul Link 20% of all damage you take is split with your demon pet. Soul Leech also heals you for 10% and your pet for 40% of the absorption granted. Warlock - Demonology Spec. 100 yd range.

before this it was: 20% of all damage you take is split with your demon pet. You are healed for 10% and your demon is healed for 40% of all damage you deal.



This change actually reduce our "tankyness" I believe.... and probably not improved as they stated

10% heal out of a 15% absorption is almost nothing. seems like demo maybe went from the strongest defensive spec(pve) to the weakest..in one build

[Esinar]

I'm puzzled by the Soul Leech/Fel Armour change tbh. At first I was like "oh that looks pretty cool"... but then I played with it a bit, read a bit more into it and saw what others were saying and I've come to realise that this would've been a great change if they didn't remove Fel Armour, but without it, the change just seems 'okay' rather than cool.

I think what I dislike the most is no longer having the 10% more health than other classes. THAT aspect of Fel Armour made Warlocks feel tougher than the other DPS classes... so them going for a 'tank-like' theme for warlocks and removing that extra health just seems a little counter-intuitive to me. Plus, Soul Leech on it's own isn't great, it's only with the Demon Armour talent it really becomes a 'tanky' ability, which is neither here nor there as we would've had both Fel Armour and Soul Leech for PvE in the previous builds anyway due to how the talents are set up. Plus Soul Leech can be purged in PvP so it won't really help survival there once people realise how it works. So yeah I'm not really understanding the logic behind the removal of Fel Armour. Was it really necessary to remove it?

What do others think of this change?

[Duckz0rs]

I'm puzzled by the Soul Leech change tbh. At first I was like "oh that looks pretty cool"... but then I played with it a bit, read a bit more into it and saw what others were saying and I've come to realise that it would've been great if they didn't remove Fel Armour, but without it, it just seems 'okay' rather than cool.

I think what I dislike the most is no longer having the 10% more health than other classes. THAT aspect of Fel Armour made Warlocks feel tougher than the other DPS classes... so them going for a 'tank-like' theme for warlocks and removing that extra health just seems a little counter-intuitive to me. Plus, Soul Leech on it's own isn't great, it's only with the Demon Armour talent it really becomes a 'tanky' ability, which is neither here nor there as we would've had both Fel Armour and Soul Leech for PvE in the previous builds anyway due to how the talents are set up. Plus Soul Leech can be purged in PvP so it won't really help survival there once people realise how it works. So yeah I'm not really understanding the logic behind the removal of Fel Armour.

What do others think of this change?

This is pure speculation on my end. I feel that it might be a marginal buff for Destruction and a marginal nerf for demo and affli. Like you said, our tankiness was higher baseline health and healing received. Especially with Soul Link for Demo and Affli's Drain Life a very large part of our tankiness is self-healing which is now cut by 10% across the board.

Soul Link also looks nerfed now that it does a percentage of a percentage of healing. 15% of damage becomes a shield and 10% of that 15% heals you. That's 1.5% of damage dealt as opposed to the 10% of damage dealt it was before.

As said, pure speculation, no real numbers, alpha is alpha and all those disclaimers, but on a gut-feeling I'd have to say it's a nerf unless we keep Fel Armor baseline as you said, otherwise a marginal buff that can be removed completely in PvP unlike what we had before. Mostly I'm just confused about what this actually achieves and hope someone can clear it up.

[Vayra]

From a PvP (mostly arena perspective), losing a bigger health pool further hurts our previous amazing synergy with Resto Shamans. I'm not sure I should be happy or sad about this.

Mostly I'm just confused about what this actually achieves and hope someone can clear it up.

It doesn't seem like this was directed towards Demo. Maybe it was more of a Affliction or more likely a Destro concern? Still weird.